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FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre General Photography Talk 
Thread started 22 Sep 2010 (Wednesday) 07:40
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odd ken rockwell article about DR and shadows

 
dontcallmeash
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Sep 22, 2010 07:40 |  #1

http://www.kenrockwell​.com/fuji/s5/dynamic-range.htm (external link)

i was flipping through this article as to discourage buying a cheap s5 pro a friend is unloading and stumbled upon his rather interesting quip about lower end DSLRs.

and i quote:

"The D40 looks best because it's designed for snapshooters and aims for the shadows in crappy light, and its default automatic contrast control increases its dynamic range automatically.

The D200 also lowers its contrast automatically (increasing dynamic range) to attempt to accommodate crappy light like this. The D200's meter presumes you're a better photographer than this and, expecting you're doing this deliberately, gives less exposure to aim for a more balanced exposure between highlight and shadow."

i'm wondering if this "feature" is in the metering in all entry-level DSLRs as i am finding my 1000D high contrast low/bright images to always be brighter in the shadows with blown highlights when i attempt to recreate this...

in other words are there more safety nets like this you cannot disable on an entry level DSLR that get in the way of shooting.




  
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gjl711
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Sep 22, 2010 07:47 |  #2

I'm guess KR is talking out of that orifice a few feet below his head. Sound like complete cr*p to me. I've done some side by side testing of xxxD and xxD bodies and other than the inherent differences between bodies, they were pretty close. Maybe what he is describing is the effect of the default jpeg post processing.

But to disable any feature, just shoot raw. You will get the raw data of the sensor before any in camera jpeg post processing occurs.


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dontcallmeash
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Sep 22, 2010 07:54 |  #3

gjl711 wrote in post #10955365 (external link)
I'm guess KR is talking out of that orifice a few feet below his head. Sound like complete cr*p to me. I've done some side by side testing of xxxD and xxD bodies and other than the inherent differences between bodies, they were pretty close. Maybe what he is describing is the effect of the default jpeg post processing.

But to disable any feature, just shoot raw. You will get the raw data of the sensor before any in camera jpeg post processing occurs.

figures. inherent differences are more likely due to different metering systems between bodies, since i always shoot RAW. the idea that there's software in Tv, Av, M, and P to make entry level DSLRs "idiot proof" seems dumb.




  
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sandpiper
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Sep 22, 2010 08:21 as a reply to  @ dontcallmeash's post |  #4

Even Ken Rockwell himself states, on his website, that he sometimes makes things up if it sounds good, or makes for better entertainment, sometimes just talks complete bull**** and you should take anything he writes with a healthy pinch of salt.

So why are you surprised at odd statements? Those are his normal way of writing, he just writes complete bo**ocks.




  
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bjyoder
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Sep 22, 2010 08:21 |  #5

dontcallmeash wrote in post #10955394 (external link)
figures. inherent differences are more likely due to different metering systems between bodies, since i always shoot RAW. the idea that there's software in Tv, Av, M, and P to make entry level DSLRs "idiot proof" seems dumb.

It's not all that dumb, actually. Those who would be buying those entry level cameras are the ones who will normally tell the most people if they aren't happy with the pictures they get. It goes back to the old thought that if you make one customer happy, they'll tell one other person; if you make one person unhappy, they'll tell seven other people. Putting some safeguards to try and help people get (technically) better looking images is probably a decent business move. (That said, I have no knowledge that this is happening with any camera company. It's just mainly food for thought. ;))

And anyway, you can still get around all that through shooting RAW, like mentioned above.


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Mike ­ Deep
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Sep 22, 2010 10:37 |  #6

Dear everyone on the internet,

Please stop taking Ken Rockwell seriously. We've been over this.


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tonylong
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Sep 22, 2010 16:53 |  #7

As far as the original question, I've heard that Nikon bodies got a bit of a head start in some fancy in-camera things that are kind of like how Canon has Highlight Tone Priority and whatever the bit of auto toning that they feature in the newer cameras. So you could be referring to something like that.

But for Raw shooters, those things may or may not play a part in your Raw processing. I have taken a few test shots using Highlight Tone Priority and, yes, Lightroom does "apply" HTP (although I've heard that it is not part of the Raw data but more a flag that Lightroom "reads", but I haven't seen rock-solid confirmation of this). But the newer controls I don't know because I don't have a body that features them.

And, a Raw shooter has an advantage -- any of these tonal features can be done in Raw and often more effectively if you are just careful in your shooting approach. For example, if you practice ETTR/HAMSTTR, then you can get the best of both worlds -- you carefully protect your highlights but give enough exposure to push them to the edge, then you can pull things back in post processing and the shadows will be cleaner. Or, you can duplicate Highlight Tone Priority if you wish by lowering the ISO by a stop so that the highlights are preserved but the overall scene is underexposed and you will then boost the shadows and midtones, but you may get more noise that way than if you use a straightforward ETTR/HAMSTTR approach.

But for jpeg shooters, well, one can be happy with whatever one gets, as long as the camera is doing an effective job.


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AngryCorgi
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Sep 23, 2010 13:18 |  #8

Go figure...the word "odd" and "Ken Rockwell" used in the same sentence.


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argyle
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Sep 23, 2010 17:34 as a reply to  @ AngryCorgi's post |  #9

Turning into just another "slam Rockwell" thread, albeit through the backdoor. Y'all should give the whole Rockwell thing a rest, already.


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Stealthy ­ Ninja
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Nov 23, 2010 03:13 |  #10
bannedPermanent ban

Whatever he said, he's right.




  
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itzcryptic
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Nov 23, 2010 08:27 |  #11

argyle wrote in post #10965951 (external link)
Turning into just another "slam Rockwell" thread, albeit through the backdoor. Y'all should give the whole Rockwell thing a rest, already.

So, if someone has a question about something they said, they shouldn't ask it? That seems a bit fascist.




  
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tonylong
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Nov 23, 2010 08:38 |  #12

Stealthy Ninja wrote in post #11331478 (external link)
Whatever he said, he's right.

You had to go there, didn't you SN:)?


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Nov 23, 2010 10:33 |  #13

dontcallmeash wrote in post #10955342 (external link)
. (external link) . . The D200's meter presumes you're a better photographer than this and . . .

A camera (or a meter) "presumes" ?? I thought that was a function of intelligent thought or contemplation? Or does Nikon now include "artificial intelligence" in their firmware . . . ??


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Todd ­ Lambert
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Nov 23, 2010 10:38 |  #14

Again, the first rule of the Ken Rockwell Club is:

You don't talk about Ken Rockwell.

The second rule is:

You don't talk about Ken Rockwell.

;-)a




  
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chauncey
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Nov 23, 2010 12:07 as a reply to  @ Todd Lambert's post |  #15

Aah...who is Ken Rockwell?


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odd ken rockwell article about DR and shadows
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