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FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre General Photography Talk
Thread started 22 Aug 2008 (Friday) 10:16
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Go-Karting tips (outdoor)

 
Road_Rebel
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UK, SE, Reading, Berkshire
Aug 22, 2008 10:16 |  #1

I did a search on shooting shots of karts outdoors and i didn't get anything.

Hey everyone!

Tomorrow i am going to my local kart track to hopefuly, get on to the track and take some pictures :D

I would like to know if anyone follows some sort of groundrules when taking pictures of motorsport.

The kit i got to work with is in my signature.

I would say my panning technique is alright, one of the main reasons for going tomorrow is to work on panning.

Is there anything I could practice at the track where i couldn't anywhere else, please let me know.

And what do I do if someone approaches me about wanting one of my photo's? should i just give it to him for free or if i wanted to charge him, how would I go about it....

There are many questions that I would love to ask but these are the ones that burn most in my mind.

Thanks for taking the time to read my post.

And it is VERY much appriciated if u can write a post to help me out.


Once again, Thanks :p


Favourite loadout currently: Canon 7D mkI + 50mm f/1.4
Next desired loadout: Canon 5D mkII + 85mm f/1.2
Side Arm: 17-55mm f/2.8
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Chip ­ Andrews
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Aug 22, 2008 10:27 |  #2

Take a look at my website. I take pictures for a local track every Saturday. What I like to do is try & get different angles thru out the night. That way all the pictures are not the same. You might want to check out the company I deal with www.orderpicture.comexternal link. It's free & you could upload your pictures there & give people the site to good look at them. Also they are protected there so they can't right click & copy. Sales are OK from mine. Mainly they like to go to my site each week & see the pictures.


Canon 50D ~ Canon 40D
Canon 70-200 f/2.8 IS ~ Canon 50 f/1.8 ~ Sigma 24-60 f/2.8 ~ Canon 430ex :rolleyes:
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Road_Rebel
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Aug 22, 2008 10:42 |  #3

OH i got another question.

would an image stabilising lens be worth the money for this type of thing?

thank you for your comment chip


Favourite loadout currently: Canon 7D mkI + 50mm f/1.4
Next desired loadout: Canon 5D mkII + 85mm f/1.2
Side Arm: 17-55mm f/2.8
What can you capture with the click of a button?

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Chip ­ Andrews
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Waterloo, NY
Aug 22, 2008 10:52 |  #4

Road_Rebel wrote in post #6156390external link
OH i got another question.

would an image stabilising lens be worth the money for this type of thing?

thank you for your comment chip

It might help at night but I don't have one so I'm not sure. I think I have done OK without it. You really don't need it for the panning shots.


Canon 50D ~ Canon 40D
Canon 70-200 f/2.8 IS ~ Canon 50 f/1.8 ~ Sigma 24-60 f/2.8 ~ Canon 430ex :rolleyes:
www.cafotos.comexternal link
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BradM
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Aug 22, 2008 11:01 as a reply to Chip Andrews's post |  #5

Panning with karts is lot like panning with boats, because of the lack of suspension you can get some nice background look BUT because of the vertical movement of the vehicle you can get shots that you may not be as pleased with as you might in other motorsports.

It is sometimes better to shoot a bit higher shutter speed than you might do normally for this kinds of vehicles to mitigate this vertical motion and the resultant softness. It can pay off to look to find the smoothest part of track to grab some panning shots.

I am shooting karts and super moto this weekend but they aren't running on a track rather they are racing on city streets made up of 30 plus year old concrete paneled roadway along with a portion of the course recently repaved with asphalt. My panning shots will be coming from that portion of the course.

Remember to shoot low, a point of view from no higher than the drivers head makes a shot much more appealing and try to expose to pull the eyes out of the helmet.

As to sales, last year I passed something like 150 cards out to the racers and family members. In most cases I was approached by them to know if I had shots of a particular kart or bike, I handed them a card and advised them I would have the shots on my site by the day following and if they wanted a print or download an image to review them and contact me. I sold about $1,200 in the week or so following.

The tough part was sorting down a hundred or so bikes and karts into seperate folders making it easier for the clients to find the shots they were interested in but it certainly pays off instead of them having to muddle through the 1500 or so images I end up shooting in the multiple classes and days.

More money can certainly be made by being able to download and print on site but that requires multiple co-ordinated individuals, informed racers that these are available, the equipment and usually getting and paying for vendor space. I actually just go to shot for fun and watch the racing the money part is really secondary to me. But to bring in an extra couple bucks is worth the extra work in the evenings, but with the gf's b-day this weekend I may be less apt to spend the time I have in the past.

My usually choice of equipment is the 40D with the 70-200 f/2.8 and the 30D with the 24-105 f/4 for panning shots because I am usually stopped down anyway.

Hope this helps, have fun!

Here is a couple of the shots I got last year, a few more can be found in the motorsports folder on my zenfolio, link below.

In the first shot you can see her eyes are sharp but the kart is soft because of the kart bouncing through a rough spot.

IMAGE: http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y259/Bradklr/kart40crop.jpg

This image is the inverse of the one above, in panning a nice effect and the kart is sharp but the driver is bouncing because of the lack of suspension so he is soft.

IMAGE: http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y259/Bradklr/kart114.jpg

IMAGE: http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y259/Bradklr/kart43.jpg

IMAGE: http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y259/Bradklr/kart192.jpg

Shaking like a hypertensive squirrel on meth? Buy IS, cheaper than detox & it works.

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BradM
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Aug 22, 2008 11:06 |  #6

Chip Andrews wrote in post #6156457external link
It might help at night but I don't have one so I'm not sure. I think I have done OK without it. You really don't need it for the panning shots.

Actually IS can help if it can be set to a panning mode AND you very close to the track AND where you are panning extremely fast to stay with the subject, it will help mitigate some of movement on your part but otherwise it really doesn't offer a benefit, the same goes for any night time shot. IS will assist in keeping your camera still but not help with a moving subject in low light sharp or crisp.


Shaking like a hypertensive squirrel on meth? Buy IS, cheaper than detox & it works.

www.bradmanchas.zenfol​io.comexternal link
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Road_Rebel
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Aug 22, 2008 18:02 |  #7

Chip Andrews wrote in post #6156285external link
www.orderpicture.comexternal link

is there any english versions of this type of site?

Thank you for all the advice given, it will be great help for 2moz


Favourite loadout currently: Canon 7D mkI + 50mm f/1.4
Next desired loadout: Canon 5D mkII + 85mm f/1.2
Side Arm: 17-55mm f/2.8
What can you capture with the click of a button?

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Road_Rebel
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Aug 24, 2008 06:48 |  #8

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthre​ad.php?t=557854

heres how i got on


Favourite loadout currently: Canon 7D mkI + 50mm f/1.4
Next desired loadout: Canon 5D mkII + 85mm f/1.2
Side Arm: 17-55mm f/2.8
What can you capture with the click of a button?

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Revhard191
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Joined Aug 2008
Downey, California
Nov 02, 2008 13:18 as a reply to Road_Rebel's post |  #9

Here are a few of my pics, a little soft on some of the focus, but over all happy with the results for what it is:
Shot with Canon XTi W/ 70-200mm F4 "L" W/ 1.4X Teleconverter - setting at ISO-400 | 1/100 sec | F/36.0| Focal Length 257mm

IMAGE NOT FOUND IMAGE IS A REDIRECT OR MISSING!
HTTP response: 404 | MIME changed to 'image/png' | Byte size: ZERO


IMAGE NOT FOUND IMAGE IS A REDIRECT OR MISSING!
HTTP response: 404 | MIME changed to 'image/png' | Byte size: ZERO


IMAGE NOT FOUND IMAGE IS A REDIRECT OR MISSING!
HTTP response: 404 | MIME changed to 'image/png' | Byte size: ZERO


Please feel free to comment and I appreciate constructive criticism to help me get better.

Cheers,

Angel
AKA - Revhard191

Canon 1D Mark IIn | Xti (400D) Gripped | Canon 70-200mm F4 "L" Non-IS | Nifty-Fifty 1.8 | Lens Baby | Canon 580EX ii | Wish list: Canon 300mm 2.8 IS | My Other Hobby: http://www.youtube.com​/watch?v=hag1FsXmq10external link

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tonylong
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Nov 02, 2008 16:40 |  #10

It looks like 1/100" is a good setting for that sport -- very nice background blur! Very nice for your first attempts!

I'd suggest opening up the aperture a tad to get a bit more light (and a bit more sharpness -- f/36 is really pushing it diffraction-wise).

Aside from that, panning at low shutter speeds is a skill that just needs practice -- consistent practice to get the best results. I love it when I can zoom in 100% on a panned vehicle and things like lettering on the vehicle are sharp! But you don't get those nearly as often as you'd like:)!

Like I said, nice results for a first try!


Tony
Two Canon cameras (5DC, 30D), three Canon lenses (24-105, 100-400, 100mm macro)
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BradM
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Centralia, WA
Nov 02, 2008 16:42 as a reply to Revhard191's post |  #11

Shots aren't bad but you should have taken the ISO down so you wouldn't have to have been shooting at f/36.

The reason isn't a dof issue but a diffraction issue, using a f/ stop above roughly f/16 with any lens (in digital or 35mm) will introduce softness that can't be corrected.

It is physical property that results of trying to get light through a small aperture and some of image softness is certainly a result of this.


Shaking like a hypertensive squirrel on meth? Buy IS, cheaper than detox & it works.

www.bradmanchas.zenfol​io.comexternal link
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Revhard191
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92 posts
Joined Aug 2008
Downey, California
Nov 02, 2008 21:08 as a reply to BradM's post |  #12

Thanks guys for the info, I was just trying different settings on my camera and didn't notice that I was up that high. I was talking to the local photographer at our track and he was telling me that he recommends for me to shoot at ISO 400 and start from 1/250 until I start hitting decent shots and then work down from there. I thought I was doing alright until I got home to downloaded all my pics and some of them were just okay, nothing fabulous, but I am working on the technique and still playing around with the different settings on my camera.

Someone told me to drop it all the way down to F4 and ISO at 100 and try working with that. Next time I am out, I will be trying these settings to see how I fair. What do you all recommend?

Thanks for your time and sorry for hacking this thread.

Cheers!


Canon 1D Mark IIn | Xti (400D) Gripped | Canon 70-200mm F4 "L" Non-IS | Nifty-Fifty 1.8 | Lens Baby | Canon 580EX ii | Wish list: Canon 300mm 2.8 IS | My Other Hobby: http://www.youtube.com​/watch?v=hag1FsXmq10external link

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tonylong
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Nov 02, 2008 23:38 |  #13

I'd say not f/4 unless you have really low light. You actually use a low ISO and a narrow aperture to help you get a low shutter speed. In decent light ISO 100 and f/8 or f/11 would be "starting points" --either in Manual or in Tv, set your shutter speed then adjust for a reasonably narrow aperture (to keep all the vehicle in the depth of field) and adjust your ISO to balance out your exposure.

Starting at 1/250 is a good starting point, as you get "into the swing" of panning -- at first you might be hesitant, jerky, whatever, and then you start to get into the flow of things. At that point, lower the speed, say to 1/125, depending on how fast/slow the vehicles are going, and do it some more.

Fast vehicles can get good results at higher shutter speeds. It also depends on how close you are and the angle you're shooting at. Experience rules with this stuff!


Tony
Two Canon cameras (5DC, 30D), three Canon lenses (24-105, 100-400, 100mm macro)
Tony Long Photos on PBaseexternal link
Wildlife project pics hereexternal link, Biking Photog shoots hereexternal link, "Suburbia" project hereexternal link! Mount St. Helens, Mount Hood pics hereexternal link

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Revhard191
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Downey, California
Nov 03, 2008 00:15 as a reply to tonylong's post |  #14

Thanks Tony, it looks as though I will be going out to the track next weekend as a few of us are going out for some testing, at that same time, I am taking my camera to snap some pics of them on the track, more practice the better I will get. I am actually going to be selling my XTi in efforts to help fund my new Canon 50D or the 40D, still not sure which I am going to go with yet, but it will be one or the other. I like the balance with my 70-200mm F4, it seems to be a little better balanced then my XTi with the same lens.

I am reading more and more on this site and it is full of very good info and recommendations and some great people giving out some good advice and hinters.

I will post more when I get back next weekend.

Cheers


Canon 1D Mark IIn | Xti (400D) Gripped | Canon 70-200mm F4 "L" Non-IS | Nifty-Fifty 1.8 | Lens Baby | Canon 580EX ii | Wish list: Canon 300mm 2.8 IS | My Other Hobby: http://www.youtube.com​/watch?v=hag1FsXmq10external link

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Paulos75
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Tauranga - New Zealand
Nov 07, 2008 04:07 |  #15

I've had a look a few other threads but can't seem to find too much advice on filters, specificly for go-karting. There's going to be some street racing in town this weekend and the weather is supposed to be sunny.

Would it be advisable to use a filter and what sort? (Other than for protecting the front element of the lens.

Cheers,
Paul


Cheers, Paul.
If it moves, shoot it. If it shoots back, get a bigger lens.
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