Approve the Cookies
This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and our Privacy Policy.
OK
Index  •   • New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Guest
New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Register to forums    Log in

 
FORUMS Post Processing, Marketing & Presenting Photos The Business of Photography 
Thread started 05 Jan 2012 (Thursday) 15:00
Search threadPrev/next
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

use of RAW images

 
zilos
Member
47 posts
Joined Apr 2010
Location: Brentwood, CA
     
Jan 05, 2012 15:00 |  #1

ok fellow Photogs, here is my question to all you pros out there.

I recently did a wedding shoot about 2 months ago. Everything turned out great. Some small hiccups with some corrupted files, but it all was fixed and good to go.

So i get an email saying the bride would like all the RAW edited images because she wants her family member to edit the images. I told her it was ok to get all the raw images under one condition. I would have full rights once the edits are done.

My question is, do I need to make another contract for this? Do i need to state that once the images are edited and completed by this other person that the raw files are still copyrighted to me? What would be the best way to approach this?

Thanks all in advance.


zilosphoto.com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)
Dan ­ Marchant
Do people actually believe in the Title Fairy?
Avatar
5,292 posts
Gallery: 19 photos
Likes: 1564
Joined Oct 2011
Location: Where I'm from is unimportant, it's where I'm going that counts.
     
Jan 06, 2012 01:15 |  #2

Editing your images without permission would be copyright infringement so yes, you do need to give them a license agreement that includes editing the images in the "acceptable usage" list. There are a whole bunch of other issues to consider as well. If the retoucher posts these images in their portfolio you should get a credit as the photographer (and they should ONLY be allowed to post them in their portfolio). You shouldn't need to tell them that they can't sell the images... but you should to be on the safe side. Also, if your business model revolves around selling prints you should be aware that, once they have digital files, there almost certainly won't be any print sales.


Dan Marchant
Website/blog: danmarchant.com (external link)
Instagram: @dan_marchant (external link)
Gear Canon 5DIII + Fuji X-T2 + lenses + a plastic widget I found in the camera box.

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
tim
Light Bringer
Avatar
50,973 posts
Likes: 355
Joined Nov 2004
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
     
Jan 06, 2012 03:56 |  #3

Pretty much no pro wedding photographer would give away the raws. Now you've agreed just give them to them, why would you want their edits? Just tell them the condition is they can't be shown in public or online if your name is associated with them without your approval, in case they do horrible edits.


Professional wedding photographer, solution architect and general technical guy with multiple Amazon Web Services certifications.
Read all my FAQs (wedding, printing, lighting, books, etc)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Curtis ­ N
Master Flasher
Avatar
19,129 posts
Likes: 8
Joined Apr 2005
Location: Northern Illinois, US
     
Jan 06, 2012 06:18 |  #4

zilos wrote in post #13652564 (external link)
I told her it was ok to get all the raw images under one condition. I would have full rights once the edits are done.

Good luck with that. You won't sell another print from this wedding.


"If you're not having fun, your pictures will reflect that." - Joe McNally
Chicago area POTN events (external link)
Flash Photography 101 | The EOS Flash Bible  (external link)| Techniques for Better On-Camera Flash (external link) | How to Use Flash Outdoors| Excel-based DOF Calculator (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
ssim
POTN Landscape & Cityscape Photographer 2005
Avatar
10,884 posts
Likes: 4
Joined Apr 2003
Location: southern Alberta, Canada
     
Jan 06, 2012 13:25 |  #5

Curtis N wrote in post #13656104 (external link)
Good luck with that. You won't sell another print from this wedding.

I agree with that and would never relinquish any of my raw files. I sell a lot of prints so that is important to me. However, I am surprised as the number of photographers that don't like to do this and do give full sized JPG files on disk. It's their personal choice to do so but you are leaving a lot of money behind.

I would hope the OP is charging them a high rate for this.


My life is like one big RAW file....way too much post processing needed.
Sheldon Simpson | My Gallery (external link) | My Gear updated: 20JUL12

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
JacobPhoto
Goldmember
1,434 posts
Likes: 39
Joined Jun 2005
Location: La Verne, Cali
     
Jan 06, 2012 14:26 |  #6

My brother got married in October. I was in the wedding party, and this was my first exposure to being the subject of images.

Prints started at $25 per 4x6, with lots of discounts rolling out (50% off for the first 2 weeks, 25% off for the next 2 weeks, free shipping for the month of December, buy 1 get 1 free on 8x10's for a few weeks, etc).

The website offered some watermarked low-res proofs, of which I screen-capped a few to put on my facebook. Instantly, everyone else in the wedding part hit me up asking how to get some free pics for facebook (the website was wisely right-click disabled and had several other protections to try to guard against saving the images). We ended up buying a few prints for my parents and for her parents, and the bride and groom bought a book, but everyone else just screen capped some photos and called it good (after my guidance on how to do it).

Had 1 CD been released to anyone associated with the wedding, everyone in the wedding would have made their own prints and facebook images, and the photographer would have seen $0 additional revenue.


~ Canon 7d / 5D ~ Novatron strobe setup + Vagabond
~ Some L glass, some flashes, the usual

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Brandon72
Member
246 posts
Joined Oct 2011
     
Jan 06, 2012 16:25 |  #7

JacobPhoto wrote in post #13658463 (external link)
The website offered some watermarked low-res proofs, of which I screen-capped a few to put on my facebook. Instantly, everyone else in the wedding part hit me up asking how to get some free pics for facebook (the website was wisely right-click disabled and had several other protections to try to guard against saving the images). We ended up buying a few prints for my parents and for her parents, and the bride and groom bought a book, but everyone else just screen capped some photos and called it good (after my guidance on how to do it).

Had 1 CD been released to anyone associated with the wedding, everyone in the wedding would have made their own prints and facebook images, and the photographer would have seen $0 additional revenue.

So, if I hire you as my photographer, is it ok if I just buy a single 4x6 at a discount for oh say around $5 bucks and then just make 50 copies for friends and family? Or is it only ok to steal when it's digital? What sort of photographer brags about doing this on a photography forum of all places?




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
HappySnapper90
Cream of the Crop
5,145 posts
Likes: 3
Joined Aug 2008
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
     
Jan 06, 2012 19:52 |  #8

This sounds like a request for additional products/services and a chance to get paid more! Don't hand over your RAW files without being fairly compensated for them. Also I would hang onto the copyright so you'd have to grant them some sort of license to use the RAW files. But if it were me I would not since they would be producing your photographs but you would not have control over how good or bad they end up which will in the end reflect good or bad upon you since not everyone is skilled at developing RAW files.




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
GadgetRick
Goldmember
1,081 posts
Joined Mar 2010
Location: Jacksonville, FL
     
Jan 07, 2012 07:54 as a reply to  @ HappySnapper90's post |  #9

Personally I NEVER give up the RAW images. They don't need to see them...period. I've only ever gotten one request (from a jerk promoter at an MMA event I shot--long story). The RAW files won't look good to the unexperienced photographer. I don't want those files floating around anywhere.




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
zilos
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
47 posts
Joined Apr 2010
Location: Brentwood, CA
     
Jan 07, 2012 10:43 |  #10

thanks everyone for your great feedback! I really appreciate it. Yes, i did do a mistake in telling them i would let them have the RAW images, but I will make sure to have something in writing statig that I have full rights to the files and that the other editor will not be able to show the images on their portfolio and such, unless i get credit for taking the photo.

I guess its a lesson well learned. This was my first time dealing with this and of course, my last. We all learn somehow. BUt its great to know there are places like this forum that have great advice.

THank you all.


zilosphoto.com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Bosscat
Goldmember
1,892 posts
Joined Apr 2005
Location: Ontario Canada
     
Jan 07, 2012 19:40 |  #11

JacobPhoto wrote in post #13658463 (external link)
The website offered some watermarked low-res proofs, of which I screen-capped a few to put on my facebook. Instantly, everyone else in the wedding part hit me up asking how to get some free pics for facebook (the website was wisely right-click disabled and had several other protections to try to guard against saving the images). We ended up buying a few prints for my parents and for her parents, and the bride and groom bought a book, but everyone else just screen capped some photos and called it good (after my guidance on how to do it).

Had 1 CD been released to anyone associated with the wedding, everyone in the wedding would have made their own prints and facebook images, and the photographer would have seen $0 additional revenue.

Well aren't you a bundle of joy to the profession of photography!!!


Your camera is alot smarter than the "M" Zealots would have you believe

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
rob0225
Senior Member
284 posts
Likes: 13
Joined May 2011
     
Jan 07, 2012 21:05 |  #12

JacobPhoto wrote in post #13658463 (external link)
My brother got married in October. I was in the wedding party, and this was my first exposure to being the subject of images.

Prints started at $25 per 4x6, with lots of discounts rolling out (50% off for the first 2 weeks, 25% off for the next 2 weeks, free shipping for the month of December, buy 1 get 1 free on 8x10's for a few weeks, etc)..

not to get off topic...but $25 for a 4*6 seems extremely expensive.


http://www.randsphoto.​com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Bosscat
Goldmember
1,892 posts
Joined Apr 2005
Location: Ontario Canada
     
Jan 07, 2012 21:11 |  #13

rob0225 wrote in post #13665426 (external link)
not to get off topic...but $25 for a 4*6 seems extremely expensive.

People seem to like to scan prints these days, so they don't have pay for enlargements, so what else is one to do to make up for lost income because of this practise?


Your camera is alot smarter than the "M" Zealots would have you believe

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
cdifoto
Don't get pissy with me
Avatar
34,090 posts
Likes: 39
Joined Dec 2005
     
Jan 07, 2012 21:24 |  #14

Brandon72 wrote in post #13659231 (external link)
So, if I hire you as my photographer, is it ok if I just buy a single 4x6 at a discount for oh say around $5 bucks and then just make 50 copies for friends and family? Or is it only ok to steal when it's digital? What sort of photographer brags about doing this on a photography forum of all places?

Bosscat wrote in post #13665105 (external link)
Well aren't you a bundle of joy to the profession of photography!!!

I don't think he's bragging. He's letting you know the reality of what happens after you put the digitals out there on the world wide web.

You're living in a bubble if you think people don't share digital proofs, take pictures of prints, scan prints, etc.


Did you lose Digital Photo Professional (DPP)? Get it here (external link). Cursing at your worse-than-a-map reflector? Check out this vid! (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
cdifoto
Don't get pissy with me
Avatar
34,090 posts
Likes: 39
Joined Dec 2005
     
Jan 07, 2012 21:26 |  #15

rob0225 wrote in post #13665426 (external link)
not to get off topic...but $25 for a 4*6 seems extremely expensive.

It's not really. Mine are $40 for the first and $10 for each additional copy. I can't speak for the other guy but my prints are always hand retouched and that takes time.


Did you lose Digital Photo Professional (DPP)? Get it here (external link). Cursing at your worse-than-a-map reflector? Check out this vid! (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

3,147 views & 0 likes for this thread
use of RAW images
FORUMS Post Processing, Marketing & Presenting Photos The Business of Photography 
AAA
x 1600
y 1600

Jump to forum...   •  Rules   •  Index   •  New posts   •  RTAT   •  'Best of'   •  Gallery   •  Gear   •  Reviews   •  Member list   •  Polls   •  Image rules   •  Search   •  Password reset

Not a member yet?
Register to forums
Registered members may log in to forums and access all the features: full search, image upload, follow forums, own gear list and ratings, likes, more forums, private messaging, thread follow, notifications, own gallery, all settings, view hosted photos, own reviews, see more and do more... and all is free. Don't be a stranger - register now and start posting!


COOKIES DISCLAIMER: This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and to our privacy policy.
Privacy policy and cookie usage info.


POWERED BY AMASS forum software 2.1forum software
version 2.1 /
code and design
by Pekka Saarinen ©
for photography-on-the.net

Latest registered member is Car147
2029 guests, 192 members online
Simultaneous users record so far is 15144, that happened on Nov 22, 2018

Photography-on-the.net Digital Photography Forums is the website for photographers and all who love great photos, camera and post processing techniques, gear talk, discussion and sharing. Professionals, hobbyists, newbies and those who don't even own a camera -- all are welcome regardless of skill, favourite brand, gear, gender or age. Registering and usage is free.