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FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting 
Thread started 23 Jun 2011 (Thursday) 11:02
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Remote flash on EOS 60D. Any 60D users suggestions please!

 
Miqs
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Jun 23, 2011 11:02 |  #1

Having got the EOS 60D which has a built in wireless transmitter, I find that I cannot use my Nissin speedlite as a wireless remote flash unless I use the pop up flash on camera to activate it. Also I now hear that the Canon Speedlite 430EX II is possibly the only moderately priced (approx £200) speedlite flash I can use to enable me to use as a remote flash. Is this true? If so I now have the dilemma whether to reluctantly spend more cash on a new flash or use a remote flash cable to use my Nissin which would be a lot cheaper. I wondered if any 60D users had the same problem and found any short cuts or a different MO? :cry:




  
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Agent ­ 655
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Jun 23, 2011 11:21 |  #2

The popup flash is used to send the near IR signal to the flashes. For example with my 430 I can controll it from the 60D. The pop up flash is up, but you have several options. You can set the camera to only use the flash from the 430, use both the 430 and pop up, or configure the balance between the two.

If you just want to use the 430 then the pop up still "flashes" but it is just the near IR signal to the external to fire and does not impact the exposure.




  
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HughR
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Jun 23, 2011 12:27 |  #3

The 60D does an outstanding job of triggering the 430 wirelessly. I have both a 430EX and a 430EX II, and I control both using the pop-up on the 60D for multi-flash lighting. If you're looking for a less expensive flash that has wireless ETTL control from the 60D, the Canon 320EX is less expensive than the 430EX II and almost as powerful.


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shankarhokie
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Jun 23, 2011 12:42 as a reply to  @ HughR's post |  #4

If you are just concerned about using a 3rd party flash in a wireless mode, you can always buy wireless triggers such as Yongnuo RF-602.

I believe that only Canon flashes can be controlled by the built in 60D wireless capability.


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dedsen
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Jun 23, 2011 14:42 |  #5

shankarhokie wrote in post #12645303 (external link)
I believe that only Canon flashes can be controlled by the built in 60D wireless capability.

This is not true. There are a few that work with the Canon master/slave system like Sigma, metz and some of the Nissins.

Migs, which Nissin flash do you have? You are aware that the built-in wireless on the 60d uses light pulses from the popup flash to communicate with the remote flashes. This does require that the popup be up. You can set it to fire only the control pulses and not contribute to the scene lighting.



  
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Rocky ­ Rhode
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Jun 23, 2011 15:24 |  #6

shankarhokie wrote in post #12645303 (external link)
I believe that only Canon flashes can be controlled by the built in 60D wireless capability.

You could wait for the YN-565EX; it will act just like the Canon 430 and the 580


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msowsun
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Jun 23, 2011 20:58 |  #7

Unless you want to buy wireless radio triggers, you will need to use the pop up flash on your 60D no matter what flash you use.

The Nissin Di866 and Di622 II are both compatible with the Canon wireless system.

If you have the older Di622, it will only work as a more simple optical slave with your 60D. It has an ETTL preflash compatible optical slave that will fire any time it sees another flash go off. It will ignore the ETTL preflash of your 60D, and then fire when the main flash fires a microsecond later.

So to use your Nissin off camera, pop up the 60D's built in flash (while set to ETTL) and then the Nissin will fire when the 60D does.


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Miqs
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Jun 24, 2011 04:01 |  #8

msowsun wrote in post #12647786 (external link)
Unless you want to buy wireless radio triggers, you will need to use the pop up flash on your 60D no matter what flash you use.

The Nissin Di866 and Di622 II are both compatible with the Canon wireless system.

If you have the older Di622, it will only work as a more simple optical slave with your 60D. It has an ETTL preflash compatible optical slave that will fire any time it sees another flash go off. It will ignore the ETTL preflash of your 60D, and then fire when the main flash fires a microsecond later.

So to use your Nissin off camera, pop up the 60D's built in flash (while set to ETTL) and then the Nissin will fire when the 60D does.

Thanks very much for the replies. I have the older Nissin Di622 which I have used as an optical slave as you say, with the 60D's pop up flash firing, operating the Nissin as the main flash fires. Ideally I wanted to use the Nissin as a remote flash without the 60D pop up firing at all. I am interested to see however that the newer Di622 will work wirelessly as you suggest. Will investigate further.




  
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msowsun
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Jun 24, 2011 05:55 |  #9

With the Canon wireless system you have the option to set the 60D flash to act as a trigger flash and contribute almost no light to the photo. If you take a photo in a mirror you will see a little flash but in most cases, it will not show up in the photo.

EDIT: The above assumes you are using the Canon proprietary wireless system with a fully compatible flash. The Nissin Di622 is NOT compatible because it only has a simple optical slave.

Canon, Nissin, Sigma, Metz, (and soon Yongnuo 565) all have flashes available that are compatible with the Canon wireless system.


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Miqs
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Jun 24, 2011 06:27 |  #10

msowsun wrote in post #12649615 (external link)
With the Canon wireless system you have the option to set the 60D flash to act as a trigger flash and contribute almost no light to the photo. If you take a photo in a mirror you will see a little flash but in most cases, it will not show up in the photo.

I have heard this before and quite excited by it but didn't know how accurate it is. For instance, does ETTL not apply when this method is used so the flash exposure becomes trial and error?




  
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msowsun
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Jun 24, 2011 07:18 |  #11

No, the Canon wireless system is full ETTL or manual if you prefer.

ETTL is fully automatic with the option to add + or - Flash Exposure compensation. Manual can be trial and error.


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HughR
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Jun 24, 2011 09:56 |  #12

^^^ Yes, and in addition, the 60D can control the ratio of the external flash power to the pop-up power using ETTL. Option is from 8:1 (external 3 stops brighter than pop-up) to 1:1 (external at same level as pop-up). When you tell the 60D to use external only, the pop-up sends out an ETTL control signal to the external, but its light contribution to the photo is at least 6 stops down, so it contributes no visible fill to shadow areas.


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karlpilkington
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Jun 24, 2011 10:18 |  #13

msowsun wrote in post #12649615 (external link)
With the Canon wireless system you have the option to set the 60D flash to act as a trigger flash and contribute almost no light to the photo. If you take a photo in a mirror you will see a little flash but in most cases, it will not show up in the photo.

Canon, Nissin, Sigma, Metz, and soon Yongnuo 565 are all compatible with the Canon wireless system.

I was testing out the wireless system in the 60D for the first time the other day with a 430exii and noticed the pop up flash in the reflection of the tv even when I chose the option to have it turned off. I couldnt tell if it contributed to the exposure though. If it's there, how does it not?

Also a question for anyone who knows. If I purchase a YN-560 with a set of Cactus V5's, I should be able to put a transceiver on my camera, and control the YN-560 with other receiver, the 430exii should work without a receiver correct? I don't see an option on gadgetinfinity's site to purchase the duo triggers with one extra without purchasing the one receiver seperate. If I can make the 2 flashes work off camera with just 2 receivers than i'll just get the duo set. Thanks for any help guys.


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Snydremark
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Jun 24, 2011 10:34 |  #14

karlpilkington wrote in post #12650546 (external link)
I was testing out the wireless system in the 60D for the first time the other day with a 430exii and noticed the pop up flash in the reflection of the tv even when I chose the option to have it turned off. I couldnt tell if it contributed to the exposure though. If it's there, how does it not?
...

The wireless flash system on both the 60D and the 7D *requires the pop-up flash to 'flash' and send a light signal to the receiving flash IN ALL CASES*.

However, if you have it set to the popup being "off" that simply means that it doesn't produce enough light to contribute to the image. You can test this by setting your popup flash to trigger an external flash, and then take a flash shot without any slaves turned on. It doesn't matter how close you are to the subject, there is no flash lighting in the image. You can even dial the popup flash compensation to the maximum setting and it still won't show up in the image when set up this way. As for the "how" it doesn't show up....you got me :) I assume it has to do with the intensity of the flash pulse, though.

This the thing that confuses just about everyone that grabs one of these cameras on hearing about the wireless ability. I blame it on the feature being labeled 'wireless' in this day and age where that term most commonly refers to something that uses a radio signal or IR signal, like your TV remote.


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Miqs
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Jun 24, 2011 11:00 as a reply to  @ Snydremark's post |  #15

Well tried it all and I am slightly confused. I set the built in flash exposure compensation to -3 and tried the mirror test and it worked. The flash is hardly discernable in the image. So if the camera flash fires out a pre flash for ETTL how does it pre judge or calculate what light is expected from the slave in my case the Nissin speedlite? As I understand a slave flash fires a milli second after the camera flash. All my exposures using the slave were massively overexposed until I reduced the power of the speedlite to near minimum which surely defeats the purpose of ETTL2. I was on manual exposure at 1/125 sec at f5.6 ISO 600 with subject about 8ft. Eventually after moving the slave and bouncing it I achieved what I wanted but it took too long! Sorry but I just don't get it! Help!! :cry:




  
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Remote flash on EOS 60D. Any 60D users suggestions please!
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