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Thread started 02 Mar 2011 (Wednesday) 04:51
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Full Frame vs Crop field of view

 
uk_singh
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Mar 02, 2011 04:51 |  #1

I don't want to start a crop v full frame war (again), but just wanted to question one specific item here. The field of view you get with each sensor type.

Putting all other items aside, I often hear it said that full frame give a wider field of view for things like landscapes etc, that crop bodies just cannot match.

However, I am a little perplexed here - is this a false statement, or am I missing the point.

If I shoot with a crop body, do I not just need a shorter focal length compared to FF to get the same field of view?

i.e. at 12mm on a 1.6 crop is should give an identical image (in regards to field of view) as a 19-20mm lens on FF. Given that there are a range of lenses available, I am guessing you can cover similar if not identical focal lenghts, even when taking in the crop sensor effect.

Does this make the field of view question a non issue?


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zarray
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Mar 02, 2011 04:58 |  #2

FOV is actually a non-issue as you mentioned. However some of us do love L lenses but their FOV(or apparent focal length) is more designed around FF sensors.

There are other advantages(and disadvantages) to the FF sensor but to answer your question...yes it is non-issue.


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uk_singh
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Mar 02, 2011 05:05 |  #3

zarray wrote in post #11940824 (external link)
FOV is actually a non-issue as you mentioned. However some of us do love L lenses but their FOV(or apparent focal length) is more designed around FF sensors.

There are other advantages(and disadvantages) to the FF sensor but to answer your question...yes it is non-issue.

Thanks for that.

In regards to L lenses, do you basically mean that minimum focal lengths of L lenes are a bit too long for crop bodies to give a wide FOV?

I mean, that the widest L range I can think of is the 16-35 L, which is not really super wide on a crop body.

Is this what you mean?


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xarqi
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Mar 02, 2011 05:05 |  #4

uk_singh wrote in post #11940807 (external link)
If I shoot with a crop body, do I not just need a shorter focal length compared to FF to get the same field of view?

Exactly so.




  
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xarqi
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Mar 02, 2011 05:06 |  #5

uk_singh wrote in post #11940835 (external link)
I mean, that the widest L range I can think of is the 16-35 L, which is not really super wide on a crop body.

There's the 14L. No EF-S lenses will ever be L lenses, but there are some excellent 10-xx or even wider zooms.




  
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uk_singh
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Mar 02, 2011 05:13 |  #6

xarqi wrote in post #11940839 (external link)
There's the 14L. No EF-S lenses will ever be L lenses, but there are some excellent 10-xx or even wider zooms.

IF (notice th big if) they did make an EF-S only L lens, in the 10-xx range - would that totally wipe out the FOV question?


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zarray
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Mar 02, 2011 05:17 |  #7

uk_singh wrote in post #11940835 (external link)
Thanks for that.

In regards to L lenses, do you basically mean that minimum focal lengths of L lenes are a bit too long for crop bodies to give a wide FOV?

I mean, that the widest L range I can think of is the 16-35 L, which is not really super wide on a crop body.

Is this what you mean?

there's the EFS 10-22 which will give you approx. same FOV as the 16-35 on FF


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JeffreyG
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Mar 02, 2011 05:38 |  #8

There are several lenses available for 1.6X down to 8mm, 10mm, 11mm etc. that can deliver the same very wide AOV on 1.6X as you can reach with 14mm to 16mm lenses on FF.

There are still two areas where 1.6X cannot exactly do what FF can do:

1) Ultra wide and wide angle with very shallow DOF. There is no 8mm f/1.8 lens that can replace the EF 14/2.8L. There is no 15mm f/1.0 lens that can replace the EF 24/1.4L. If you need very wide with very shallow DOF then FF would be worth using compared to 1.6X

2) There is no 1.6X version of the already quite specialized TS-E 17/4. You cannot get a 10mm tilt-shift lens to use on 1.6X.

But overall, aside from these two needs, strictly getting to an ultra wide AOV on 1.6X is very easy.


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apersson850
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Mar 02, 2011 05:49 as a reply to  @ JeffreyG's post |  #9

The coming (to the stores) EF 8-15mm f/4L fisheye USM is the lens with the shortest focal length in Canon's lens range. It's a fisheye, so a bit limited in use.


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uk_singh
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Mar 02, 2011 06:01 |  #10

Thanks for all the input guys, good to know I am thinking about this in the right way!


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AntonLargiader
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Mar 02, 2011 06:46 |  #11

Yes you are. The sticking point for Canon lenses is that the widest (the 8-15 mentioned above) works on FF, so the buck really stops there. It gives 180° circular fisheye on FF, but only 180° diagonal fisheye on crop.

However, Sigma does have a 4.5mm fisheye for crop only.


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Lacks_focus
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Mar 02, 2011 06:54 |  #12

uk_singh wrote in post #11940807 (external link)
However, I am a little perplexed here - is this a false statement, or am I missing the point.

If I shoot with a crop body, do I not just need a shorter focal length compared to FF to get the same field of view?

Does this make the field of view question a non issue?

This argument is made when discussing lenses of the same focal length. Often it used as a "positive" for the smaller sensors with proponents claiming "more reach" or some mythical focal multiplier when comparing a crop to a 35MM format camera. It has nothing at all to do with L lenses except that all L lenses are EF mounts. The focal length marked on the barrel is what it is regardless of what camera you use it on or the mount that it has. The use simply changes for the lens depending on the format. Take a simple 50MM lens. On a 35MM format it is a normal lens. On a 1.6 crop sensor it is a mild telephoto. On a medium format it would be a wide angle lens. In all of these examples the focal length never changed, only the expected use changed. Just choose the FL that works for the application on the format camera you are using. I routinely bounce between 1.3 and 1.6 crop cameras with the same set of lenses. It is absolutely a non issue.


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Krapo
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Mar 02, 2011 07:03 |  #13

Lacks_focus wrote in post #11941121 (external link)
It is absolutely a non issue.

I agree that the "more reach" argument is a bit stupid. However, as Jeffrey mentioned, the depth of field will differ between crop and FF at a given field of view.

You can't isolate the subject on a crop camera to the level of a FF one.


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F00K33
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Mar 02, 2011 08:27 |  #14

zarray wrote in post #11940824 (external link)
FOV is actually a non-issue as you mentioned. However some of us do love L lenses but their FOV(or apparent focal length) is more designed around FF sensors.

There are other advantages(and disadvantages) to the FF sensor but to answer your question...yes it is non-issue.

bw! i second this..


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uk_singh
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Mar 02, 2011 09:45 |  #15

Thanks again for all the input. I think the comments made confirm what I was thinking, as well as raising some clearer explanations.

The next thing I want to learn more about is how the DOF differs on Crop to FF. I will start searching...


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Full Frame vs Crop field of view
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