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FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting 
Thread started 11 Jul 2011 (Monday) 19:35
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Light Meters

 
dmward
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Jul 12, 2011 11:10 |  #16

I can't imagine how a flash meter will deliver any usable reading from a flash in TTL mode.
The power is adjusted on a shot by shot basis using the reflective meter in the camera and a preflash.
A meter's ability to deliver useful information is predicated on a flash light source being able to deliver repeatable light output.

The two are mutually exclusive.

As for using a flash meter, repeatability is key. If it delivers consistent readings then it can be calibrated to your camera for reasonable exposure accuracy.

Its even possible to use your camera's LCD screen and a white paper towel to emulate an incident meter, just more tedious.


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Wilt
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Jul 12, 2011 11:50 |  #17

Buy USED!!! Minoltal Autometer IVf's are superb pro quality meters that were highly popular and had far greater market share than Sekonic had 15 years ago, among both pros and amateurs.


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sudarsankannan
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Jul 12, 2011 13:35 as a reply to  @ post 12745490 |  #18

I have Sekonic L-358 and it is very good. So far I am using only in "auto reset cordless flash mode", where I select this mode, press the metering button (then it waits for 90 sec or so for the flash to fire), then I fire the test flash and it gives me the reading

You may consider using a sync cable but I am seriously thinking about moving to remote firing. That is, when you press the meter button, the flash should fire and you should be able to take the reading..

You need

1) Remote Transmitter RT-32. Link (external link)

2) Remote receiver. I did a lot of research and I guess flextt5/minitt1 are the best.

There are some very good videos in you tube by Mark Wallace (from Adorama) and you can get lot of info from these videos

Thx
Ram




  
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dmward
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Jul 12, 2011 15:51 |  #19

Wilt's right about the Minolta. I have one I purchased used at Calumet and it's been working well for the last three years.
Have no idea how old it is but it gets the exposure right. I think it will even do Flash Ambient ratio, if ever take the time to read the manual. :-)

I have it and my Cyber Commander calibrated to deliver the same reading and to my 5DII to simplify matters even more.


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mikewinburn
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Jul 12, 2011 17:49 |  #20

PacAce wrote in post #12745161 (external link)
Can you measure the a flash output of a flash in ETTL mode with your meter? I know the Sekonic meters won't let you do that because it always meters the preflash and not the main flash.

dmward wrote in post #12745591 (external link)
I can't imagine how a flash meter will deliver any usable reading from a flash in TTL mode.
The power is adjusted on a shot by shot basis using the reflective meter in the camera and a preflash...

SkipD wrote in post #12745328 (external link)
What the heck is "the ARCF mode"? I never heard that one.

Skip,
ARCF (auto reset cordless flash) :) if it were a snake it would have bit you hehe :p

PacAce and DMWard,

  • hit FEL (or AE* on some cameras (like my Rebel T1i)) - Preflash fires (you've got 16 seconds to make adjustments)
  • camera locks the proper exposure based on PreFlash, Ambient, and user defined parameters
  • then, have someone hit the "read" button on the sekonic
  • take the pic of the meter... voila! (Then, you can even just view the readout on your LCD :)
  • Make adjustments to your flash position/power to bring it into line with what you need, try again.


(The joys of digital... thats a long way around I learned when trying to use the meter when i didn't have PW or sync cables.)

It's seems just silly now, since for portraiture I only use manual flash mode now... but hey, you can learn alot by trial and error :)

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Markd102
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Jul 12, 2011 18:08 |  #21

WOW, a used Minolta IV f seems to be around the same price as a new L-358.




  
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Wilt
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Jul 12, 2011 18:39 |  #22

Markd102 wrote in post #12747827 (external link)
WOW, a used Minolta IV f seems to be around the same price as a new L-358.

Hmmm, maybe folks have gotten smart and bought up the available ones...back a few years ago they were selling for about $130 (0.5x new price).


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digital ­ paradise
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Jul 12, 2011 19:05 |  #23

sudarsankannan wrote in post #12746380 (external link)
I have Sekonic L-358 and it is very good. So far I am using only in "auto reset cordless flash mode", where I select this mode, press the metering button (then it waits for 90 sec or so for the flash to fire), then I fire the test flash and it gives me the reading

You may consider using a sync cable but I am seriously thinking about moving to remote firing. That is, when you press the meter button, the flash should fire and you should be able to take the reading..

You need

1) Remote Transmitter RT-32. Link (external link)

2) Remote receiver. I did a lot of research and I guess flextt5/minitt1 are the best.

There are some very good videos in you tube by Mark Wallace (from Adorama) and you can get lot of info from these videos

Thx
Ram

I was able to rig this very easily with my Cybersyncs. I just attached the transmitter to the meter with velcro, plugged it into the L-358 PC port and there it is - wireless trigger.


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ukcyberboy
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Jul 13, 2011 02:35 |  #24

Wilt wrote in post #12745795 (external link)
Buy USED!!! Minoltal Autometer IVf's are superb pro quality meters that were highly popular and had far greater market share than Sekonic had 15 years ago, among both pros and amateurs.

Thats why I got the kenko as they took over the rights, I got mine a couple of years ago for £80, and now they go for £120.
It is great as I can use info and parts like the disc from a Minolta.


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Wilt
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Jul 13, 2011 11:08 |  #25

Wilt wrote in post #12747970 (external link)
Hmmm, maybe folks have gotten smart and bought up the available ones...back a few years ago they were selling for about $130 (0.5x new price).

I just checked eBay and find quite a few Minolta Autometer IVf units for auction. Here is one with a $150 Buy It Now price.
http://cgi.ebay.com …eters&hash=item​20bb05b90a (external link)

I am dumbfoundedly amazed at the number of eBay listings at and above what was the new unit retail price, when you can buy new Sekonic meters of comparable quality for only $260 !


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Markd102
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Jul 13, 2011 19:46 |  #26

Thanks Wilt, but I'm in Australia.
I watching a couple of suitable auctions, but the amount of bids on them so far suggest they'll push the price up.




  
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mikewinburn
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Jul 13, 2011 21:27 |  #27

Zigot wrote in post #12745388 (external link)
How would you use the balance of ambient/flash in an studio environment?

same way you would out of doors.

  • Ambient lighting can be thought of as the total accumulation of light (constant readable light) in an area/room that the sensor can read... (doesn't matter where that area is; outdoors is a mighty big area, indoors its a mighty small area).
  • Or, you can think of it as all the light in the scene, except the light thrown by the flash.
Hope that's helpful

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dmward
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Jul 13, 2011 22:33 |  #28

mikewinburn wrote in post #12747725 (external link)
Skip,
ARCF (auto reset cordless flash) :) if it were a snake it would have bit you hehe :p

PacAce and DMWard,
  • hit FEL (or AE* on some cameras (like my Rebel T1i)) - Preflash fires (you've got 16 seconds to make adjustments)
  • camera locks the proper exposure based on PreFlash, Ambient, and user defined parameters
  • then, have someone hit the "read" button on the sekonic
  • take the pic of the meter... voila! (Then, you can even just view the readout on your LCD :)
  • Make adjustments to your flash position/power to bring it into line with what you need, try again.


(The joys of digital... thats a long way around I learned when trying to use the meter when i didn't have PW or sync cables.)

It's seems just silly now, since for portraiture I only use manual flash mode now... but hey, you can learn alot by trial and error :)

Mike,
Or take a picture of a white paper towel, look at the blinkies and adjust.

What is the difference in the meter reading if its on a black cloth, white cloth or mirror?
There will be a difference because the TTL pre-flash reading will have taken note of the total exposure environment.


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bespoke
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Jul 13, 2011 22:41 |  #29

i like the 308 because it easily fits in my pockets (shirt or pants) and it's so light. great for on location when you're running around


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mikewinburn
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Jul 13, 2011 23:49 |  #30

dmward wrote in post #12754898 (external link)
Mike,
Or take a picture of a white paper towel, look at the blinkies and adjust.

What is the difference in the meter reading if its on a black cloth, white cloth or mirror?
There will be a difference because the TTL pre-flash reading will have taken note of the total exposure environment.

Im with you on the different results on the reading due to the total exposure environment (reflectance factor if you will... since ETTL II's wonder is it reads all 63 zones before the pre-flash, and then reads all 63 zones again after the pre-flash in order to discern proper exposure in conjuction with ambient light [and of course given the camera settings selected by the user].

What i don't get is how exposing on the paper towel will get my meter to expose correctly. Oh wait, are you meaning using the White paper towel as a GRAY Card?

Hey, that certainly makes sense in that case... didn't think of it... afterall, 18% grey is 18% grey no matter if the source of exposure required an increase or decrease of exposure (since White, Black, and Grey will all expose as 18% grey by the sensor as long as nothing else in the picture)... hmmm... wouldn't the flash have to be set to Manual for that to work, or it works with ETTL as well?


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