Outdoor flash, how to get saturated properly exposed sky?

[sweetypie925]

Hi, I'm just starting into flash and using manual mode. I've come aross some amazing images here and on some other sites that have these amazing saturated skys and use flash outdoors. I read on another site that you use the flash off camera and meter the sky. I'm stil confused. Can anyone expalin it to be in "stupid" terms for someone that is new to this? I have a 430ex and 580ex but no way to get them both off camera. Please help.

[ueb0258]

You can do it with the flash on camera. You have to set the flash for hi-speed sync and then point the camera at the sky and get a meter reading. You can then either lock the exposure and recompose or you can set the camera to manual and set the settings that you got when you metered for the sky. Recompose on the subject and take the picture. It will expose the sky properly and the flash will fill in your subject making them expose properly. I hope that is clear enough.

[Curtis N]

Originally Posted by ueb0258

You can do it with the flash on camera. You have to set the flash for hi-speed sync ...

You don't need high speed sync.

There are several ways to do it but here is the easiest:
With the camera in manual mode, set your ISO at 100, shutter speed at 1/250 (1/200 for the Rebel models).
Aim at the sky and adjust the aperture until the needle in the viewfinder is centered. This will give you a deep blue sky.

With the flash in E-TTL mode, set your FEC at 0 and shoot.

[sweetypie925]

Great! Thanks so much Curtis! Just what I needed, quick and relatively easy. Will have to try it tomorrow.

[ueb0258]

Curtis, I didnt even think about doing it that way. With the flash models he posted made me think of the hi-speed sync. Great advice. I guess at this point it is about how much DOF you want sweetypie.

[ItsMike]

That is how I do it. But I usually FEC -1. See below!

[pcunite]

Originally Posted by Curtis N

You don't need high speed sync.

There are several ways to do it but here is the easiest:
With the camera in manual mode, set your ISO at 100, shutter speed at 1/250 (1/200 for the Rebel models).
Aim at the sky and adjust the aperture until the needle in the viewfinder is centered.

Great advice. You can also use a ND filter on the lens to get the aperture to something that allows more bokeh as typically your going to be over f8.

[Curtis N]

Originally Posted by pcunite

You can also use a ND filter on the lens...

And if blue sky is what you're going for, a polarizer works great, too!

[subtle_spectre]

Originally Posted by Curtis N

You don't need high speed sync.

There are several ways to do it but here is the easiest:
With the camera in manual mode, set your ISO at 100, shutter speed at 1/250 (1/200 for the Rebel models).
Aim at the sky and adjust the aperture until the needle in the viewfinder is centered. This will give you a deep blue sky.

With the flash in E-TTL mode, set your FEC at 0 and shoot.

Unless...the subject is backlit and the sun or part of it is in the picture. It is hard to find a flash that will illuminate the subject in such circumstances when the ISO is 100, TV 250 and AV 16 or higher!

[Curtis N]

Originally Posted by subtle_spectre

It is hard to find a flash that will illuminate the subject in such circumstances when the ISO is 100, TV 250 and AV 16 or higher!

The 580EX (GN=190 ft.) will illuminate a subject at f/16, about 12 feet away.
190/16=11.9

At f/22 the distance drops to about 8 1/2 feet.
190/22=8.6

Using high speed sync will cut those distances in half.

[Kilikanzer]

Reading from the Northern sky is usually as good as reading a gray card, the Southern sky is about one stop brighter.

[ed.]

Branching off from the OP's question.
What if you had an off camera flash that does not support E-TTL? Set it to Auto mode?
Or this is when a lightmeter comes in?

[Curtis N]

Originally Posted by ed.

What if you had an off camera flash that does not support E-TTL? Set it to Auto mode?
Or this is when a lightmeter comes in?

A light meter that measures both ambient and flash would certainly help.

Old fashioned auto flashes can be used off-camera, outdoors, but it's tricky. The flash unit's sensor needs to be carefully aimed at the subject or something else at a similar distance that will bounce the light back. If the sensor is pointing at a distant background, overexposure will result.

[ed.]

Originally Posted by Curtis N

A light meter that measures both ambient and flash would certainly help.

Old fashioned auto flashes can be used off-camera, outdoors, but it's tricky. The flash unit's sensor needs to be carefully aimed at the subject or something else at a similar distance that will bounce the light back. If the sensor is pointing at a distant background, overexposure will result.

Thanks Curtis, so need to have the flash close enough to the object/model that the flash sensor meters correctly?

Time to save up for a Sekonic or similar

[bieber]

Originally Posted by ed.

Branching off from the OP's question.
What if you had an off camera flash that does not support E-TTL? Set it to Auto mode?
Or this is when a lightmeter comes in?

I just set max flash sync speed and ISO 100, set up my light, and chimp out an aperture value. If I want the flash to be brighter or darker, I'll usually do it by moving it back and forth, as I tend to default to around 1/2 power, and I hate going all the way up to full (wayyy too long recycles). Once I have proper exposure, preferably with the sky underexposed a little at this point, I just set my shutter speed wherever I want it to get the desired effect; I may just properly expose it, maybe blow the background out a little, but my favorite tends to be slightly underexposing, especially when you have nice cloud formations and you want to preserve saturation. Here's a couple examples: the first one took me maybe five minutes to make, and the second was more like 15, but I was in the shot, which made it more difficult. Both were made with just one flash and no light meter.