Why do (some) ppl think 60D not worth getting?

hollis_f wrote in post #12381568
Why did so many 50D owners hate the 60D when it came out? Because they were expecting the 60D to be a 7D with a lower price. When Canon released the 7D it was obviously designed as the upgrade step for 50D owners - a larger upgrade step than we were used to, but still the obvious upgrade.

But some 50D owners refused the 7D as on upgrade option. For them it was just too expensive. What they wanted were the same features, but at the same price as they'd paid for the 50D. So they waited, safe in their belief that a 60D would soon appear with all the goodies of the 7D.

Of course, that was never going to happen, as should have been obvious to anybody with an IQ greater than their shoe size. So when the 60D was released, at a price point that was sensible in the new Canon scheme, these people were most upset. So they went looking for things to complain about.

It soon became plain that unimportant things like image quality were better in the 60D, so that had to be ignored. Instead it was derided for only having 5.3 fps; for having an articulated LCD that would fall off after two days (like all those LCDs on video cameras have been doing for the last decade); for not having MA (when reading fora provides ample evidence that most people have no idea how to use it) and, finally and most risably, that it didn't have a magnesium alloy shell.

Apparently it's not the extra stregth of Mg-alloy that's important (although reading this thread has made me wonder just how strong it really is). No, it's the feel of it! The 60D is a terrible, useless pile of junk because it feels 'plasticky' as opposed to the lovely 'magnesiumy' feel of the 7D

very good article, from a guy who as them all.

Thank you!!

hollis_f wrote in post #12382381
That's strange. It says you're in the UK - but you seem not to recognise sarcasm. Are you perhaps visiting from elsewhere?

thats a good one

Of viewfinders and Swivel LCD Screens:

Both have their place, and there's no reason to get up in arms about something so petty. Thankfully, just like video, the camera makers don't force you to use the swivel screen.

Olympus has a fully sealed E-5 with a swivel screen, so saying it weakens any weather sealing that may be present is a non-argument, because if Olympus can do it surely Canon can.

If you don't like swivel screens, that's fine, but there are a large number of real photographers who I think would get a ton of use out of said screens, much moreso than adding video to a still camera.

I don't think many people think of a swivel LCD as a replacement for a viewfinder, but merely a supplemental method of making an image.

Tripod work comes to mind. Do you realize how incredibly annoying it is to try to frame an image low on a tripod? Even up high on a tripod can get annoying, but at least one can normally find something to stand on for framing.

Sure, one can get an angle finder for low subjects, but even then you're down on your knees, hunched over looking through an extended viewfinder.

Swivel LCDs are perfect for this type of setup. One can merely squat, saving dirt on the knees, and also take shots which would be impossible to frame otherwise when you're looking almost completely up from the ground.

Also, Live view generally means 100% view of the image - a boon to those camera owners who value careful framing, but who own a model with less than 100% viewfinder coverage - how exactly would given them the option to swivel their view out for easier shots be a bad thing?

Even when framing things waist-high, I really wish I had a swivel LCD - I tend to be able to frame landscape shots much easier when looking at a large LCD (I seem to be more aware of the composition and potential problems), and this means without a swivel LCD I'm on my knees or awkwardly squatting because I still need to overcome viewing angle limitations of a fixed LCD.

I do agree using a swivel LCD for general DSLR operation is a bit foolish, but to each his own and I would absolutely love a swivel LCD on my 5D2.

This shot, a major PITA without swivel screen (I was basically lying on my stomach)

IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com/​photos/jl_smith/564466​5482/

IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com/​photos/jl_smith/513018​7711/

IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com/​photos/jl_smith/513019​3105/

I like the last picture

cputeq007 wrote in post #12383688
Of viewfinders and Swivel LCD Screens:

Both have their place, and there's no reason to get up in arms about something so petty. Thankfully, just like video, the camera makers don't force you to use the swivel screen

cputeq007 wrote in post #12383688
Of viewfinders and Swivel LCD Screens:

Both have their place, and there's no reason to get up in arms about something so petty. Thankfully, just like video, the camera makers don't force you to use the swivel screen.

Olympus has a fully sealed E-5 with a swivel screen, so saying it weakens any weather sealing that may be present is a non-argument, because if Olympus can do it surely Canon can.

If you don't like swivel screens, that's fine, but there are a large number of real photographers who I think would get a ton of use out of said screens, much moreso than adding video to a still camera.

I don't think many people think of a swivel LCD as a replacement for a viewfinder, but merely a supplemental method of making an image.

Tripod work comes to mind. Do you realize how incredibly annoying it is to try to frame an image low on a tripod? Even up high on a tripod can get annoying, but at least one can normally find something to stand on for framing.

Sure, one can get an angle finder for low subjects, but even then you're down on your knees, hunched over looking through an extended viewfinder.

Swivel LCDs are perfect for this type of setup. One can merely squat, saving dirt on the knees, and also take shots which would be impossible to frame otherwise when you're looking almost completely up from the ground.

Also, Live view generally means 100% view of the image - a boon to those camera owners who value careful framing, but who own a model with less than 100% viewfinder coverage - how exactly would given them the option to swivel their view out for easier shots be a bad thing?

Even when framing things waist-high, I really wish I had a swivel LCD - I tend to be able to frame landscape shots much easier when looking at a large LCD (I seem to be more aware of the composition and potential problems), and this means without a swivel LCD I'm on my knees or awkwardly squatting because I still need to overcome viewing angle limitations of a fixed LCD.

I do agree using a swivel LCD for general DSLR operation is a bit foolish, but to each his own and I would absolutely love a swivel LCD on my 5D2.

This shot, a major PITA without swivel screen (I was basically lying on my stomach)

IMG_2957 by J L Smith, on Flickr

This shot, literally impossible to frame without a swivel LCD except by pure chance - I used an Olympus E-5 on this shot, the rear LCD (or where it normally would have been) was smashed into the ground and I wanted to have the flower backlit by the sun:

Flowers, snake's eye view. by J L Smith, on Flickr

Another one, E-5, again impossible t

o frame without swivel - I was standing on a steep bank - kneeling over to actually look through the VF (had I an anglefinder) would have been impossible because I would have toppled into the lake - I was holding camera about ankle-high.

Flowers and Lilies on Lake by J L Smith, on Flickr

You do realize that if you took those shoots with a swivel, then you are not a real photographer, and those aren't even real pictures. Don't you?

JAnders wrote in post #12384037
You do realize that if you took those shoots with a swivel, then you are not a real photographer, and those aren't even real pictures. Don't you?

What do you mean not real pictures, what is wrong with using the "live view" LCD then the viewfinder? none that I can think of most of my photos are shot in "Live view" without a problem, only sometimes I get a problem and that is with the sun

Wow. Getting a little worked up aren't we? Interesting that DPReview gives the D7000 a whole 1% higher score than the 60D, and in their comparison tool the 60D actually beats it on focus and metering, even with its lowly 9 AF points and no MA. It also costs $200 or so less and they are selling pretty strongly, so I think in the end Canon was right making the choices they made.

The swivel screen is really useful for video, anyone who has used a handeld camcorder and tried to video kids on their level knows that. Also you can swivel the screen away when using the viewfinder or for transport and keep stuff of it and keep it safe from scratches. Finally, it's awesome for composing self portraits of you and the family using a remote.

It's funny that some people said "Camera bodies aren't designed to be dropped" and then proceeded to complain that making them from plastic just makes them lighter and cheaper...if, as you say, they aren't designed to be dropped, then what advantage does making it out of a chunk of expensive and heavy metal have, other than it "feels better"? I'd rather pay less and have a more portable camera if the body material doesn't provide any functional benefit. Dismissing a camera entirely just based on the material it is made of is short sighted and silly. The truth is that the 60D is a very nice camera that is positioned in its own space in the market (the around $1000 enthusiast amateur) and it seems to be a good seller and most owners are happy with it, myself included.

CanonEOS wrote in post #12384126
What do you mean not real pictures, what is wrong with using the "live view" LCD then the viewfinder? none that I can think of most of my photos are shot in "Live view" without a problem, only sometimes I get a problem and that is with the sun

Sarcasm, CanonEOS. Simply sarcasm!

A lot of people are putting the swivel down and I was only joking.

For the record, I really like those pictures!!

I use live view when the camera is at ground level and I can't get my eye on the eye piece. I can see how it would be good to have a swivel screen for video and crowd shots where the camera's above your head. Other than that I love the 100% view finder on my camera (7D) and use it 99.9% of the time. You just can't compare what you see in live view to what you can see through the eye piece. I do think that the 60D is worth while getting if you like to shoot video, don't want to shell out a lot more for a 7D and you want the latest technology. Other than that I'd be just as happy putting my money on a used 50D or 5D.

Here's my take on the 60D

( this is opinion formed partly on the basis of an interview of a Canon Rep )

The 60D is not intended by Canon to be an upgrade from the xxD line, though with the model number 60D you would think so, right? I mean it's a natural progression ....

10D->20D->30D->40D->50D->?

60D next?

Not according to Canon, and here is why.

In an interview about the 60D the Canon Rep was asked why did Canon put an SD card in the 60D?

His response was words to this effect .......

Well given that the 10/20/30/40/50D all use CF cards it's easy to realized the 60D was not geared to them.

I went from the 40D to the 7D, though the 50D was out I opted for the newest sub $2K body.

If I go in and look at the 60D from the perspective of having owned the 10D, 30D, 40D and now the 7D I can see where it would not be a camera for me.

However having said that ..... if I went in from the perspective of an owner of some of the higher end point & shoots I would think the 60D was a great entry point into the DSLR.

Nothing wrong with the 60D, it's a nice camera ..... just not for me.

I believe the problems with the people who hate the 60D come from not what the 60D is but their " expectations " of what it should have been.

^^^^^
Exactly. I am that customer (although I bought new Class 10 SD cards with the camera) - I was looking to go from a Point and Shoot to a good, solid, DSLR that didn't totally destroy the bank. The 60D was the camera for me since I wanted to go with Canon. A have no desire to buy a camera that uses CF cards - they are dying and I don't want to invest in them.

The only problem with using Live View as a regular basis, is trying to shoot something that moves,and keep it in focus I wish Canon has the excelent live view that Sony does !! Somebody here have ever used that live view??

Keyan wrote in post #12384308
^^^^^
Exactly. I am that customer (although I bought new Class 10 SD cards with the camera) - I was looking to go from a Point and Shoot to a good, solid, DSLR that didn't totally destroy the bank. The 60D was the camera for me since I wanted to go with Canon. A have no desire to buy a camera that uses CF cards - they are dying and I don't want to invest in them.

CF cards are not going away and will always be better than SD cards. SD cards have a 9 pin interface and only allows for a 4-bit data transfer bus. The 50 pin CF card has a 16-bit data transfer bus. CF cards are considered more reliable than SD cards. There's a reason why both Nikon and Canon use CF cards in their high end pro models.

I wouldn't say SD or CF is better, but I wouldn't base my camera purchase on a memorycard type (unless it's the infamous Sony Memory Stick :mad