Approve the Cookies
This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and our Privacy Policy.
OK
Index  •   • New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Guest
New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Register to forums    Log in

 
FORUMS Post Processing, Marketing & Presenting Photos The Business of Photography 
Thread started 20 Jan 2012 (Friday) 20:58
Search threadPrev/next
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

Am I giving up the gig?

 
djtwigsta
Member
210 posts
Likes: 2
Joined Jan 2011
Location: Boston MA
     
Jan 20, 2012 20:58 |  #1

Curious question... I took a automotive picture that a wheel company is interested in because it has their wheels on it. I sent the image to them as a teaser because I knew it would be interesting (was from a show booth) and I know the owner/builder. The wheel company asked me to give contact information etc of the auto. At this point I provided I was a photographer with great port/publication work and would do the shoot. The wheel company then forwarded to their photog department which then informed they already had another photog in the area. This led to them asking again for the contact information and sending me company swag for it (t-shirt etc) in return. So my question is doesnt this feel like I led them to a job for another photographer if I hand over the contact info? Kind of seems like I'm putting myself out of a gig. I'm trying to break out into the automotive industry and have several mag publications coming out etc. this year. Anyone else with experience or knowledge of the system on how I should handle this. Thanks and let me know if I need to fill in any holes...


1995 Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham Lowrider
TWiG Photography!!! (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)
Ledrak
Senior Member
266 posts
Likes: 1
Joined May 2007
     
Jan 20, 2012 23:50 |  #2

The way I see it is, they're not interested in using your pic or your services (for whatever reason)... they're interested in the car that has their wheels on it. Maybe they want to have their own photog go out and shoot it, or maybe they want to strike some deal with the owner for something more. Who knows....

If it's just about getting pics of the car, then you can simply give them an ultimatum. Tell them it's your friends car, or your car if you want to go that route (not exactly the ethical way), and that you can arrange for them to get all the pics they want no prob. But... If they want pics of the car, they either go through you or they get nothing. If they want the pics bad enough then they'll do it your way. If not, then you loose out. If they walk, then you weren't going to win anyways, so what do you really have to loose?




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
JacobPhoto
Goldmember
1,434 posts
Likes: 39
Joined Jun 2005
Location: La Verne, Cali
     
Jan 21, 2012 01:00 |  #3

as someone who does a lot of photography for automotive companies, I can tell you that companies tend to like to work with people they have worked with before. Different companies have different expectations, but it's much easier to work with people who understand what is expected than to 'try out' a new photographer on a shoot and not have it work out for whatever reason, then have to line up a new shoot.

If you try and use the contact info as leverage, one of two situations will likely occur:
1 - the company will find another way to contact that car owner, and you're out of the picture
2 - the company will decide that it's not worth the hassle, and then you're out of the picture and your friend is out of the picture

The best thing you can do is give them the info and offer to stay in touch with them, possibly providing images of the car in the future from an event or from your own shoot just as a reference. Perhaps they'll use you, perhaps they wont.


~ Canon 7d / 5D ~ Novatron strobe setup + Vagabond
~ Some L glass, some flashes, the usual

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Phil ­ V
Goldmember
1,977 posts
Likes: 75
Joined Jan 2005
Location: S Yorks UK
     
Jan 22, 2012 02:27 |  #4

Not to sound harsh but, they've made it clear that you're not getting the job.

Your choice is whether to be the nice guy or whether to be a jerk!


Gear List
website: South Yorkshire Wedding photographer in Doncaster (external link)
Twitter (external link)Facebook (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
ChunkyDA
Goldmember
Avatar
3,707 posts
Gallery: 17 photos
Likes: 88
Joined Apr 2007
Location: Emerald Coast, FL
     
Jan 22, 2012 09:05 |  #5

If you are trying to break into the car-photo industry, you will probably need all the friends you can get. Withholding information does not make friends.


Dave
Support Search and Rescue, Get Lost (external link)
Gear list and some feedback

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
ssim
POTN Landscape & Cityscape Photographer 2005
Avatar
10,884 posts
Likes: 5
Joined Apr 2003
Location: southern Alberta, Canada
     
Jan 23, 2012 14:20 |  #6

Phil V wrote in post #13746674 (external link)
Not to sound harsh but, they've made it clear that you're not getting the job.

Your choice is whether to be the nice guy or whether to be a jerk!

ChunkyDA wrote in post #13747513 (external link)
If you are trying to break into the car-photo industry, you will probably need all the friends you can get. Withholding information does not make friends.

These two posts sum up my opinion as well. Many businesses enter into collaborative working arrangements. You can give them the info you are holding back in the hopes of something happening down the road or you can continue to hold it and they will see that for what it is and you will probably never get a shot with them. I would say be an adult about it and provide it to them along with a simple statement about your desire to work with them in the future. You at least stand a chance this way, if you hold back you will be remembered for all the wrong reasons.


My life is like one big RAW file....way too much post processing needed.
Sheldon Simpson | My Gallery (external link) | My Gear updated: 20JUL12

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
djtwigsta
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
210 posts
Likes: 2
Joined Jan 2011
Location: Boston MA
     
Jan 23, 2012 17:20 |  #7

Right... it was as I seemed but wanted to make sure. This is other advice I received " I shoot commercial stuff and most companies have pretty tight rules on how they want things shot. Once they find someone they like to work with and who knows their requirements, they usually want to use them exclusively. What you do depends on what you want out of them. If you hold out on the info because you want to do the shoot, the wheel may not be that important to them and they will drop it. Plus you can probably say good bye to them ever using for something like this in the future. On the other hand if you are looking for a relationship with them, you can give them the info, let them shoot it. This may give you a foot in the door for future shoots, if they liked your work to begin with. One of the wheel companies I shoot for won't use shots by other people, except on rare occasions when they need a particular wheel shot and the photography is kick ass."

So I'm going the right path and 'working' with them. Thanks for the input and hope it helps others.


1995 Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham Lowrider
TWiG Photography!!! (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
S.Horton
worship my useful and insightful comments
Avatar
18,051 posts
Gallery: 7 photos
Likes: 117
Joined Dec 2006
Location: Royersford, PA
     
Jan 23, 2012 17:43 |  #8

Ask for the name of the other photographer, call them up, and ask for a job.

You can't help what happened here.

If it makes you fell any better, this, and worse, is common in consulting and writing.

Keep moving forward.


Sam - TF Says Ishmael
http://midnightblue.sm​ugmug.com (external link) 
Want your title changed?Dream On! (external link)

:cool:

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
CameraMan
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
13,337 posts
Gallery: 26 photos
Likes: 743
Joined Dec 2010
Location: In The Sticks
     
Jan 23, 2012 17:56 |  #9

If they already have a photog in the area then they probably don't want to pay you for photos. They'd rather have the guy they're already paying do the work since he's in the area. I would set up the gig, meet with the photographer and see if he can't help get you in to the business. It's good business sense for the company to hire their own employees in the area than risk getting shots back that they don't want. So, no. You probably never had the gig to begin with. Just my $.02


Photographer (external link) | The Toys! | Facebook (external link) | Video (external link) | Flickr (external link)
Shampoo sounds like an unfortunate name for a hair product.
You're a ghost driving a meat-coated skeleton made from stardust, riding a rock, hurtling through space. Fear Nothing!

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
JacobPhoto
Goldmember
1,434 posts
Likes: 39
Joined Jun 2005
Location: La Verne, Cali
     
Jan 24, 2012 12:10 |  #10

djtwigsta wrote in post #13755811 (external link)
Right... it was as I seemed but wanted to make sure. This is other advice I received " I shoot commercial stuff and most companies have pretty tight rules on how they want things shot. Once they find someone they like to work with and who knows their requirements, they usually want to use them exclusively. What you do depends on what you want out of them. If you hold out on the info because you want to do the shoot, the wheel may not be that important to them and they will drop it. Plus you can probably say good bye to them ever using for something like this in the future. On the other hand if you are looking for a relationship with them, you can give them the info, let them shoot it. This may give you a foot in the door for future shoots, if they liked your work to begin with. One of the wheel companies I shoot for won't use shots by other people, except on rare occasions when they need a particular wheel shot and the photography is kick ass."

So I'm going the right path and 'working' with them. Thanks for the input and hope it helps others.

isn't that exactly what I said? :rolleyes:

CameraMan wrote in post #13756051 (external link)
If they already have a photog in the area then they probably don't want to pay you for photos. They'd rather have the guy they're already paying do the work since he's in the area. I would set up the gig, meet with the photographer and see if he can't help get you in to the business. It's good business sense for the company to hire their own employees in the area than risk getting shots back that they don't want. So, no. You probably never had the gig to begin with. Just my $.02

Why would a photographer help someone new take their business away from them?


~ Canon 7d / 5D ~ Novatron strobe setup + Vagabond
~ Some L glass, some flashes, the usual

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
djtwigsta
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
210 posts
Likes: 2
Joined Jan 2011
Location: Boston MA
     
Jan 24, 2012 13:37 |  #11

Yes JacobPhoto and I'm sure you dont mind the confirmation ;)

Looks like they will be keeping me in the loop and possibly meeting said photog. Either way good learning experience.


1995 Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham Lowrider
TWiG Photography!!! (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
CameraMan
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
13,337 posts
Gallery: 26 photos
Likes: 743
Joined Dec 2010
Location: In The Sticks
     
Jan 24, 2012 13:59 |  #12

JacobPhoto wrote in post #13760354 (external link)
Why would a photographer help someone new take their business away from them?

If I worked for a company that needed photographers and I happened to meet up with a photographer who might have some skill and looking for work I'd tell him that they're looking for someone in another area. I am currently working this area so you'll probably have to work another area if they hire you.


Photographer (external link) | The Toys! | Facebook (external link) | Video (external link) | Flickr (external link)
Shampoo sounds like an unfortunate name for a hair product.
You're a ghost driving a meat-coated skeleton made from stardust, riding a rock, hurtling through space. Fear Nothing!

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Phil ­ V
Goldmember
1,977 posts
Likes: 75
Joined Jan 2005
Location: S Yorks UK
     
Jan 24, 2012 14:47 |  #13

JacobPhoto wrote in post #13760354 (external link)
Why would a photographer help someone new take their business away from them?

It'll be difficult to find a photographer or other small businessman who hasn't helped others in the business from time to time. It's complicated but everything from a selfish belief that there's some kind of payback to altruism are reasons for people to be nice to other people.;)


Gear List
website: South Yorkshire Wedding photographer in Doncaster (external link)
Twitter (external link)Facebook (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Gameface
Senior Member
Avatar
672 posts
Joined Mar 2011
Location: Boston
     
Jan 24, 2012 14:50 |  #14
bannedPermanent ban

In one hand you have free swag, in the other hand you have nothing. Tough choice. Frankly they don't need to give you anything. They didn't pay you to take the picture, you took it and gave it to them. If I see an Oakley athlete and take a picture of them and send it to Oakley, who would think they would call me to shoot for them when they probably already have a stable of photogs they work with?




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
CameraMan
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
13,337 posts
Gallery: 26 photos
Likes: 743
Joined Dec 2010
Location: In The Sticks
     
Jan 24, 2012 15:20 |  #15

Phil V wrote in post #13761272 (external link)
It's complicated but everything from a selfish belief that there's some kind of payback to altruism are reasons for people to be nice to other people.;)

I'm nice to everyone... until they screw me over or attempt to screw me over. If I can save my neck... LOOK OUT! :)


Photographer (external link) | The Toys! | Facebook (external link) | Video (external link) | Flickr (external link)
Shampoo sounds like an unfortunate name for a hair product.
You're a ghost driving a meat-coated skeleton made from stardust, riding a rock, hurtling through space. Fear Nothing!

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

2,326 views & 0 likes for this thread
Am I giving up the gig?
FORUMS Post Processing, Marketing & Presenting Photos The Business of Photography 
AAA
x 1600
y 1600

Jump to forum...   •  Rules   •  Index   •  New posts   •  RTAT   •  'Best of'   •  Gallery   •  Gear   •  Reviews   •  Member list   •  Polls   •  Image rules   •  Search   •  Password reset

Not a member yet?
Register to forums
Registered members may log in to forums and access all the features: full search, image upload, follow forums, own gear list and ratings, likes, more forums, private messaging, thread follow, notifications, own gallery, all settings, view hosted photos, own reviews, see more and do more... and all is free. Don't be a stranger - register now and start posting!


COOKIES DISCLAIMER: This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and to our privacy policy.
Privacy policy and cookie usage info.


POWERED BY AMASS forum software 2.1forum software
version 2.1 /
code and design
by Pekka Saarinen ©
for photography-on-the.net

Latest registered member is htam
912 guests, 222 members online
Simultaneous users record so far is 15144, that happened on Nov 22, 2018

Photography-on-the.net Digital Photography Forums is the website for photographers and all who love great photos, camera and post processing techniques, gear talk, discussion and sharing. Professionals, hobbyists, newbies and those who don't even own a camera -- all are welcome regardless of skill, favourite brand, gear, gender or age. Registering and usage is free.