Black and White imaging

kernowman2 · 28th of June 2006 (Wed)

Hi There,

Having had a formal training in photography, I spent much time shooting and processing black and white. Is there any way of reproducing the effect of filters (primarily orange and red with film) using digital and not including post processing?

regards

Kernowman

hudsonch · 28th of June 2006 (Wed)

Quote:

Originally Posted by kernowman2

Hi There,

Having had a formal training in photography, I spent much time shooting and processing black and white. Is there any way of reproducing the effect of filters (primarily orange and red with film) using digital and not including post processing?

Some DSLRs (e.g. Rebel XT) have this kind of "digital filter" effects.

chekone11 · 28th of June 2006 (Wed)

Quote:

Originally Posted by kernowman2

Hi There,

Having had a formal training in photography, I spent much time shooting and processing black and white. Is there any way of reproducing the effect of filters (primarily orange and red with film) using digital and not including post processing?

regards

Kernowman

Especially if you have a background in B&W photography, you will be disapointed with it's digital counterpart, primarily on the print end. I still shoot loads of B&W film, and loads of digital as well. I and many many others can assure you film is quite safe in this particular arena.

To answer your question more directly, yes there are in camera "filter modes" in some bodies (my 20d has them) that look quite similar to a red filter on B&W. You'll have to experiment to see if the quality is up to your formally trained eyes standards.

basroil · 28th of June 2006 (Wed)

you're best bet is to shoot raw and process it yourself. dpp has certain filters, photoshop has others, and if your life depends on raws, bibble has a few more. remember, digital is here because it's more convenient, not better quality than film.

MrsKitty · 28th of June 2006 (Wed)

Is it just me, or is it just not possible to get the same detail in the darker tones with digital?

Barb42 · 28th of June 2006 (Wed)

Try the 5D for detail. I don't have one but have seen the prints of others. Very nice! Its on my list to acquire. And BW is my favorite mode.

Netgarden · 28th of June 2006 (Wed)

Hi, I'm new here and just caught this post. I also love B/W and have had very good luck shooting in color, changing to greyscale, and then using the "Clarify" tool in PaintshopPro. A very quick and controllable process. The clarify does more than just change brightness/contrast. It really gives more dimension and shape. Easy, too.
Heres a link to some of my BWs, mainly taken with the canon 24-105IS [4 pages]
http://netgarden.smugmug.com/gallery/1453025

SeanH · 28th of June 2006 (Wed)

For 29 bucks try the Black & white plugin over at FM. Use it on a dup layer and work the opacity over a standard conversion.

Personally I also have great luck with the B&W / filter effects in my Mk2N.......also in the 30 & 5D

kernowman2 · 29th of June 2006 (Thu)

Thanks for all your replies everyone, i've just bought a 5D and it will be used in conjunction with photoshop. Guess its just going to be trial and error, but I won't hold my breath for results comparable with film. Weddings are my main source of income - England!

Thanks again,

Kevin

caldgrp · 29th of June 2006 (Thu)

What about this new Canon printer, PIXMA Pro9500 http://www.usa.canon.com/templatedat...O95009000.html

It has ten inks including photo black, matte black and gray. Canon is also releasing new "fine art papers".

Do you think that this kind of high end printer can bridge the quality gap between film and digital B/W?

By the way, I don't think this printer is available yet and have seen no price.

stupot · 29th of June 2006 (Thu)

i dont think the filters in camera are what the op is asking about - the ones in camera tone an image as opposed to increase contrast etc...

the only stuff you can do in camera with say a 350d.. is change the parameters (contrast/sharpness etc) but i wouldnt recommend shooting in black and white, its better to convert in photoshop or something similar.

if you were to do it in photoshop... convert a colour image using the channel mixer. click on monochrome, and then adjust the amount of 'colour' using the sliders - check the preview box and you can see whats happening on screen.

chtgrubbs · 30th of June 2006 (Fri)

Many great fine art B&W artists including Dan Burkholder and John Paul Caponigro have gone over to digital. Even David Vestal stated in his column in Photo Techniques magazine that he believes his inkjet prints exceed the quality of his darkroom prints. Digital offers controls over tonality and gamma that were just unimaginable to the most skillful Zone System users.

There are plug-ins available to mimic traditional monochrome filters, but by far the most versatile practice is to use the channel mixer in Photoshop. To increase shadow detail you can use the shadow/highlight adjustment, curves adjustment, or blend 2 exposures

SWPhotoImaging · 30th of June 2006 (Fri)

Quote:

Originally Posted by caldgrp

What about this new Canon printer, PIXMA Pro9500 http://www.usa.canon.com/templatedat...O95009000.html

It has ten inks including photo black, matte black and gray. Canon is also releasing new "fine art papers".

Do you think that this kind of high end printer can bridge the quality gap between film and digital B/W?

By the way, I don't think this printer is available yet and have seen no price.

Check out this new Canon printer. Yes, they have eclipsed chemical photo printing in both image and longevity.
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/re...-ipf5000.shtml

28th of June 2006 (Wed)	#1
kernowman2 Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 2	Black and White imaging Hi There, Having had a formal training in photography, I spent much time shooting and processing black and white. Is there any way of reproducing the effect of filters (primarily orange and red with film) using digital and not including post processing? regards Kernowman

28th of June 2006 (Wed)	#4
basroil Cream of the Crop Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: STL/Clayton, MO\| NJ Posts: 8,015	Re: Black and White imaging you're best bet is to shoot raw and process it yourself. dpp has certain filters, photoshop has others, and if your life depends on raws, bibble has a few more. remember, digital is here because it's more convenient, not better quality than film. __________________ I don't hate macs or OSX, I hate people and statements that portray them as better than anything else. Macs are A solution, not THE solution. Get a good desktop i7 with Windows 7 and come tell me that sucks for photo or video editing. Gear List

28th of June 2006 (Wed)	#5
MrsKitty Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 1,192 IMAGE EDITING OK	Re: Black and White imaging Is it just me, or is it just not possible to get the same detail in the darker tones with digital?

28th of June 2006 (Wed)	#6
Barb42 Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Minnesota Posts: 775	Re: Black and White imaging Try the 5D for detail. I don't have one but have seen the prints of others. Very nice! Its on my list to acquire. And BW is my favorite mode. __________________ http://www.barbsmithphotography.com

28th of June 2006 (Wed)	#7
Netgarden Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: orange county Posts: 53	Re: Black and White imaging Hi, I'm new here and just caught this post. I also love B/W and have had very good luck shooting in color, changing to greyscale, and then using the "Clarify" tool in PaintshopPro. A very quick and controllable process. The clarify does more than just change brightness/contrast. It really gives more dimension and shape. Easy, too. Heres a link to some of my BWs, mainly taken with the canon 24-105IS [4 pages] http://netgarden.smugmug.com/gallery/1453025

28th of June 2006 (Wed)	#8
SeanH Goldmember Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: San Diego, CA. Posts: 2,036 IMAGE EDITING OK	Re: Black and White imaging For 29 bucks try the Black & white plugin over at FM. Use it on a dup layer and work the opacity over a standard conversion. Personally I also have great luck with the B&W / filter effects in my Mk2N.......also in the 30 & 5D __________________ 7D ......waiting on the 5D3 10-22, 17-40 4.0 L, 24-70 2.8L, 70-200 2.8L, 2 X 580EX's

29th of June 2006 (Thu)	#9
kernowman2 Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 2	Re: Black and White imaging Thanks for all your replies everyone, i've just bought a 5D and it will be used in conjunction with photoshop. Guess its just going to be trial and error, but I won't hold my breath for results comparable with film. Weddings are my main source of income - England! Thanks again, Kevin

29th of June 2006 (Thu)	#10
caldgrp Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 44	Re: Black and White imaging What about this new Canon printer, PIXMA Pro9500 http://www.usa.canon.com/templatedat...O95009000.html It has ten inks including photo black, matte black and gray. Canon is also releasing new "fine art papers". Do you think that this kind of high end printer can bridge the quality gap between film and digital B/W? By the way, I don't think this printer is available yet and have seen no price.

29th of June 2006 (Thu)	#11
stupot Goldmember Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: UK, Portsmouth Uni / HW Bucks Posts: 2,227 IMAGE EDITING OK	Re: Black and White imaging i dont think the filters in camera are what the op is asking about - the ones in camera tone an image as opposed to increase contrast etc... the only stuff you can do in camera with say a 350d.. is change the parameters (contrast/sharpness etc) but i wouldnt recommend shooting in black and white, its better to convert in photoshop or something similar. if you were to do it in photoshop... convert a colour image using the channel mixer. click on monochrome, and then adjust the amount of 'colour' using the sliders - check the preview box and you can see whats happening on screen. __________________ Canon EOS 350D, Sigma 10-20 f4-5.6, 24-105 f4L IS, 70-200 f4L, 300 f4L IS, Kenko 1.4x pro300, 430EX, Apple Powerbook G4 Free filters for your flashgun!

30th of June 2006 (Fri)	#12
chtgrubbs Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 1,667	Re: Black and White imaging Many great fine art B&W artists including Dan Burkholder and John Paul Caponigro have gone over to digital. Even David Vestal stated in his column in Photo Techniques magazine that he believes his inkjet prints exceed the quality of his darkroom prints. Digital offers controls over tonality and gamma that were just unimaginable to the most skillful Zone System users. There are plug-ins available to mimic traditional monochrome filters, but by far the most versatile practice is to use the channel mixer in Photoshop. To increase shadow detail you can use the shadow/highlight adjustment, curves adjustment, or blend 2 exposures

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