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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 26 Mar 2012 (Monday) 10:11
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7d vs 5d ii

 
dlee975
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Mar 26, 2012 10:11 |  #1

Just curious, why is the 5d considered to be a better camera for portrait photography vs. the 7d? Is it image quality, or does the ff have something to do with it? Is the 5d just considered a better camera than the 7d? Thanks for the input.


Canon 5D iii, 16-35 F4.0L, 24-70 F2.8L mark II, 70-200 F2.8L IS mark II, 135 F2.0L, 50mm f/1.8 II

  
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Skippy29
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Mar 26, 2012 10:13 |  #2

It costs more


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timnosenzo
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Mar 26, 2012 10:15 |  #3

dlee975 wrote in post #14155523 (external link)
Is it image quality, or does the ff have something to do with it?

Yes. Better IQ, primarily due to it's FF sensor.


connecticut wedding photographer (external link)

  
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Warbird55
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Mar 26, 2012 10:17 |  #4

Yes, because it is full frame. This gives it a clear advantage for portrait work. If you are talking sports and action, the 7D would be my choice because of its autofocus and 8 frames per second.


Canon 7D2 Gripped | Canon 7D Gripped | Canon SL1 | Canon EF-S 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 USM | Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM | Canon EF-S 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS STM | Canon EF-S 24mm f/2.8 STM | Sigma 30mm f/1.4 EX DC HSM | Sigma 50mm f/1.4 EX | Sigma 50-150 f/2.8 OS | Canon EF-S 55-250mm f/4-5.6 IS STM | Canon EF-S 60mm f/2.8 Macro | Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS II | Canon Extender 1.4x III | Canon Speedlite 580EX II

  
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dlee975
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Mar 26, 2012 11:14 |  #5

can anyone explain why a ff sensor creates a better iq? or point me in the right direction?


Canon 5D iii, 16-35 F4.0L, 24-70 F2.8L mark II, 70-200 F2.8L IS mark II, 135 F2.0L, 50mm f/1.8 II

  
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KinoC
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Mar 26, 2012 11:33 |  #6

Better ISO performance, IQ, FF. even with the better AF I take the 5d over the 7d.


KC
1Dx |5D MII | 7D|16-35 MII|24-70 MII|70-200 MII

  
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sfinkernagel
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Mar 26, 2012 11:44 |  #7

I won't pretend to understand the science behind it- but.... it just is. I have both, and the 5D2 is clearly the winner in image quality, especially in low light.

My understanding is that the full frame allows for less "crowding" of the pixels, resulting in less noise. I am sure there is more to it.

I had an interesting experience with the 5D2 AF over the last 2 weeks. I shot a sweet 16 party at a club called "The Mines". It was decorated to look like an old coal mine, but.... it was actually darker. I shot with the 5D2 first, and the AF was struggling, so I switched to the 7D, which performed better. My cameras, btw, are almost always on AI servo, as most of my shoots are sporting events. Fast forward to this past weekend- another sweet 16, same venue. After some research here on the forums, I learned that the AF assist on the Canon flashes only functions in one-shot AF mode. I made that change, the red lines made their appearances, and the AF on the 5D worked great.

The AF assist is too slow for action photos, but there is no way they would ever play sports in a venue that dark either.

For all of the discussion of the 5D2 AF being bad- I have not found it unusable at all. That is, however, the biggest advantage to the 7D.




  
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amfoto1
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Mar 26, 2012 12:20 |  #8

dlee975 wrote in post #14155870 (external link)
can anyone explain why a ff sensor creates a better iq? or point me in the right direction?

Rather than try to retype it all, please skip on over here (external link) and start reading.

sfinkernagel wrote in post #14156043 (external link)
....I had an interesting experience with the 5D2 AF over the last 2 weeks. I shot a sweet 16 party at a club called "The Mines". It was decorated to look like an old coal mine, but.... it was actually darker. I shot with the 5D2 first, and the AF was struggling, so I switched to the 7D, which performed better.

That is interesting... Especially considering that the 5DII's AF is able to focus about 1 EV lower light than the 7D's. Are you sure the difference wasn't in the lenses used, rather than the cameras?

My cameras, btw, are almost always on AI servo, as most of my shoots are sporting events. Fast forward to this past weekend- another sweet 16, same venue. After some research here on the forums, I learned that the AF assist on the Canon flashes only functions in one-shot AF mode. I made that change, the red lines made their appearances, and the AF on the 5D worked great.

The AF assist is too slow for action photos, but there is no way they would ever play sports in a venue that dark either.

On 5DII, in AI Servo only, you can enable the 6 hidden "AF Assist" points that are clustered right around the center point.

That "feature" is unique to the 5DC and 5DII, I believe, and different than the AF Assist provided by flashes (including the built in flash on the 7D, though it's done with obnoxious "white light"). Yes, that's One Shot only. And, since One Shot isn't particularly useful much of the time for sports, neither is flash-based AF Assist.

For action shooting with AI Servo, if you haven't done so you might try enabling the additional Assist points instead. These work as sort of "expansion points" for the center AF point alone. But frankly I haven't found them to help all that much... Maybe because they are single-axis AF points, same as all except the one center AF point on the 5DC/5DII.

If you don't want to have to mount a flash but want "red grid" AF Assist, the much smaller ST-E2 flash controller module (external link)can provide it, too. It also doesn't tend to overheat the way the built-in flash AF Assist can with heavy and frequent usage.

For all of the discussion of the 5D2 AF being bad- I have not found it unusable at all. That is, however, the biggest advantage to the 7D.

I also find 5DII AF more than adequate... for the uses the camera is designed to be best at - studio work, portraits, weddings, landscape, architecture, perhaps macro and some other things too... static subjects and One Shot AF mode work. 5DII simply isn't the best choice for, isn't designed or intended to excel at AI Servo/action shooting. It's sort of a "1Ds Lite".

On the other hand, the 7D is optimized in various ways to be a reasonably affordable AI Servo/sports/action camera. It's sort of a "1D Lite". It's not a bad camera for One Shot/static subject shooting either... But for the types of subjects that I'd be more likely to shoot that way, I would generally prefer to use the full frame camera for a number of reasons (more "enlargeable" image files, more control over DOF, smoother tonal gradations, a little wider dynamic range, lower noise at higher ISOs, bigger viewfinder).

Other considerations... The 7D can shoot faster frame rate than the 5DII (8 fps vs 4 fps). And the lens kit for a crop camera can be smaller, lighter and less expensive. The difference mostly shows up with telephotos... To "equal" my handheld 300/4 IS on one of my 7Ds, with 5DII I have to break out the 500/4 IS and a tripod to use it on. To get about the same appparent reach that I'm seeing with 70-200/2.8 IS on a 7D, with 5DII I have to get out the 300/2.8 IS and a tripod or monopod.

Portrait shooters might want to compare prices of an 85/1.8 for use on a crop camera with the price of a 135/2L on FF.... Or even more dramatically, the 135/2L on the cropper vs a 200/2L on FF!


Alan Myers (external link) "Walk softly and carry a big lens."
5DII, 7DII(x2), 7D(x2) & other cameras. 10-22mm, Tokina 12-24/4, 20/2.8, TS 24/3.5L, 24-70/2.8L, 28/1.8, 28-135 IS (x2), TS 45/2.8, 50/1.4, Tamron 60/2.0, 70-200/4L IS, 70-200/2.8 IS, 85/1.8, Tamron 90/2.5 Macro, 100/2.8 USM, 100-400L II, 135/2L, 180/3.5L, 300/4L IS (x2), 300/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, EF 1.4X II, EF 2X II. Flashes, studio strobes & various access. - FLICKR (external link) - ZENFOLIO (external link)

  
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NeverFollow
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Mar 26, 2012 12:22 |  #9

KinoC wrote in post #14155968 (external link)
Better ISO performance, IQ, FF. even with the better AF I take the 5d over the 7d.

I totally agree.... I just made the upgrade from the 7D to the Mark II and Im going to sell the 7D for better glass


http://500px.com/chris​kennedydotphoto (external link)[/B]
http://ckphoto.online/ (external link)

  
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dlee975
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Mar 26, 2012 12:48 |  #10

amfoto1 wrote in post #14156251 (external link)
Rather than try to retype it all, please skip on over here (external link) and start reading.

Thanks Alan


Canon 5D iii, 16-35 F4.0L, 24-70 F2.8L mark II, 70-200 F2.8L IS mark II, 135 F2.0L, 50mm f/1.8 II

  
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modchild
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Mar 26, 2012 13:17 |  #11

When I'm using the 5D2 I find I want the AF of the 7D. But when using the 7D I find I want the IQ, better ISO and low light performance of the 5D2. So I've just ordered the 5D3 and will now have the best of both and the worst of neither.


EOS 5D MkIII, EOS 70D, EOS 650D, EOS M, Canon 24-70 f2.8L MkII, Canon 70-200 f2.8L IS MkII, Canon 100 f2.8L Macro, Canon 17-40 f4L IS, Canon 24-105 f4L IS, Canon 300 f4L IS, Canon 85 f1.8, Canon 50 f1.4, Canon 40 f2.8 STM, Canon 35 f2, Sigma 150-500 OS, Tamron 18-270 PZD, Tamron 28-300 VC, 580EX II Flash, Nissin Di866 MkII Flash, Sigma EM 140 Macro Flash and other bits.

  
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dooboo
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Mar 26, 2012 13:52 |  #12

modchild wrote in post #14156606 (external link)
When I'm using the 5D2 I find I want the AF of the 7D. But when using the 7D I find I want the IQ, better ISO and low light performance of the 5D2. So I've just ordered the 5D3 and will now have the best of both and the worst of neither.

Ah yes, however, when went to order the 5m3, I was little short on the funds...oh well...better be happy with what I have for now.


5DMK2 Gripped; Rebel XT; 18-55mm kit lens; Tamron 28-75mm f/2.8; 70-200mm L f/4 IS; 580EXII

  
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sfinkernagel
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Mar 26, 2012 14:38 |  #13

amfoto1 wrote in post #14156251 (external link)
That is interesting... Especially considering that the 5DII's AF is able to focus about 1 EV lower light than the 7D's. Are you sure the difference wasn't in the lenses used, rather than the cameras?

Same lenses- 24-70 2.8, and the 85mm 1.8. The AF assist that I was getting was from the 580 exII.

I guess the biggest things I took away from it were that the assist only works in one-shot AF, and the 7D seemed to do better overall. Second time out, the 5D was great!




  
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dlee975
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Mar 26, 2012 22:19 |  #14

modchild wrote in post #14156606 (external link)
When I'm using the 5D2 I find I want the AF of the 7D. But when using the 7D I find I want the IQ, better ISO and low light performance of the 5D2. So I've just ordered the 5D3 and will now have the best of both and the worst of neither.

Wish I could say I was getting a 5d3. Congratulations!:p


Canon 5D iii, 16-35 F4.0L, 24-70 F2.8L mark II, 70-200 F2.8L IS mark II, 135 F2.0L, 50mm f/1.8 II

  
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markhyo
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Mar 26, 2012 22:33 as a reply to  @ dlee975's post |  #15

I've been on the fence about going full frame for a while now but there's one photographer in particular that always brings me back to the reality that do I really need it? I've been an admirer of Emily Soto for a while and she never ceases to amaze me. One would think she shot with a 5D MkII or better but believe it or not she shoots with a 7D! You can see much of her work here: http://www.flickr.com/​photos/emsoto (external link).

It seems every time I'm ready to sell off my gear and just go full frame I see a new image from Emily and she changes my mind. There's no doubt the 5D MkII has great image quality but after seeing Emily's work it just makes me realize I'm not even using my current camera to the best of it's ability. My .02.


Mark W EOS 70D, 60D, Canon 18-55 f/3.5-5.6 IS STM, Canon 40mm f/2.8, 100mm f/2.8 Macro, Sigma 8mm Fisheye, Pentax 55mm f/1.8 M42 (For Sale)
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7d vs 5d ii
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