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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 09 Oct 2011 (Sunday) 03:19
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Lens advice...I know you guys love it!

 
JackSw1ss
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Oct 09, 2011 03:19 |  #1

Hey guys,


long time not posting...
I'm here to share some of my doubts about the next purchase and maybe to find some advice.

I wanna buy a new lens. Here's the option/problem

Budget is limited to 2000 (of my currency...just don't bother about it...consider just 2000 and relatively prices that I'll give you) and there's not gonna be a future purchase in the near time....absolutely because I will pull the trigger heavily this time.

ssso, the options are:

1) buy the fantastic 50L which I find at 1540 and stop.
2) buy the 35L for 1400
3) buy the 35L and 50 1.4 for a total of 1800
4) buy the 5DII for a meeeere 1900 (price now is crazy low here where I live...)
I put also the option of the 5D because I WANT to go full frame ASAP...all is pulling me from doing it is 1, the 5D III, and 2, I shoot mainly sports.
Sometimes I do also other kind of works, I recently did 2 catalogs, a golf course's one and an art catalog. THERE I FELT THE NEED OF A FF...so as soon as I can my next purchase could be the next cool FF of canon.

my mental process and some consideration tell me this:
I have had a 7D for a year now...15000 shots, not many, I'm not a machine gunner and feel respect for the "click", never felt the need of upgrading until shot the catalogs...then i just felt the need and lust for a FF.
Tho even if I do several different stuff, sport is my main goal so the 5DII is just too slow for me now (never tried one on the field tho). So if I buy a 5D now keeping the 7D is a MUST.
If a new faster AF 5D comes then I would sell my 7D.

Next...Because I thought the FF purchase was not the case, I told myself "buy yourself a new glass, that's what metter the most" and here the other thoughts.
I have 16-35, 24-105 and 70-200 2.8 so my "upgrading area" would be the 24-105 FL range. I love the 50mm FOV tho if I see my pictures mainly of streetphotography (which I love a lot) my most used Fl is 35....ohhhh dang....
I tried both, the 35L and the 50L....must say I LOOOOVE the 50 because of the 1.2 which I used all the time and because it's "chunkier" meaning smaller, a bit more compact than the 35...I love to wal around the city with a "smaller" lens....yes, u heard it right...I just wish that a new 35mm would come out...weathersealed and smaller....it's waaay too similar to my 24-105 and I hate going around with a such big lens.
I love the quickness of the 35 tho, i just...oh well i dunno....

off course with the 50L i would just buy that and stop until a FF will come out next year in order to spare the money...off course the FL to upgrade is in between the 24-105...

35 would be the way to go, tho i have already the 16-35 with already beautiful 2.8, whereas the other FL's I'm stuck at f4...
I hate its size tho...really, bare with me but I hate it...

PS: ohh yeah I'd need to buy also a rotalux recta, and an octa, mmmmm....plus a mini softbox for when I'm on the run (sport shooting) with 430 and ....oooh yeah I need also to buy a 580...see????
bw!

well just back to the lens discussion
Any advice guys?suggestions?
sometimes just hearing other comments and other train of thoughts is really helpful.


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AlanU
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Oct 09, 2011 04:22 |  #2

if your gonna consider the 5dmk3 I'd imagine it'd be in the 3000 range so a 5dmk2 at the moment is insanely cheap. However your lens list it seriously lacks primes.

I'd suggest a 24L. Its great on a crop and the perspective you get with a FF is very pleasing IMO. 35L is a super safe bet with normal perspective on either format. Since I purchased a 24L I can see a different flavor in my style compared to using my 35L.

For your current options I'd say 35L and 50 f/1.4. This opens up low light available light shooting. Canon 50 f/1.4 is acceptably sharp at f/1.4 even to a pixel peeper IMO but if you pixel peep a 50L you better change your attitude. I look at the canon 50 f/1.4 as a good lens that will get upgraded when canon comes out with a 50 f/1.4 mk2 or until 50Lmk2 comes out in a decade or so LOL!!!


5Dmkiv |5Dmkiii | 24LmkII | 85 mkII L | | 16-35L mkII | 24-70 f/2.8L mkii| 70-200 f/2.8 ISL mkII| 600EX-RT x2 | 580 EX II x2 | Einstein's
Fuji - gone
Sony 2 x A7iii w/ Sigma MC-11 adapter | GM16-35 f/2.8 | Tamron 28-75 f/2.8 | GM70-200 f/2.8 |Sigma Art 24 f/1.4 | Sigma ART 35 f/1.2 | FE85 f/1.8 | Sigma ART 105 f/1.4 | Godox V860iiS & V1S

  
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marcosv
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Oct 09, 2011 11:33 |  #3

My buddy with a 7D and I with my 5D2 went through a similar exercise recently, trying to decide which prime to get next.

We both went with 35mm primes, but, for different reasons:

He went with 35L because he wanted a fast prime for available light and decided 50mm on an APS-C sensor was too tight, since he doesn't do that many classic head/torso portraits.

I went with a 35/2 because I wanted a small, fast prime for shallow DOF, but, wanted enough background in the image for environmental and so a 35mm was better than a 50mm on a full frame sensor. I bought the 35/2 because it was really small and my buddy already bought the 35L which I can borrow whenever I need it. That saved me a lot of money so that I can buy a 50L or 85L a lot sooner than later. :)

In short: I recommend the 35L unless you want to do portraits with your 7D.

If you decide to go 5D2, I recommend embracing the joys of non-L Canon primes. I got a 35/2, 50/1.4, and 100/2. These are *really* small compared to L glass. You can bring your zooms and a few primes without overloading your camera bag. A 85/1.8 is also a good choice over the 100/2, especially if you go 100 macro. More importantly, non-L primes are cheap enough that you can buy them shortly after going full frame. :)


EOS-M | 40D | 5DII | 5DIII | EF-M 22 | EF-M 18-55 | 10-22 | 17-55 | 17-40L | 24-70L mk II | 24-105L | 70-200/2.8L IS mk II| 35L | 85L II |35/2 | 40/2.8 pancake | 50/1.8 | 50/1.4 | 100/2 | Rokinon 14/2.8 | 90 EX | 270 EX II | 580 EXII | 600 EX-RT

  
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rick_reno
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Oct 09, 2011 11:35 |  #4

I wouldn't concern myself with the 5d3, you can't buy what doesn't exist. buying glass now and waiting a year for prices/availability/re​views on whatever Canon releases would be what I'd do.




  
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DreDaze
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Oct 09, 2011 12:30 |  #5

if you're sticking with a crop...maybe the sigma 30mm f1.4? it's pretty small compared to the L, and it's said to perform well

IMAGE NOT FOUND
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lightrules comparison:
http://www.pbase.com/l​ightrules/30v35_2nd (external link)

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Bananapie
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Oct 09, 2011 15:16 |  #6

You mention that you don't machine gun the 7D, but are worried about the 5Dii for sports. Could you clear this up for me a little bit please? =D

The gap between the 7D and the 5D2 autofocus isn't as wide as some people make it out to be, especially when we are talking centerpoint and apertures above 4.




  
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amfoto1
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Oct 09, 2011 15:18 |  #7

I'd suggest:

28/1.8 - very compact & the slightly wide view is nice on crop sensor cameras.)
50/1.4 - Siggy or Canon, more versatile and the Canon is smaller/lighter/less indtrusive than the f1.2
85/1.8 or Siggy 85/1.4 - You didn't mention, but if you enjoy 50mm on crop, you will probably like this lens too.

If you have any budget remaining, I really like 20/2.8 on crop, as a walk-around lens. It's considerably larger than the 28/1.8, but a nice lens and croppers use the very best part of the lens (I use and like it on FF, too).


Alan Myers (external link) "Walk softly and carry a big lens."
5DII, 7DII(x2), 7D(x2) & other cameras. 10-22mm, Tokina 12-24/4, 20/2.8, TS 24/3.5L, 24-70/2.8L, 28/1.8, 28-135 IS (x2), TS 45/2.8, 50/1.4, Tamron 60/2.0, 70-200/4L IS, 70-200/2.8 IS, 85/1.8, Tamron 90/2.5 Macro, 100/2.8 USM, 100-400L II, 135/2L, 180/3.5L, 300/4L IS (x2), 300/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, EF 1.4X II, EF 2X II. Flashes, studio strobes & various access. - FLICKR (external link) - ZENFOLIO (external link)

  
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amfoto1
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Oct 09, 2011 15:28 |  #8

Bananapie wrote in post #13225751 (external link)
You mention that you don't machine gun the 7D, but are worried about the 5Dii for sports. Could you clear this up for me a little bit please? =D

The gap between the 7D and the 5D2 autofocus isn't as wide as some people make it out to be, especially when we are talking centerpoint and apertures above 4.

Using both cameras alongside each other for the past couple years, 5D2 is nowhere near as good tracking moving subjects as 7D (or 60D, 50D, 40D, for that matter). That's the main problem trying to use 5DII with sports.

Is it possible to use a 5DII to shoot sports? Sure... but you'll get lots more missed focus shots when using AI Servo, even if just with the center AF point. Where I get 95% or better acceptible focus hits with 7D, that usually drops below 60% shooting the same subjects the same way with 5DII.

Sure, I might be able to improve on it a little if I practiced more with 5DII, but I can't afford a high percentage of camera-related focus misses... so I usually don't get the 5DII out for sports/action.

Plus the 5D's outer points (and hidden "assist/expansion" points) are not cross-type. AF speed and responsiveness drops off a lot when you switch to using any of those. Meanwhle, all 19 of the 7D's are cross-type. (All 9 of the 60D, 50D, 40D's are, too.) There's little drop in performance using other than the center point with 7D.


Alan Myers (external link) "Walk softly and carry a big lens."
5DII, 7DII(x2), 7D(x2) & other cameras. 10-22mm, Tokina 12-24/4, 20/2.8, TS 24/3.5L, 24-70/2.8L, 28/1.8, 28-135 IS (x2), TS 45/2.8, 50/1.4, Tamron 60/2.0, 70-200/4L IS, 70-200/2.8 IS, 85/1.8, Tamron 90/2.5 Macro, 100/2.8 USM, 100-400L II, 135/2L, 180/3.5L, 300/4L IS (x2), 300/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, EF 1.4X II, EF 2X II. Flashes, studio strobes & various access. - FLICKR (external link) - ZENFOLIO (external link)

  
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JackSw1ss
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Oct 09, 2011 15:57 |  #9

AlanU wrote in post #13224136 (external link)
if your gonna consider the 5dmk3 I'd imagine it'd be in the 3000 range so a 5dmk2 at the moment is insanely cheap. However your lens list it seriously lacks primes.

I'd suggest a 24L. Its great on a crop and the perspective you get with a FF is very pleasing IMO. 35L is a super safe bet with normal perspective on either format. Since I purchased a 24L I can see a different flavor in my style compared to using my 35L.

For your current options I'd say 35L and 50 f/1.4. This opens up low light available light shooting. Canon 50 f/1.4 is acceptably sharp at f/1.4 even to a pixel peeper IMO but if you pixel peep a 50L you better change your attitude. I look at the canon 50 f/1.4 as a good lens that will get upgraded when canon comes out with a 50 f/1.4 mk2 or until 50Lmk2 comes out in a decade or so LOL!!!

24 is out of question since I use that Fl almost never.
I love everything of the 35 (having tried it) but the size and weathersealing absence. but really the size and shape it's really bothering me, I know sounds silly but it's like that.
though it still tempt me because I could get both the 35 and 50 1.4 for a little more than the 50 1.2 itself...that's the only thing positive for this option.
I used the 50 1.4 thoroughly and well I was not happy...not much...sure it delivered some good pictures but bokeh is terrible (at least on the copy i used) and USM on mine was ugly

marcosv wrote in post #13225014 (external link)
My buddy with a 7D and I with my 5D2 went through a similar exercise recently, trying to decide which prime to get next.

We both went with 35mm primes, but, for different reasons:

He went with 35L because he wanted a fast prime for available light and decided 50mm on an APS-C sensor was too tight, since he doesn't do that many classic head/torso portraits.

I went with a 35/2 because I wanted a small, fast prime for shallow DOF, but, wanted enough background in the image for environmental and so a 35mm was better than a 50mm on a full frame sensor. I bought the 35/2 because it was really small and my buddy already bought the 35L which I can borrow whenever I need it. That saved me a lot of money so that I can buy a 50L or 85L a lot sooner than later. :)

In short: I recommend the 35L unless you want to do portraits with your 7D.

If you decide to go 5D2, I recommend embracing the joys of non-L Canon primes. I got a 35/2, 50/1.4, and 100/2. These are *really* small compared to L glass. You can bring your zooms and a few primes without overloading your camera bag. A 85/1.8 is also a good choice over the 100/2, especially if you go 100 macro. More importantly, non-L primes are cheap enough that you can buy them shortly after going full frame. :)

i can see the joy on the 85-100 non L lenses, i've tried them and they are indeed beautiful...but I dont use them much and wont buy them in the short time...my 70-200 is just incredible and when I need it I put it on my camera and vavaaavuuum. that's the only lens where I pulled the trigger immediately as I had the money, no thoughts no regrets.

rick_reno wrote in post #13225019 (external link)
I wouldn't concern myself with the 5d3, you can't buy what doesn't exist. buying glass now and waiting a year for prices/availability/re​views on whatever Canon releases would be what I'd do.

yeah I know but as soon as a new FF arrives (if it will be a bit more kind with the sport aspect of photography) I'll pull the trigger

DreDaze wrote in post #13225212 (external link)
if you're sticking with a crop...maybe the sigma 30mm f1.4? it's pretty small compared to the L, and it's said to perform well
IMAGE NOT FOUND
HTTP response: NOT FOUND | MIME changed to 'binary/octet-stream'


click image for link back to review

lightrules comparison:
http://www.pbase.com/l​ightrules/30v35_2nd (external link)

The only thing keeping me from buying the 30 sigma is the possibility of going FF in the next 6 months or 8 maaaaximum...dont wanna stick with 1.6x for another year...maybe just keeping it for FL reach, that's it.
I've consider it, very nice little lens...but for me, here where I live, selling used stuff it's a pain in the ass almost...so If I can I buy once, once good and stop.
28 1.8 as stated below is another option I'm considering, though it's a bit too wide for me...still considering it though

Bananapie wrote in post #13225751 (external link)
You mention that you don't machine gun the 7D, but are worried about the 5Dii for sports. Could you clear this up for me a little bit please? =D

The gap between the 7D and the 5D2 autofocus isn't as wide as some people make it out to be, especially when we are talking centerpoint and apertures above 4.

yeah sorry a bit misleading...
I mean that i don't shoot like crazy but I fully use the 7D's sport capabilities when it's necessary.
for example on panning which I love to do I thoroughly use the superb 8fps she can deliver!
I also fully use it for flash panning shots...
but the more important thing is the tracking...sometimes in some spots the center af single point (which I 90-95% use) just doesnt get it and I must use the ai servo. not everytime but when I need it my 7D never let me down.

amfoto1 wrote in post #13225768 (external link)
I'd suggest:

28/1.8 - very compact & the slightly wide view is nice on crop sensor cameras.)
50/1.4 - Siggy or Canon, more versatile and the Canon is smaller/lighter/less indtrusive than the f1.2
85/1.8 or Siggy 85/1.4 - You didn't mention, but if you enjoy 50mm on crop, you will probably like this lens too.

If you have any budget remaining, I really like 20/2.8 on crop, as a walk-around lens. It's considerably larger than the 28/1.8, but a nice lens and croppers use the very best part of the lens (I use and like it on FF, too).

as said above I'm considering the 28...I like that lens tho it's a bit wider even on the crop for my taste, but still, very much considering it. you have anyway to let some bucks flying out your pocket, it's not free LOL.

amfoto1 wrote in post #13225801 (external link)
Using both cameras alongside each other for the past couple years, 5D2 is nowhere near as good tracking moving subjects as 7D (or 60D, 50D, 40D, for that matter). That's the main problem trying to use 5DII with sports.

Is it possible to use a 5DII to shoot sports? Sure... but you'll get lots more missed focus shots when using AI Servo, even if just with the center AF point. Where I get 95% or better acceptible focus hits with 7D, that usually drops below 60% shooting the same subjects the same way with 5DII.

Sure, I might be able to improve on it a little if I practiced more with 5DII, but I can't afford a high percentage of camera-related focus misses... so I usually don't get the 5DII out for sports/action.

Plus the 5D's outer points (and hidden "assist/expansion" points) are not cross-type. AF speed and responsiveness drops off a lot when you switch to using any of those. Meanwhle, all 19 of the 7D's are cross-type. (All 9 of the 60D, 50D, 40D's are, too.) There's little drop in performance using other than the center point with 7D.

THIS bw!


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AlanU
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Oct 09, 2011 17:58 |  #10

I'd go 35L before touching a 28 f/1.8 if you have the bucks.

Whats interesting is I use to think the 50mm on a full frame was great. Later I purchased a 35L and found the FL to simply work. Now that I went for a 24Lmk2 its completely changed my game. If you spoke to me 2yrs ago I'd never even consider the lens or FL. I borrowed a friends 24L and discovered the perspective to be very different to a normal almost boring 35L perspective (too normal). Mind you I still use the 35L alot for the comfort zone when I shoot.


5Dmkiv |5Dmkiii | 24LmkII | 85 mkII L | | 16-35L mkII | 24-70 f/2.8L mkii| 70-200 f/2.8 ISL mkII| 600EX-RT x2 | 580 EX II x2 | Einstein's
Fuji - gone
Sony 2 x A7iii w/ Sigma MC-11 adapter | GM16-35 f/2.8 | Tamron 28-75 f/2.8 | GM70-200 f/2.8 |Sigma Art 24 f/1.4 | Sigma ART 35 f/1.2 | FE85 f/1.8 | Sigma ART 105 f/1.4 | Godox V860iiS & V1S

  
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danny819
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Oct 09, 2011 18:06 |  #11

If and when the 5DIII comes out, it won't fit your budget of $2000. The autofocus from the 5D Classic is not much different from the 5DII. If you don't need the high ISO and can work with no live view, then I would say get the 5D Classic and spend the difference on lenses.


5Dc | 17-40L | 35L | 85 1.8

  
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JackSw1ss
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Oct 10, 2011 07:06 |  #12

AlanU wrote in post #13226351 (external link)
I'd go 35L before touching a 28 f/1.8 if you have the bucks.

Whats interesting is I use to think the 50mm on a full frame was great. Later I purchased a 35L and found the FL to simply work. Now that I went for a 24Lmk2 its completely changed my game. If you spoke to me 2yrs ago I'd never even consider the lens or FL. I borrowed a friends 24L and discovered the perspective to be very different to a normal almost boring 35L perspective (too normal). Mind you I still use the 35L alot for the comfort zone when I shoot.

I usually like tighter shots and found that 35mm for me it's great on crop...thus 50 on FF. Later I will buy the 85 1.8 for sure...but not now, I just don't use that fl.
but I could live for a period with a 50 on crop....i dunno maybe i'm just too confused and need to let some time go by and decide later.

danny819 wrote in post #13226387 (external link)
If and when the 5DIII comes out, it won't fit your budget of $2000. The autofocus from the 5D Classic is not much different from the 5DII. If you don't need the high ISO and can work with no live view, then I would say get the 5D Classic and spend the difference on lenses.

the 2000 budget is for now and it's not in US $, it's 2000 CHF, almost = to about 2200 US $ as today currency...it's not meant not for the 5mk III...I sparing in the little "pig-safe" (LOL) the money for the new FF for about ages now ahaha...


I was still lookin early this morning for the 5DII and saw it dropped at what it would be for u guys about 2080 dollars (1900 CHF, swiss francs...) that's pretty insanely cheap...I might consider it if they'll apply the announced end october rebates...if it goes to 1950 $ (for me 1800 CHF) i might seriously consider it.

And as far as lenses I might convince my GF to make me a 50 1.4 (sigma or canon) as a gift for xmas...stick with it for some time and then later upgrade to L's in the future...how does it sounds?


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DreDaze
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Oct 10, 2011 15:09 |  #13

JackSw1ss wrote in post #13225914 (external link)
The only thing keeping me from buying the 30 sigma is the possibility of going FF in the next 6 months or 8 maaaaximum...dont wanna stick with 1.6x for another year...maybe just keeping it for FL reach, that's it.
I've consider it, very nice little lens...but for me, here where I live, selling used stuff it's a pain in the ass almost...so If I can I buy once, once good and stop.
28 1.8 as stated below is another option I'm considering, though it's a bit too wide for me...still considering it though

even if say you bought the 35L...why all of a sudden do you think you'll love that wider focal length on a FF camera...you mention how you want it because of the 50mm type view it gives you...well when you upgrade all of a sudden you'll have a wider lens that isn't going to fit your wants/needs...so you may have to sell that anyways


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dylshi
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Oct 11, 2011 02:07 as a reply to  @ DreDaze's post |  #14

Where can you get a 5DII for a mere 1900?




  
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JackSw1ss
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Oct 11, 2011 04:18 |  #15

dylshi wrote in post #13233344 (external link)
Where can you get a 5DII for a mere 1900?

i was talking swiss francs currency (in fact I put also the conversion for ya all..


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