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Thread started 28 Dec 2010 (Tuesday) 10:48
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If prime lenses can in fact spur creativity...

 
bohdank
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Dec 28, 2010 19:15 |  #61

airfrogusmc wrote in post #11530850 (external link)
Heres another couple that are more recent but that project and the visual discipline stayed with me for these.

I actually had someone tell me that i should crop out the sign on the right and the signs in the background:rolleyes:
QUOTED IMAGE

You're kidding ? One of them, perhaps :-)


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jetcode
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Dec 28, 2010 19:24 |  #62
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Someone mentioned something about limitation not being an effective tool or worth considering. In music the first thing a composer faces is an overwhelming number of choices concerning meter, rhythmic measure, note choices, key, progression, timbre, orchestration, and likely more information that anyone can assimilate at one instance. One of the key tools of the composer is limitation. Starting with fundamental building blocks and adding the decorative aspects as the piece progresses. There is a correlation between creating a score and creating a visual masterpiece.




  
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airfrogusmc
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Dec 28, 2010 19:26 |  #63

bohdank wrote in post #11531063 (external link)
You're kidding ? One of them, perhaps :-)

No its true. I couldn't believe how it all came together when I pushed the shutter. I waited for the guy with the sign to turn because you couldn't read it and once he did turn I couldn't believe the luck that I had with the signs in the background also, the dead end because as we all know arguing religion and politics is, the up and down heaven and hell reference and the do not enter, its well advised not to. Oh well, sometimes the elements just all line up.




  
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jakeg1999
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Dec 28, 2010 19:27 |  #64

This is a great thread. I myself love bokeh that is when I use it properly. I also love including the background. Although I love my primes and fast apertures, I always make it a point to shoot up to f11 on most my shoots. I definintely have a long way to go, and am starting to work a lot more with controlling light. It's not comfortable for me at all, and I often get frustrated, but I am working through it. Creativity for me is when I don't have to crop or alter a shot at all, and I am very pleased with it. That's the result I like. My clients on the other hand may see my creativity differently, so it's my job to provide them what they like.


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JeffreyG
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Dec 28, 2010 19:31 |  #65

airfrogusmc wrote in post #11531130 (external link)
No its true. I couldn't believe how it all came together when I pushed the shutter. I waited for the guy with the sign to turn because you couldn't read it and once he did turn I couldn't believe the luck that I had with the signs in the background also, the dead end because as we all know arguing religion and politics is, the up and down heaven and hell reference and the do not enter, its well advised not to. Oh well, sometimes the elements just all line up.

One thing I like about this thread is that I pushed you to post these shots Allen. You usually post stuff from your commercial event shoots which is very different than this PJ material.


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denoir
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Dec 28, 2010 19:32 |  #66

JeffreyG wrote in post #11530437 (external link)
But I want to be more creative. That's my problem.

I spent long years in the wilderness of 'magic box' photography with 35mm film and digital P&S. I picked up a digital SLR some four years ago or so and I started to really learn the details.

I'm an engineer, and the technical aspects of photography were pretty easy for me to understand. I understand perspective, DOF, inverse square laws, color temperature, triggering remote flashes, flash modification and the effects of size and distance.

But what is always before me as a challenge is being more creative and haivng a better eye. That's what I was thinking about when I started this thread. Those two portraits in the first post by me are just a part of what I mean - they are just boring, too tight portraits with DOF so thin the subjects could be anywhere.

You'll have to find what motivates you but I can tell you my story and how gear radically changed my approach to photography.

I've always been semi-interested in photography but I only took it up as a serious hobby early this year. I had for years a 350D with a super zoom and no particular ambitions. Last year I got a 7D in order to shoot video with it. It was fun and the quality was superb. I bought a pile of video gear and made a bunch of short films (http://vimeo.com/luka/​videos (external link)). In January I decided that I should learn a bit about the lenses I had bought (a modest collection of mid range Canon and Sigma primes) by going out and doing some regular photography. I was amazed at the 7D's performance as a still camera and I realized that I could enjoy photography much more than cinematography. The latter is really not easy as a one man show due to the excessive amount of gear one has to carry.

So a second gear frenzy ensued. I bought L primes & zooms with the enthusiasm of an alcoholic finding a bar on a deserted island. I took a trip to South Africa and went on a safari and used that as an excuse to buy more gear, including a 5DII and the then new 70-200/II. That lens together with the 7D is an unbeatable combo. I was machine gunning away at an incredible rate. And sure, it paid off. I got some really nice wild life shots. This type:


IMAGE: http://peltarion.eu/img/70200II/70200II-26.jpg

IMAGE: http://peltarion.eu/img/70200II/70200II-28.jpg

IMAGE: http://peltarion.eu/img/70200II/70200II-29.jpg

IMAGE: http://peltarion.eu/img/70200II/70200II-30.jpg

At one point I realized though that while I was enjoying the photography itself that I did not really like my own photos and that my approach was really flawed. I was firing away in burst mode, without thinking. My image library was suffocating under piles of near-identical images. Sifting through them took forever.

This coincided with being very displeased with the soft corners of the 16-35 which had ruined a couple of landscape shots. So I bought a Zeiss 21/2.8 Distagon. This was the serious turning point for me. After a time getting to know the lens, I fell in love with it. The rendering was magnificent. Much more important though was that it is a manual focus lens, so as I took time to focus I also took time to compose the image. This made a massive difference in the quality of the output. I took it one step further and started using live view for exact composition and started using a tripod. After the 21 Distagon, I got five or six more Zeiss ZE lenses and a couple of other manual focus lenses. I used a tripod, live view and became very concerned with getting a good composition.

I've done my best photography that way and it's still what I know best.

The only thing that bothered me was the size and bulk of the equipment. I got a Leica X1 to use as a P&S but was disappointed by it. Its slow AF made it practically unusable. Still looking for a more compact system I got the Leica M9 a couple of months ago. I don't know if you've ever used a rangefinder camera, but it's a primitive mechanical device that has not changed at all in the last 50 years. You don't look through the lens but through a fixed piece of glass that has framelines that approximately indicate the framing. The M9 is a full frame digital range finder but it's in essence not much different from a 1940's Leica but with a digital back. The sensor is superb, probably the best on the market but it is in terms of the rest of the electronics exceptionally primitive. No live view, horrible low-resolution screen. It's painfully slow. No real 100% preview etc

In short you are not much better off than with a classic film camera. It's all up to you. Back to basics of photography so to say. The main benefit is the superb image quality and the very compact size. Despite it's shortcomings, it's a real joy to use and my photography has changed once more due to gear. A 5DII + Zeiss glass on a tripod is excellent, but it kills off spontaneous photography. With the M9 I've rediscovered the joy of just walking around and taking pictures of interesting stuff. No tripod set up and a camera bag that weighs less than one of my larger Canon lenses.

I started taking photos like these - essentially snapshots of stuff I found visually interesting:

IMAGE: http://peltarion.eu/img/m9/zm50-4.jpg

IMAGE: http://peltarion.eu/img/m9/cron75-4.jpg

IMAGE: http://peltarion.eu/img/m9/zm18-15.jpg

IMAGE: http://peltarion.eu/img/m9/zm50-48.jpg

The down side is that I'm still not as 'fluent' with the M9 as I'm with the 5DII. I have not reached the same quality of images in terms of composition and overall look. The frame lines are very approximate and what you think you are framing and what you get can be quite different. Wide angles are very easy to focus while 50mm and above is difficult as the frame lines cover a small portion of the viewfinder.

So I'm still working on getting better at the whole rangefinder thing. My idea is that if I can learn to fully handle the M9 and get the results exactly as I want them then I'll really be able to get consistent results across the board regardless of which gear I choose to use. The 7D + Canon zooms is excellent for action & wildlife shots. The 5DII + Zeiss glass is an unbeatable combination for landscape photography. The M9 is superb for handheld casual shooting.

Anyway, I'll stop here. The main point of the story is that manual focus glass forced me to pause before taking a picture. As I paused to focus I could also take some time to compose the photo and that in turn lead to a significant improvement in my photos. So gear limitations can indeed help you to break certain patterns that are not good for your photography.

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jetcode
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Dec 28, 2010 19:34 |  #67
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[QUOTE=airfrogusmc;115​30850]


IMAGE: http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/airfrogusmc/3Y7I3830_1.jpg

I love this image. This is one of the ways photography has opened doors. Lots of people have found a great way to express their life through this kind of imaging. No fuss no muss have a great time and post the results on FB. I admire the spontaneity and consider this a great gift and essential tool in delivering an image that moves and inspires.



  
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jetcode
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Dec 28, 2010 19:37 |  #68
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gorgeous imagery denoir, love the van gogh!




  
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JeffreyG
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Dec 28, 2010 19:39 |  #69

The thing about POTN is that people like denoir make me feel so inadequate it's hard to take. But then I think, well, maybe I can study and think and take something at least a little bit as nice.

Those pictures are really wonderful, very inspiring work.


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denoir
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Dec 28, 2010 19:46 |  #70

Thanks for the kind words Joe & Jeffrey! :)

Jeffery, there is definitely no reason to feel inadequate. We all have different styles of photography. What I find great about POTN is that there are so many excellent photographers here with a load of interesting approaches and styles that I can get ideas from and use for inspiration.


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airfrogusmc
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Dec 28, 2010 20:03 |  #71

[QUOTE=jetcode;1153119​6][QUOTE=airfrogusmc;1​1530850]


IMAGE: http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/airfrogusmc/3Y7I3830_1.jpg

I love this image. This is one of the ways photography has opened doors. Lots of people have found a great way to express their life through this kind of imaging. No fuss no muss have a great time and post the results on FB. I admire the spontaneity and consider this a great gift and essential tool in delivering an image that moves and inspires.

Thanks Joe and it was only there for a fraction of a second and then it was gone. And the juxtaposition of me taking a photo of a photo being taken I thought was interesting.

Man, I really like Denoirs boats, water reflection and the conversation shots.



  
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hieu1004
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Dec 28, 2010 20:05 |  #72

Denoir- very enjoyable post- thank you for sharing. I love the images.


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robonrome
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Dec 28, 2010 20:19 |  #73

JeffreyG,

I for one really appreciate the point of threads like this and thank you for starting it. I find myself feeling much the same way as you do in having a good understanding of the technical aspects of photography, but wanting to somehow move the thing that really counts, one's creativity, onto a new and hopefully more satisfying plane.

I'm going to take a punt, that different approaches might work better for different people in generating or releasing creativity. I believe everyone is capable of some degree of creativity, but that for some this is as natural to them as breathing while others have to work at it. For the naturally creative, flexible tools and approaches that allow for almost any possibility may allow their natural creativity to flourish in different directions. For those of us (and I'd count myself in this category) who are perhaps less naturally creative, such flexible tools may lead to us heading down a photography rut, lured by the easy options such as shallow DoF etc. For the less naturally creative, hard decisive approaches such as to use a particular focal length, slower aperture (as you've suggested) or setting a specific project is perhaps the best way to drive the creative spark out into the open.


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airfrogusmc
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Dec 28, 2010 20:21 |  #74

JeffreyG wrote in post #11530704 (external link)
Nice examples Allen. That is exactly what I'm thinking about, portraits of people that are all about who they are and where they are. These shots are precisely what I was thinking about when I started this thread - shots that use everything in the frame and don't just blur away the surroundings until nothing is left but the subject. I'll think about that. Maybe I can come up with a project.

Jeffery one other thing just in case you haven't given a real good look at the portraits of Arnold Newman do so. His portraits are incredible. The shot of the artist Mondrian for instance
http://cache1.asset-cache.net …9EBAFBE77033AC4​569D539EFC (external link)

Mondrian was famous for his painting that were squares and rectangles with a strong primary in a spot near the edge of the frame. He chose in this image to use the easel to mimic the strong lines that he created with the rectangles and he put the artists hands where he would have placed a strong primary color.

Here in this image he uses the piano lid to create a musical clef on its side to help show what Stravinski was all about.
http://images.artnet.c​om …_208583_arnold-newman.jpg (external link)

But maybe my personal fav the way he makes the German Industrialist Alfred Krupp who made a fortune in WWII using Jewish slave labor and treating them very badly and Newman made him look like the Satan he was.
http://www.digitaljour​nalist.org …0312/images/new​man/00.jpg (external link)

Just thought you might find these images inspiring. I do.




  
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denoir
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Dec 28, 2010 20:23 |  #75

Thanks Allen & Hieu! :)

Joe, sure. I've been photographing like a maniac for almost a year now. I've been out shooting for an hour or two most days during spring, summer and autumn. Right now I'm stopped by the weather and the lack of decent light here in Sweden. Once I start doing something seriously, I tend to be somewhat fanatical about it. ;-)a


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If prime lenses can in fact spur creativity...
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