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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 25 Jun 2012 (Monday) 10:31
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My head says : Mark III but my heart wants D800

 
Charlie
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Jun 25, 2012 17:01 |  #31

David Arbogast wrote in post #14629975 (external link)
Having had a solid two month's experience with D800, I feel it's safe to say that 5D II/III shooters who poo-poo the D800's wider DR are speaking from inexperience. They just literally don't know any better.

That said, I sold my D800 in favor of the 5D III for several reasons. Here are a few:

1. For wide-angle landscape and architectural photography I rely on Live View for focusing. The D800 has what I regard as a seriously poor Live View system that skirts the line between usable and unusable: quite usable in good light; unusable in low-light with narrow lens apertures. The quality gap between the D800 and 5D III LV systems is immense imo.

2. I love the Canon wide-angle tilt-shift lenses (perfect for architecture and landscapes) and Nikon is not currently competitive with wide-angle TS lenses. Also the 100-400mm is a great bang-for-the-buck all-purpose wildlife lens that Nikon has no similar quality : price answer for.

3. While the D800 sports an advanced AF system, the 5D III is surpassingly good. All-in-all, the 5D III bests the D800 on ergonomics, in my view. And, ultimately, image quality is connected to ergonomics. It doesn't really matter if you've got 36 MP and and huge DR camera if you can't get your subject in perfect focus because it's dark and the LV system isn't usable. So, in a round about sort of way, the 5D III can even out the image quality score because it makes it easier on the user to capture the image. And because the 5D III has better ergonomics I think it's just more fun to shoot than the D800. But, I'm not suggesting that the D800 has bad ergonomics, just that the 5D III is ergonomically superb.

It's hard to quantify, but don't make the mistake of dismissing the connection between ergonomics and image quality. I watched an excellent Youtube presentation comparing the 5D II and 5D III for shooting wildlife. The user experienced a 25% success rate capturing birds in flight with the 5D II, but had something like an 80% success rate with the 5D III. That's a huge jump in overall image quality in a way that doesn't get discussed much.

I very much enjoyed my time with the D800 and truly wish I could afford to shoot both systems (by afford I mean both my time and money). For now I've decided to shoot only Canon and to do so with a 5D III for the above-mentioned reasons. At first I was skeptical that dpreview "conveniently" scored the two cameras with the same final score; especially since the D800 is the clear winner on image quality. But, now having used them both, I would rate them the same way. They are both awesome cameras with unique strengths and weakenesses.

well TS is shooting with a crop camera, so not sure how much dynamic range he really needs. My guess is that he saw the FM or youtube comparisons. The biggest factor is what he shoots and is he willing to make compromises. The D800 fits my style better as well, but the D600 a much closer match if it ever materializes.

I'm done chasing gear at this point, at a happy medium :)


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w0318
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Jun 25, 2012 17:42 |  #32

EL_PIC wrote in post #14629226 (external link)
Both D800 and 5D MKIII cameras are evolutionary and not revolutionary.

Are you sure this applies to the D800, most seem to think its revolutionary


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Hogloff
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Jun 25, 2012 17:44 |  #33
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Stone 13 wrote in post #14630459 (external link)
I'm sure the D800 would have been helpful, but would it have invalidated the need for a set of filters? I only know 1 person who owns a D800, he's a landscape guy but he still uses a full range of filters, the D800 hasn't changed that at all, of course your mileage may vary. :D

Well, in this case, shooting in a dark forest, GND are useless. The only recourse I have is to take multiple exposures and merge in PS. Haven't yet had time to process any of the shots, but I know there was the occasional breeze and I am sure leaves moved between exposures so making clean merges will be difficult if not possible. Would the D800 with it's 2 to 2.5 more stops of dynamic range saved my butt. Don't know, but it sure as hell would not have hurt any to have the extra dynamic range.

Of course I would still have a set of GND filters for those sunset shots where the dynamic range is just too much for even the D800 to handle, but there are many times I use a 2 stop GND filter which in theory would not be required with the D800.




  
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jwcdds
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Jun 25, 2012 17:45 |  #34

w0318 wrote in post #14630712 (external link)
Are you sure this applies to the D800, most seem to think its revolutionary

Well, if you think about it.. it's just a bigger D7000 sensor. The feature set it has finally rolled into their FF line-up so I would agree, it's evolutionary, not revolutionary.


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cputeq007
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Jun 25, 2012 18:04 |  #35

A few comments, from possibly the most agnostic system user (me):

1) Make sure the features you lust after are really going to affect your photography. I slam the 5D2 for positioning itself as a great landscape camera, but not including a built-in VF shutter. Does it really make a difference to me? No, I use the camera, but it's nice to have for longer exposures - not a deal breaker.

Same with massive DR of the EXMOR sensors. I own NEX-5N, owned D7000, owned A77 - all great cameras and superior DR to my now 5D2. Guess what camera I have now? Yes, 5D2. Why? Good camera for good price (CLP!) and for my shooting, the DR ceiling rarely comes up. 5D2 lifts shadows adequately - not amazingly, but good enough that I have yet to run into the banding limits in a real shot.

So, analyze now what limitations your gear gives you - will the D800 be the answer? (admittedly, the cheaper price is tempting!)

I will admit FF is nice, though - crop has its place, but FF advantages I really like. I think you will be happy with the move to FF (except cost and weight/size!).

2) Look at the system as a whole, not just the body. If you only plan D800 and 24-70, that is fine - Nikon's 24-70 is extremely good. If you start lusting after some of the more specialized lenses, though, Nikon may leave you cold.

This is exactly why I moved back to Canon - their lens selection is tops, even if their bodies some consider 2nd-best. I plan to re-buy (eventually) the 100-400L, something Nikon still doesn't answer. Canon has four current 70-200 choices, Nikon has one. Even in the used market, this swayed me - much easier to find 70-200 IS MK I than the 70-200 VR I from Nikon.

Nikon is catching up in certain areas, though - they're releasing very good, new versions of f/1.8 primes that look really nice - so again, I would look at what lenses you plan to buy, because Nikon (or Canon even) might disappoint you.

3) Handle the equipment! This is important - there are a lot of people griping that the D800 is uncomfortable without the grip addition because the finger mold/grip is too shallow. Factor this in, if you dislike the hold, the camera is near-worthless.

Good luck in your search - I think both systems would be very good for someone moving up to FF, and I admit Nikon's cheaper price for the body is very tempting.

Having owned Pentax crop, Olympus 43, Sony FF and crop, Nikon FF (three times) and crop (twice), Canon FF (twice) and crop cameras (twice), though, I can tell you none of them are perfect ;)


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fogboundturtle
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Jun 25, 2012 18:39 |  #36

Thx for all your comments. My sig was not updated for quite some time. I have 100-400L instead of the 300f4. This is one of the main reason I wanted the Mk3.


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David ­ Arbogast
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Jun 25, 2012 19:23 |  #37

cputeq007 wrote in post #14630826 (external link)
A few comments, from possibly the most agnostic system user (me):

The most eh? :rolleyes:


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cputeq007
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Jun 25, 2012 20:00 |  #38

David Arbogast wrote in post #14631148 (external link)
The most eh? :rolleyes:

Of course! I'm the most agnostic system user I know :cool:


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MilesW
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Jun 25, 2012 23:31 |  #39

I say the same thing. You only live once follow your hearts desires.


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fogboundturtle
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Jun 29, 2012 11:21 |  #40

Decision made. I got a brand new 5d Mark III.


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Gregg.Siam
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Jun 29, 2012 11:50 |  #41

fogboundturtle wrote in post #14648847 (external link)
Decision made. I got a brand new 5d Mark III.

Good choice. Either are really great systems, you can't go wrong.

I think the D800 is a bit overrated when people talk about 36MP. The increased MP seems to only be noticeable in studio and landscape work.

3) Handle the equipment! This is important - there are a lot of people griping that the D800 is uncomfortable without the grip addition because the finger mold/grip is too shallow. Factor this in, if you dislike the hold, the camera is near-worthless.

very true. I LOATHE the layout of a Nikon DSLR. I think this reason alone would make me never choose Nikon regardless of features.


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Jun 29, 2012 14:25 |  #42

Gregg.Siam wrote in post #14648973 (external link)
Good choice. Either are really great systems, you can't go wrong.

I think the D800 is a bit overrated when people talk about 36MP. The increased MP seems to only be noticeable in studio and landscape work.
.

I shoot wildlife and sports and the increase MP has been very helpful. I owned both the 5D3 and D800 and ended up keeping the D800 for a few reasons and one was for more cropping head room. Anther reason was the lenses I wanted cost more on the Canon side. Something worth comparing when choosing. Both are great and can't go wrong with either. Definitely not worth switching for either way if a glass investment is already there.




  
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Jul 02, 2012 10:50 as a reply to  @ dgrPhotos's post |  #43

I'm sure that most of you have read the latest Popular Photography review (July 2012 issue) of both the Canon 5D3 and the Nikon D800.

For the last several years, I have had Nikon envy, thinking my Canon D2 was inferior to the Nikon D700. Now, I will have to envy no more.

It is interesting that Nikon went from claiming that their smallish 12mp sensor was superior because it had so little noise, to having the 36mp sensor which is "ridden" with noise (compared to the Canon). Clearly, their "claim" was purely for marketing purposes.

I envy the Nikon resolution, and very much envy the built in flash, but to me the D3 is the superior camera by a considerable margin (based on the reviews).

I have a very new, very fast computer, but I have no desire to be working with, and storing, 65mb file sizes. My current ones are already burdensome at 25mb. And those Canon noise ratings are AWESOME.




  
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Jul 02, 2012 11:14 as a reply to  @ MikeG50's post |  #44

NeoTokyo wrote in post #14630436 (external link)
This side by side review is very good.
For all the reviews that I have seen I have enjoyed this one the most for the detailed information.

My wife has been pushing me very hard for a couple years to make the switch to Nikon so I cant say that there is no influence to go to Nikon.

http://www.youtube.com …ndex=6&feature=​plpp_video (external link)

That's the best side by side review I've seen yet.

fogboundturtle wrote in post #14648847 (external link)
Decision made. I got a brand new 5d Mark III.

Congrats!


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Jul 02, 2012 11:44 |  #45

MikeG50 wrote in post #14660378 (external link)
It is interesting that Nikon went from claiming that their smallish 12mp sensor was superior because it had so little noise, to having the 36mp sensor which is "ridden" with noise (compared to the Canon). Clearly, their "claim" was purely for marketing purposes.

Is that true, is the Nikon really bad v the Canon for noise ??


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My head says : Mark III but my heart wants D800
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