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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 24 Jun 2011 (Friday) 13:42
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EG-S focusing screen for 5D2 - Good to have?

 
wolfxto
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Jun 25, 2011 11:44 |  #16

Thanks! I'll definitely buy it along with the CZ!


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CaloSIM
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Jun 25, 2011 11:48 |  #17

If you have a lot of manual lenses, then it is worth to buy. Like cputeq007 say, it shows DOF more accurate than standart screen EG-A.

But, it also have some issue. It's true, if you shoot above f/4, the viewfinder become darker. If you shoot at daylight you don't have a problem with that. But at night, that is a problem for me. :)


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Ricku
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Jun 25, 2011 13:12 as a reply to  @ CaloSIM's post |  #18
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I can't find this thing anywhere in Thailand (as with everything else), so I'm gonna have to order it online

Are there any demonstrations avalible online with pictures, where I can see the difference between the focus screen and the stock screen?

Silly question I guess. :D


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s2kennyc
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Jun 25, 2011 14:41 |  #19

CaloSIM wrote in post #12655609 (external link)
But, it also have some issue. It's true, if you shoot above f/4, the viewfinder become darker. If you shoot at daylight you don't have a problem with that. But at night, that is a problem for me. :)

Just some clarification to those wanting to purchase a EG-S screen.

Yes, if your lens is a F4 lens such as a 17-40 F4, then your viewfinder will be darker.

Yes, if you use a vintage lens that has a manual aperture control and you stop that lens down to F4, your viewfinder will become darker.

But no, if you have a modern lens that has automatic aperture control and is F1.2 such as the 85L, your viewfinder DOES NOT become darker if you decide to stop it down to F4. Remember, the lens does not stop down it's aperture blades until the moment you click down on the shutter button. The Lens stays wide open so that your viewfinder is nice and bright to allow for accurate focusing.

Changing to a super precision screen such as the EG-S allows you to see the shallow DOF of fast primes. Seeing this visually through the viewfinder will allow you to make a sound judgement of whether to take the shot or not if the AF misses slightly. You can determine whether you want to have AF refocus or you can manually override it.

The standard EG-A focus screen will show you the DOF of a lens at around F2.8 even though you have a faster lens than this. You can confirm this with the DOF preview button. F1.2-F2.8 will look exactly the same through the EG-A focus screen. Not so with the EG-S screen.

Ricku, I would go ahead and order this online. One of the best bang for the buck purchase for the 5D II.


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noisejammer
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Jun 25, 2011 17:36 |  #20

I've played with the Eg-S for quite a while.

I find that I can focus more accurately using it than with the standard screen but you really need to adjust your diopter correction _exactly_ if you want to achieve acceptable manual focusing... but be aware that you will have some image blur because your eyes cannot resolve enough detail.

Secondly, the camera (or at least my camera) does not meter correctly when the Eg-S is installed - even when it's set to the correct screen and evaluative metering.

Third - you can install a loupe (Zacuto is best but there are far less expensive options including diy) so that you can view the magnified image while holding the camera up to your eye. Having tried all the options, I believe this is the only way to routinely outperform autofocus. This has the considerable benefit that you can observe the image electronically and boost the sensitivity in poor lighting.


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melanopsin
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Jun 25, 2011 18:37 |  #21

s2kennyc wrote in post #12656279 (external link)
Just some clarification to those wanting to purchase a EG-S screen.

Yes, if your lens is a F4 lens such as a 17-40 F4, then your viewfinder will be darker.

Yes, if you use a vintage lens that has a manual aperture control and you stop that lens down to F4, your viewfinder will become darker.

But no, if you have a modern lens that has automatic aperture control and is F1.2 such as the 85L, your viewfinder DOES NOT become darker if you decide to stop it down to F4. Remember, the lens does not stop down it's aperture blades until the moment you click down on the shutter button. The Lens stays wide open so that your viewfinder is nice and bright to allow for accurate focusing.

Changing to a super precision screen such as the EG-S allows you to see the shallow DOF of fast primes. Seeing this visually through the viewfinder will allow you to make a sound judgement of whether to take the shot or not if the AF misses slightly. You can determine whether you want to have AF refocus or you can manually override it.

The standard EG-A focus screen will show you the DOF of a lens at around F2.8 even though you have a faster lens than this. You can confirm this with the DOF preview button. F1.2-F2.8 will look exactly the same through the EG-A focus screen. Not so with the EG-S screen.

Ricku, I would go ahead and order this online. One of the best bang for the buck purchase for the 5D II.

I'm pretty sure the stock -A screen is brighter than the -S screen between f/3.5 and f/5.6 only. Larger than f/2.8 -S screen is brighter. Smaller than f/5.6 both screens have equal brightness.

edit: the italicized portion is incorrect according to a later post with link with somebody's measured results (Eg-S above f/5.6 is -2 to 2.75 stops darker than -C screen.)




  
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Ricku
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Jun 26, 2011 00:53 |  #22
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Thanks for the clarification Ken. Sounds great! :)


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Ricku
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Jun 26, 2011 00:57 |  #23
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noisejammer wrote in post #12656936 (external link)
I've played with the Eg-S for quite a while.

I find that I can focus more accurately using it than with the standard screen but you really need to adjust your diopter correction _exactly_ if you want to achieve acceptable manual focusing... but be aware that you will have some image blur because your eyes cannot resolve enough detail.

Hmm. This is what I've been pondering all along, even though I've never used a focus screen. I am not worried about my eyesight, but to be able to see a super thin DOF (of 2 - 3 cm) must require the eyesight of an eagle..

But oh well, Im gonna buy the screen anyway and hope for the best! ..I just can't put up with the horrible outer focus points any longer, nor the center focus and recompose technique. Both are giving me very bad results.


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torridn
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Jul 01, 2011 19:09 |  #24

OK, maybe a silly question.

What exactly does the EG-S do to help achieve better manual focus? It doesn't have a microprism or split screen in it.


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sebmour
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Jul 01, 2011 19:10 |  #25

You better have fast lens since f2.8 is dark in the viewfinder. I have it on both my cameras.


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melanopsin
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Jul 01, 2011 20:11 |  #26

torridn wrote in post #12690774 (external link)
OK, maybe a silly question.

What exactly does the EG-S do to help achieve better manual focus? It doesn't have a microprism or split screen in it.

Not a silly question at all, imho there is the crux.

1. Faster lenses have bigger front elements. The light rays from the outer circumference must be bent by the focus screen into the viewfinder. With a bigger front element the angle the light rays from the outer circumference must be bent is steeper, to make it into the eyepiece.

2. The standard focus screen is a fresnel lens, with the lens grooves a certain distance apart chosen to brighten the image in the eyepiece, when lens is used from f/2.8-f/5.6. Used with a faster lens, the outer circumference rays never make it into the viewfinder, resulting in seeing no difference in DOF as lens aperture is opened bigger than f/2.8.

3. The -S focus screens have the lens groves closer together, close enough to bend the light rays from the outer circumference of lenses faster than f/2.8, so the narrow DOF can be seen. Focus is more accurate because real DOF is seen, not just the portion of the DOF above f/2.8.




  
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torridn
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Jul 01, 2011 22:11 |  #27

OK, I think I understand. The standard focusing screen has a smaller effective aperture, so it can't be used to accurately set depth of field of a fast lens.

I'm having trouble setting the depth of field on my tilt-shift, since it has no auto-focus. However, it is f/3.5. Since it is a relatively slow lens, switching the focusing screen will probably offer no help. And it will be darker.


5D Mark II, 28-70mm f/2.8L, 70-200mm f/2.8L, 24mm f/3.5L Tilt-Shift, 28mm f/1.8, 50mm f/1.4, 85mm f/1.8, 100mm f/2.8 Macro

  
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MrChad
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Jul 01, 2011 22:57 as a reply to  @ torridn's post |  #28

The Eg-S is the only focus screen I use in my 5D2. I don't notice the darker effect, I use only f/2.8 glass and faster and the screen is by far better IMO than the screen of my old beloved Elan 7e/7n cameras. Those were always dark, so I don't know any better with the 5d2 - if you don't switch the screens out often for stock, you'll never notice the change in darkness.


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melanopsin
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Jul 01, 2011 23:42 |  #29

torridn wrote in post #12691483 (external link)
OK, I think I understand. The standard focusing screen has a smaller effective aperture, so it can't be used to accurately set depth of field of a fast lens.

I'm having trouble setting the depth of field on my tilt-shift, since it has no auto-focus. However, it is f/3.5. Since it is a relatively slow lens, switching the focusing screen will probably offer no help. And it will be darker.

Yes




  
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Ricku
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Jul 13, 2011 09:33 |  #30
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Well I have placed the order. :) I'll give u a short review when I've tried it.


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EG-S focusing screen for 5D2 - Good to have?
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