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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 27 Mar 2012 (Tuesday) 07:42
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New lenses for my 60D

 
dropmyload
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Mar 27, 2012 07:42 |  #1

I have a 60D with the following:

- Kit 18-135
- nifty fifty
- Tokina 80-400

I want to upgrade my glass. I usually shoot family shots, indoor shots, wildlife in national parks...usual basic stuff. No formal portraits or stuff like that. Hardly ever use my flash.

So I was thinking, get either


  1. Sigma 17-50 2.8 and Canon 100-400L
  2. Canon 24-105L and 100-400L


What do you think? I'd sell the lenses I have to cover some of the costs.

Here is the stats for the pics I've taken so far...


18 mm 23
19 mm 1
20 mm 2
21 mm 2
22 mm 2
24 mm 3
25 mm 2
26 mm 2
29 mm 1
30 mm 1
31 mm 3
32 mm 1
33 mm 1
35 mm 1
36 mm 3
37 mm 1
38 mm 1
41 mm 1
42 mm 2
44 mm 2
47 mm 1
48 mm 2
50 mm 106
52 mm 2
53 mm 1
55 mm 1
57 mm 3
60 mm 4
62 mm 4
67 mm 1
69 mm 1
75 mm 3
79 mm 1
80 mm 5
87 mm 2
92 mm 2
100 mm 4
106 mm 2
113 mm 4
120 mm 1
126 mm 2
135 mm 30
170 mm 1
190 mm 1
200 mm 2
280 mm 1
300 mm 1
400 mm 4

Canon 80D, Canon 100-400L, EF 50 II
Fuji X-T20, 18-55 2.8-4, Samyang 12/2
Vivitar 28/2.5 RE, Auto-Topcor 3.5cm/2.8, Helios 44-2, Meyer Optik Gorlitz Trioplan 100/2.8, Tele Lentar 135/2.8, Soligor 180/3.5
Yongnuo 468II, 565 EX & some 622C
My Flickr (external link)
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John ­ from ­ PA
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Mar 27, 2012 07:58 |  #2

The Sigma 17-50 with the fixed f/2.8 is an awesome lens and would be my recommendation. The 24-105L, again a great piece of glass, yields an effective field of view on the 60D as 38mm to 168mm. For family shots and indoor shots I suspect you will want to go wider than the 38mm effective. The Sigma at the wide end would be 27mm.

Are you dissatisfied with the Tokina 80-400 and that is why you are considering the Canon 100-400L?




  
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Warbird55
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Mar 27, 2012 08:05 |  #3

Since your 60D is a crop sensor, I would definitely go with the Sigma 17-50 2.8 and Canon 100-400L. The 24-105 is just not wide enough on a crop sensor.

Why are you replacing the Tokina?


Canon 7D2 Gripped | Canon 7D Gripped | Canon SL1 | Canon EF-S 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 USM | Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM | Canon EF-S 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS STM | Canon EF-S 24mm f/2.8 STM | Sigma 30mm f/1.4 EX DC HSM | Sigma 50mm f/1.4 EX | Sigma 50-150 f/2.8 OS | Canon EF-S 55-250mm f/4-5.6 IS STM | Canon EF-S 60mm f/2.8 Macro | Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS II | Canon Extender 1.4x III | Canon Speedlite 580EX II

  
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dropmyload
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Mar 27, 2012 08:13 |  #4

The Tokina is a challenge...

I don't think I have got a single decent shot from that lens...when you're shooting in national parks, you're usually shooting out of the window or roof of a car...and that lens does not have sharp shots.

I've tried it in tv and av modes, and have struggled every time. This is the first version of the lens. The autofocus is really slow and noisy, I prefer it in manual.

http://www.flickr.com …a/sets/72157628​102104100/ (external link)

I was hoping the 100-400L will get me better results. I'm even scared to use the 80-400 any more...its always a bad shot!


Canon 80D, Canon 100-400L, EF 50 II
Fuji X-T20, 18-55 2.8-4, Samyang 12/2
Vivitar 28/2.5 RE, Auto-Topcor 3.5cm/2.8, Helios 44-2, Meyer Optik Gorlitz Trioplan 100/2.8, Tele Lentar 135/2.8, Soligor 180/3.5
Yongnuo 468II, 565 EX & some 622C
My Flickr (external link)
Instagram (external link)

  
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Sirrith
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Mar 27, 2012 08:35 |  #5

I'd say 17-50 + 100-400.

You clearly use the wide end a lot, so 24-105 won't be good for you.


-Tom
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F-Stop Guru review | RRS BH-40 review

  
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amfoto1
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Mar 27, 2012 08:36 |  #6

You've only taken a couple hundred shots with the camera and lenses so far? If that's accurate, you might want to give it a little more time and get some more experience with the gear before making any decisions.

The lens you have used most is the 50mm? If so, then that might be the one that would be the most useful to upgrade.

However, if you haven't been using this gear together very long, it really might take a little longer to learn to "get the best out of it".

OTOH, if the 80-400 is really that frustrating and you aren't getting any good results out of it, it might be a problem lens and maybe is the first lens you should replace. Is it an older lens that you bought used or something? Lenses do wear out or have de-centered elements or other problems inside, even though they look fine outside. However, less than 50-60 shots so far with the telephoto zoom (and I bet some of those were with the longer end of the 18-135)? That's hardly enough to learn how to use it well. Long telephotos require some work to get a good shot... especially when they don't have stabilization.

If it's really not doing the job, that 80-400mm probably is the lens you most need to consider replacing. Besides the Canon 100-400mm, you also might want to look at the considerably less expensive Sigma 120-400 OS and 150-500 OS.

If I were you, I'd keep the 18-135 for now... or at least make it your lowest priority for replacement. I'm assuming it's the same age as your camera, came with it as the kit lens."

No one should say 24-105 is "no good" or that it "isn't wide enough on crop".... It is what it is. It's a useful, quality "standard to moderate" telephoto lens. A nice, versatile "walk-around" lens that meets a lot of peoples' needs pretty well. What matters is what you complement it with, what other lenses you have in your system. Personally I will never spend what the 24-105 costs for a different reason... I can buy 28-135 IS for 1/4 or 1/5 the price and get virtually the same results. But since you have the 18-135 already, there's little to be gained. That appears to be a reasonably good walk-around lens. I'd only fault it because it doesn't have USM focus.

If you have a lens that's "not wide enough" need wide, get a wide lens (Canon 10-22, Tokina 12-24, etc.). Yes, some people go a different route, put together a different set of lenses such as a 11-16, 17-50, 70-200. But someone using a 100-400 or similar might find a combo of 10-22, 24-105, 100-400 more convenient and useful. Neither choice is "right" or "wrong" on any camera format.

You do apppear to be shooting "as wide as possible" quite a bit (second only to 50mm and 135mm, the latter is probably "as long as possible" when you have the 18-135 on the camera). So, you might want to consider adding one of the wider lenses sometime, if you truly feel that you just can't get wide enough with what you've got.

dropmyload wrote in post #14161743 (external link)
I've taken 4000+ shots, only 297 were worth putting on Flickr. I don't upload everything, just what is worth sharing.
You can see a few shots at 200mm plus because really nothing worth sharing, all lousy shots. I bought the Tokina used on Ebay...noisy autofocus, sometimes doesn't even lock... that's why I use it in manual.
I was thinking the same, get the 100-400L and deal with wide end next year.


EDIT: Okay, that makes sense. I didn't think of Flickr statistics... There are free software applets you can run on your computer that give you shot statistics for all the images on your hard drive(s), not just the ones that turn out good enough to want to post online. I sort of assumed that was what you had done. Still, 4000 isn't a great deal either (that's roughly three weeks shooting for me, on average). But it certainly might be enough for you to decide what you like and what you don't....

You need confidence in your longest lens, so that's still probably the best place to start. I see you are in Kenya and I have no idea of lens prices and availability there... But still would suggest looking at the two Sigmas as well, if at all possible. The Canon 100-400 is a "push-pull" zoom... uses a single ring for both focus and zooming. Some people like that. Others don't (I'm one of the ones who don't). Some say it makes the lens more of a "dust vacuum" than some other zooms, perhaps because the zooming can be done so quickly. But I have no personal experience with the lens so can't say if this is true. It is an older lens design now... It's IS needs to be manually turned off when it's locked down on a tripod (the IS on some newer lenses auto senses lack of movement and turns itself off). OTOH, it seems an ideal lens for some fast moving events, such as air shows or birds in flight.

The two Sigma are considerably less expensive (around 35% less here in the U.S.), seem to be well made and are newer designs, released in the past two or three years I believe. Some feel the newer Sigma OS is better than the older Canon IS. Optically they seem close... The Canon might have a little edge but I see a lot of good shots being done with the Sigmas too (you might want to search for sample images from each of these lenses here). Both of the Siggies are the more traditional two ring design. The 120-400 OS is fairly compact, close to the same size as the Canon lens. The 150-500mm is bigger and heavier... might want a monopod more often with it.

EDIT (again :rolleyes:)... If you are using the longer lens mostly for wildlife, sports, action... You might want to consider trying Back Button Focus (external link) technique with your camera. This is an old Canon sports shooter trick, works well with any moving subject, but really can be used with most anything. Then it's important to switch to AI Servo and often advisable to use only the center AF point. Doing that I can nail focus on moving targets 95 out of 100 times (with various crop cameras... not so much with 5DII). I call it my KISS or "Keep It Simple, Stupid" mode.


Alan Myers (external link) "Walk softly and carry a big lens."
5DII, 7DII(x2), 7D(x2) & other cameras. 10-22mm, Tokina 12-24/4, 20/2.8, TS 24/3.5L, 24-70/2.8L, 28/1.8, 28-135 IS (x2), TS 45/2.8, 50/1.4, Tamron 60/2.0, 70-200/4L IS, 70-200/2.8 IS, 85/1.8, Tamron 90/2.5 Macro, 100/2.8 USM, 100-400L II, 135/2L, 180/3.5L, 300/4L IS (x2), 300/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, EF 1.4X II, EF 2X II. Flashes, studio strobes & various access. - FLICKR (external link) - ZENFOLIO (external link)

  
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dropmyload
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Mar 27, 2012 08:48 |  #7

I've taken 4000+ shots, only 297 were worth putting on Flickr. I don't upload everything, just what is worth sharing.

You can see a few shots at 200mm plus because really nothing worth sharing, all lousy shots. I bought the Tokina used on Ebay...noisy autofocus, sometimes doesn't even lock... that's why I use it in manual.

I was thinking the same, get the 100-400L and deal with wide end next year.


Canon 80D, Canon 100-400L, EF 50 II
Fuji X-T20, 18-55 2.8-4, Samyang 12/2
Vivitar 28/2.5 RE, Auto-Topcor 3.5cm/2.8, Helios 44-2, Meyer Optik Gorlitz Trioplan 100/2.8, Tele Lentar 135/2.8, Soligor 180/3.5
Yongnuo 468II, 565 EX & some 622C
My Flickr (external link)
Instagram (external link)

  
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John ­ from ­ PA
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Mar 27, 2012 11:33 |  #8

The pictures you have on Flickr look very good so the lens is capable of delivering a decent image. How about posting some bad stuff with the EXIF data so we can see wht the issue might be? Then again, it sounds like you just don't want to mess with this lens.




  
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dachness
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Mar 27, 2012 11:40 |  #9

Since you are doing mostly indoor stuff with out flash go with Sigma 17-50 2.8 OS combo. Will be more effective at the task due to the 2.8 aperture. It also appears you don't have many shots in the 50-104 range. You would also probably appreciate the 17-23 range that the sigma has.

If you order sigma place your order soon. It's on sale for $594 until the 31st of march.


Daniel
60D |10-18 f/4.5-5.6 IS STM | Σ 17-50 f/2.8 OS | 70-200 f/2.8L IS II | 430EX II

  
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canondslr
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Mar 27, 2012 12:21 |  #10

Hi
Just my opinion.
SInce you shoot the most at 18mm, 50mm and 135mm, if you dont need big aperture, etc, I'd stay with your 18-135.
I myself used a 18-200 as my everyday lens, but recently got 15-85 and now using it more often.




  
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Keyan
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Mar 27, 2012 13:30 |  #11

Yeah, the 15-85 (if you don't need fast glass) or the sigma or the Canon 17-55 would seem to fit the bill for what you shoot a little better. Why are you not considering the 17-55?


Cameras: 7D2, S100
Lenses: 17-55 f/2.8 IS USM, 18-135 STM, 24-70 f/4L IS USM, 50 f/1.4 USM,70-300L IS USM
Other Stuff: 430 EX II, Luma Labs Loop 3, CamRanger

  
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bamatt
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Mar 27, 2012 16:14 as a reply to  @ Keyan's post |  #12

I am extremely pleased with my 17-55. Its a great lens. I messed around with the Sigma 17-50 and the zoom and AF felt very clunky. Sure its expensive, and I could barely afford it, but I ate Ramen noodles for a couple of weeks and now I have it and don't worry about it! :D


60D / 10-22 / 24L II / 70-200 2.8L II

  
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DL ­ Photo
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Mar 27, 2012 23:39 |  #13

17-50 and 100-400.

I'd try and talk you into the 17-55, however, the 17-50 has great reviews and costs less. The 100-400 is awesome....but you do need good lighting for that lens.

I don't see that you have shot much in the 200 to 400mm range though. Is that due to the poor Tokina lens that you have? I recommend also looking at the 70-200 series first. Many of your shots are at 135. The 70-200 f/4 IS or 70-200 2.8 IS will be perfect for that range...and provides a fixed min aperture...better for lower light situations (like dusk and dawn).


G16
OMD-10 (absolutely love this little devil)

  
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dropmyload
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Mar 28, 2012 00:14 |  #14

Amfoto1, I will definitely look at the Sigmas. Its just that after the Tokina I'm a little hesitant to try third party lenses for the long end. I would buy the 100-400L in the US when I'm over for summer vacation. P.s. I use back button focus already, with centre autofocus point only. I use AI servo when shooting fast moving objects, as you can see below I tried a BIF with my 18-135 as my 80-400 works well only in manual. As for 4000 shots, I think you're far ahead of me on the learning curve!!

IMAGE: http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7085/7017031213_aca81bd862_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com/​photos/smandavia/70170​31213/  (external link)
Fish eagle swooping in (external link) by babasujaan (external link), on Flickr

John from PA, I shall upload some crappy pics soon, usually I dont even store them on my hard drive, just delete. I'll use the 80-400 exclusively this weekend, and lets see if you see something I might have missed. If I could find a way of using that lens it would make me the happiest man!

dachness, I've seen the "sale" on the Sigma 17-50, hence why I targeted that lens.

Keyan, 17-55 was ruled out purely on a price consideration.

DL photo, in an ideal world, I'd love to have the 17-55, the 70-200 and the 100-400 as my ONLY lenses. But, I'd like to upgrade slowly, the wife wouldn't be too thrilled to see me spending like that! (EDIT) WOW! I just saw your lenses on your sig...lucky you!

Canon 80D, Canon 100-400L, EF 50 II
Fuji X-T20, 18-55 2.8-4, Samyang 12/2
Vivitar 28/2.5 RE, Auto-Topcor 3.5cm/2.8, Helios 44-2, Meyer Optik Gorlitz Trioplan 100/2.8, Tele Lentar 135/2.8, Soligor 180/3.5
Yongnuo 468II, 565 EX & some 622C
My Flickr (external link)
Instagram (external link)

  
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xarqi
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Mar 28, 2012 04:33 |  #15

15-85 + 100-400.




  
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