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Thread started 18 Sep 2011 (Sunday) 05:31
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dpp and elements or light room ?

 
whu-1
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Sep 18, 2011 05:31 |  #1

Hi guys ,
Sorry about another lightroom / photo shop quetion .

I'm happy with the work flow in dpp and cataloging , I all ways shoot in raw , I’ve bean reading the posts about light room 3 .

If I can only buy either light room 3 or elements 9 ( soon to be 10 )

What can light room 3 offer me that a combination of dpp and elements 9 can’t .

And please don’t say down load the free visions :oops:,

all so if i move/change computer can you transferr lightroom or elements with you or is the licences a one hit wonder ?

thanks for any help ,

cheers




  
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Sep 18, 2011 09:07 |  #2

I use DPP and CS5. I took an Introduction to LR3 course and became very familiar with it. Excellent software. If I were a pro working on multiple images on a weekly basis I would purchase LR3.

Since I only have to mass edit every few months or so I find DPP adequate enough for me at this point. The recipes, etc do a very good job.

I don't really like the final output sharpening in DPP so I batch sharpen in PS which only takes minutes. LR3 has good sharpening (much better than DPP) but I think PS does a better job as you have more options. Even the instructor agreed to that.

Our instructor stated that LR was designed for photographers and PS for designers. I like spending a lot of time on one print so PS works for me. I can't justify spending the money on LR right now.


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tonylong
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Sep 18, 2011 10:31 |  #3

What you need to understand is that Elements is an app that contains tools/capabilities that neither Lightroom or DPP are designed to handle. Elements is built around an image editor which can do advanced graphical work on your images, everything from altering things in your images to applying textures and "special effects".

Lightroom and DPP are built around a Raw processor and are designed to take in a photo and do the most common and vital tasks and, if possible, to produce a good "final product" for print, Web display, etc, but for more advanced tasks they are prepared to send a converted image off to Elements, Photoshop, or another editor you have on hand.

Now it's true that Lightroom has a great toolset all built into one integrated interface, so that you can get a lot of good quality work done efficiently. Id does have advantages over both DPP and Elements in the tasks they share. It aims to give professional photographers and amateurs with a "serious" photogrphy workflow a powerful "central" for that workflow.

But it is pricey and has a learning curve to "get it down", and the fact remains that even if you master Lightroom you will still occasionally have a need for an image editor, and it's best to have one on hand. Elements is a great tool to have on hand.

So, rather than choose according to your original question, I'd suggest looking at Elements before going for Lightroom. Use DPP for whatever you can get out of it, and learn about the capabilities of Elements and how to get use from them. And, in time, there is always info about Lightroom that comes out here, but you don't need to rush into it until you understand why you would want it...


Just a perspective!


Tony
Two Canon cameras (5DC, 30D), three Canon lenses (24-105, 100-400, 100mm macro)
Tony Long Photos on PBase (external link)
Wildlife project pics here (external link), Biking Photog shoots here (external link), "Suburbia" project here (external link)! Mount St. Helens, Mount Hood pics here (external link)

  
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davidcrebelxt
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Sep 18, 2011 16:01 |  #4

I agree with the post above by Tony... be sure to read it carefully and understand what he is saying.

As a former Elements (current?) user here's my perspective:
One aspect I loved about Elements was the catalog... some love it, others hate it.

LR took that catalog to a new level... quickly opening image within same application (not waiting for long load times.) Add to that the Non-destructive editing (no more juggling multiple edited versions of a file on disk) and ability to quickly apply edits across a series of pictures, and I was sold!

The cataloging or "tagging" of images isn't as fun in LR as it was in Elements, but I've learned to live with the fact that apparently professionals don't like to have "fun." (Not a dig at professionals... its a dig at the unprofessional comments by some Adobe developers & insiders!)

Long story short, I rarely use Elements anymore... to the point that I don't bother upgrading unless the next version has some great feature I feel will be worthwhile, I think I'm two versions back on Elements now. YMMV based on the amount you use layers, compositing, and other tools only in a pixel editor like Elements.

I know you said not to say it, but the only way to get a taste of if LR is up your alley is to try it out. Give yourself a week or two with it using a handful of images... remember its non-destructive!

More than that, though, I'm struck by your second sentence... if you ARE happy with your workflow, it feels productive, and you are getting the results you desire, my advice is to stick with what you're doing. By all means keep an eye out for other software/tools that will help... but MAKE SURE they are actually helping; and one of the only ways to know if a particular app suits YOU is to kick the tires and take it for a test drive. (besides, try out LR3 now... get a 'taste'... hopefully next year sometime we'll get a beta of Lr4 ;) )


David C.
Equipment: Canon Dig. Rebel XT; 18-55mm EF-S; 28-105mm EF; 50mm 1.8 EF
Sigma ef-500 DG ST, Elements, Gimp, Lightroom
http://www.flickr.com/​photos/dcrebelxt (external link)

  
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whu-1
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Sep 18, 2011 21:41 |  #5

Thanks for the replies guys , forgot to say I’m not processing 100’s of pics a week , and tend to cheery pick photos to work on and file the rest (were i can find them , well most of the time lol ).

So work flow not a big issue as im not a pro and not processing 1000’s of pic’s.


I’ll rephrase the question if work flow/Cataloging was not a issue and you had ddp and elements 9 , what would you miss from lightroom 3 that’s not possible not in ddp/elements ?




  
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tonylong
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Sep 19, 2011 00:19 |  #6

whu-1 wrote in post #13124663 (external link)
I’ll rephrase the question if work flow/Cataloging was not a issue and you had ddp and elements 9 , what would you miss from lightroom 3 that’s not possible not in ddp/elements ?

Well, I'll hazard a guess that most of us Lightroom users find Lightroom to be quite efficient in how we can do most if not all of our work on most of our photos.

This is from a combination of the integrated interface and a lot of tools and capabilities that can make a person's workflow really flow.

Now you did make a comment that you don't shoot much of a volume of photos, whereas those that do tend to look to Lightroom and then Photoshop CSx because of their abilities to do so much with large shoots and such.

So, I find myself working on all kinds of sizes, anything from one or two quick shots of something up past a thousand on an active event day.

My typical walk-around is, I'd say, in the area of 200 photos, unless it's a full-day or at least a several hour excursion.

And, Lightroom makes working on that a pretty smooth and efficient process in various ways.

So, as my photographic activity was picking up (as an amateur/enthusiast, not a professional), I had been happy with Elements (using version 4 back then), but began to feel the constraints on my productivity. At the time the "step up" was to Photoshop CS2. Lightroom was under development and was talked about, and I kept my eye on things because there was a lot about the talk that made sense, but at the time CS2 gave me a real boost, so I was a happy camper.

And then, the LR Beta came out and I went for it, but it was buggy, and when the first release came out the various bugs had not been worked out, so I kept on with Photoshop and upgraded to CS3.

But, when LR1.2 came out, that second upgrade produced some great reports, and yeah, I jumped on it and have been happily using it ever since. And again, there was for me a productivity boost from the efficiencies I've mentioned.

So, as to your question, I'd say it boils down to the fact that Lightroom had all the tools of the Adobe Camera Raw software, and then by building up the interface and various nice tools with that Raw processor, it provides a platform where we can do a whole lot and do it more efficiently than either Elements or DPP, and we even prefer the efficiencies of the CSx apps, for as much work that we can do in LR.

But, as I said before, there will come a time when you will want/need an image editor, whether you are using Lightroom, DPP or the Camera Raw app, and then you will want either Elements on hand or Photoshop CSx, or one of the other capable apps that are out there.

And, I'll go back to what I said before...you are using DPP, an app that I do enjoy using, especially for the shorter, quicker shoots, and if I were you I wouldn't rush away from that too quickly, but I would pick up an image editor, and I consider Elements to be great to supplement your DPP work when needed.

Then, in time, you can learn about what else is out there, including Lightroom, but there are other nice apps out there as well. Take your time, read up on something that catches your interest, and be aware that many of these apps have free trials, so when you are ready to "get serious" then take advantage of the free trial.

In the meantime, have fun and enjoy your photography!


Tony
Two Canon cameras (5DC, 30D), three Canon lenses (24-105, 100-400, 100mm macro)
Tony Long Photos on PBase (external link)
Wildlife project pics here (external link), Biking Photog shoots here (external link), "Suburbia" project here (external link)! Mount St. Helens, Mount Hood pics here (external link)

  
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whu-1
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Sep 21, 2011 03:57 |  #7

Thanks for you time and input tony ,

Thinking about it , one of the main reasons I guess for picking only one , light room or element is all so there is only one product to up grade when shinny new features come out.

Thanks for the advice think ill go with dpp and elements 10.
If only for the Content Aware button.

Some of the organizing features might be useful to for a purely amateur
Like finding pics by faces or objects :D

Cheers .




  
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tonylong
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Sep 21, 2011 11:43 |  #8

Elements does have an organizer so that you can assign keywords, but the "face recognising" thing is just not very widespread at this point:)!


Tony
Two Canon cameras (5DC, 30D), three Canon lenses (24-105, 100-400, 100mm macro)
Tony Long Photos on PBase (external link)
Wildlife project pics here (external link), Biking Photog shoots here (external link), "Suburbia" project here (external link)! Mount St. Helens, Mount Hood pics here (external link)

  
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davidcrebelxt
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Sep 21, 2011 22:19 |  #9

Actually, that face-tagging is something I wish would be in LR... I may be an amateur, and face-tagging isn't for everyone... but anyone who says LR is solely for professionals is smoking something too! I found the auto-tagging in Picasa to be pretty good... (and most people don't take the time to realize that it doesn't take over your catalog and tag things willy-nilly... you still must approve the tags that it suggests.)

The content aware fill is something that has me looking to finally updating Elements.

But remember too, that you don't have to follow every upgrade cycle either... I think with Adobe products, you can now typically be 2 versions behind and still eligible for the discounted upgrade pricing. (LR's upgrade price has been @ $99... which I think is great... (also considering I got in early on at the ~$150 price point.) But that also means having the restraint to keep those new features from yourself while you wait for the NEXT release.

I'm still on LR2 because, while I like some of the new features, and image quality... they just didn't add enough to push LR to the 'next level' for me. Though at this point I'm itching for an upgrade and hoping LR4 is around the corner.


David C.
Equipment: Canon Dig. Rebel XT; 18-55mm EF-S; 28-105mm EF; 50mm 1.8 EF
Sigma ef-500 DG ST, Elements, Gimp, Lightroom
http://www.flickr.com/​photos/dcrebelxt (external link)

  
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whu-1
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Sep 22, 2011 00:00 |  #10

The face things from the review I’ve Sean it a little hit and miss, but played with the free download of elements 9 content aware fill and its pretty flash , and the puppy walking with the instruction mean even a Muppet like me can pick it up :D


My 2 pennies worth as I’m not making cash so
Light rooms at $400 over here , plus if you up grade say twice over 5 years at $150 it works out to big bucks . Around $900+ if left on the mortgage, cash towards a news body or lens up grade.

Elements is $200 for me its now a no brainer :rolleyes:

Funny I was expecting lots of it worth buying lightroom 3 because of x or w gismo you cant do in dpp and elements :cool:

btw how you go if you swoop computer ? need a new licence ?

p.s if light room had content aware fill and the face finding might be different :-)

Again thanks for the input bean a great help




  
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tonylong
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Sep 22, 2011 00:44 |  #11

As far as swapping computers, I'm not sure about Elements, but with Lightroom just doing a fresh install using your current serial# to register. Elements may be the same, but Photoshop CSx only allows two "activated" copies per licence. Check Elements Help -- see if they have an activate/deactivate option, or just a Registration option that "doesn't care" about other copies installed. Of course, if you only have one copy installed in a machine, then you are free to install on another machine...

As to the difference between Lightroom tools and Elements tools, well, yes, Lightroom follows the "Raw processing" model, and as such is not an "image editor" and so doesn't do graphical image manipulation. Lightroom was designed to be a great efficient "workflow manager" incorporating a state-of-the-art Raw processing "engine" (shared with Adobe Camera Raw), but when you want/need "fancy" image editing Elements, Photoshop CS or other editors are the place to go.


Tony
Two Canon cameras (5DC, 30D), three Canon lenses (24-105, 100-400, 100mm macro)
Tony Long Photos on PBase (external link)
Wildlife project pics here (external link), Biking Photog shoots here (external link), "Suburbia" project here (external link)! Mount St. Helens, Mount Hood pics here (external link)

  
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René ­ Damkot
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Sep 22, 2011 02:59 |  #12

whu-1 wrote in post #13143211 (external link)
btw how you go if you swoop computer ? need a new licence ?


http://prodesigntools.​com …rs-or-windows-to-mac.html (external link)


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dpp and elements or light room ?
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