Approve the Cookies
This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and our Privacy Policy.
OK
Index  •   • New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Guest
New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Register to forums    Log in

 
FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 17 Jul 2012 (Tuesday) 21:58
Search threadPrev/next
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

Upgrading from a 50D

 
ALPrasetio
Member
41 posts
Joined Jul 2012
     
Jul 17, 2012 21:58 |  #1

Hey folks! First poster, long time lurker. I have been doing EXTENSIVE research on the following issue but I just cannot seem to pull the trigger on any of the following camera. Maybe someone who was once in my position can shed some light on the situation.

Recently, I sold my canon 50D in hoping to upgrade to a 'newer' body. I tried out the 60D, felt too clumsy and didn't like the feel of the camera nor the layout. So I've recently looked into the 7D and the 5Dc and I can't figure out which one to get (I have been looking into Full Frame for awhile but just haven't had any experience with any full frames).

My style of photography: life. Basically, portraiture, general life scenes, and I've done a couple of weddings on the side.

I like the natural look of the photographs (and just that pleasant creamy feel on people) of the 5Dc but I am wondering about the AF. The one thing I didn't quite like on my 50D was the clumsy autofocus (high FPS made up for it), whenever the need for faster autofocus was needed (i.e. wedding, people moving, and etc). I don't have quite enough money to purchase an L lens unfortunately so getting faster lenses is really out of the question. Would I need to purchase L lenses in order to bring out the true beauty of the 5dc?

I like the 7D because of it's general versatility if I ever had the need to photograph something out of my element (sports/action and the like). I also like the 'reach' you get with the 1.6x crop. But that's not quite a big deal.

The lenses that I do have at the moment is a 28-135mm, 50mm f/1.8, and a 100mm 2.8 MACRO (hoping to sell this one).

Sorry for the lengthy post, but just thought someone with a bit more experience would be able to help me out. Thanks for reading!!

Here's a couple of shots of my 50D:

IMAGE: http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7020/6649720879_40cf2cf7a2_z.jpg
IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com/​photos/yongfuk/6649720​879/  (external link)
IMG_8663 (external link) by Yongfuk (external link), on Flickr

IMAGE: http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7003/6629038875_156ab2f5a9_z.jpg
IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com/​photos/yongfuk/6629038​875/  (external link)
IMG_8651 (external link) by Yongfuk (external link), on Flickr

IMAGE: http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7166/6629099683_8a8f17db7a_z.jpg
IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com/​photos/yongfuk/6629099​683/  (external link)
IMG_8507 (external link) by Yongfuk (external link), on Flickr

5Dc Gripped|Sigma 50mm 1.4 |430 EXII

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)
mhazlett
Senior Member
404 posts
Likes: 2
Joined Oct 2009
     
Jul 17, 2012 22:05 |  #2

If you felt that your AF wasn't great in the 50D then the 5Dc will only be worse. I went from a 40D to a 7D and really liked the upgrade. But fair warning you won't find a magic fix with the 7D for AF, if you couldn't keep focus on the 50D you probably won't be able to on the 7D. I shot many night football and dark gym basketball games with a couple of 40Ds, it just takes some practice. If it were me, I would try to get a 50D back and spend the money on glass. The 50D is a very capable camera.


WEBSITE (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
ALPrasetio
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
41 posts
Joined Jul 2012
     
Jul 17, 2012 22:26 |  #3

Well, it's not that I couldn't keep focus on the 50D (AI servo helped alot). I don't know if it's lens issue or body issue but probably 1/3 of the shots I would take would be in focus and other times it would be OOF.

Also one of the biggest gripe I've had with the 50D are the files. Something about the IQ just didn't sit quite right with me. Sensor was a bit noisier than I would've liked and I always have to do PP to get the color the way I want it to.


5Dc Gripped|Sigma 50mm 1.4 |430 EXII

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
jhayesvw
Cream of the Crop
7,230 posts
Gallery: 167 photos
Likes: 268
Joined Jan 2011
Location: Tucson AZ
     
Jul 17, 2012 22:57 as a reply to  @ ALPrasetio's post |  #4

to me a 7d isnt going to be an improvement in your files.
I went from a t1i (same sensor as 50d) to a 60d (same sensor as 7d) and while I can crop
quite a bit with the 60d I felt that the older files were easier to work with.
others may find this not to be true but that is what I have found.



My Flickr (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
ALPrasetio
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
41 posts
Joined Jul 2012
     
Jul 18, 2012 12:58 |  #5

Hmm...so then should I go for a 5Dc? Also, as I stated before in my original post, will I have to have the L series lenses to really bring out the beauty of the 5Dc or will any fast prime do?


5Dc Gripped|Sigma 50mm 1.4 |430 EXII

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Don ­ Madson
Senior Member
Avatar
360 posts
Likes: 7
Joined May 2005
Location: 07920
     
Jul 18, 2012 13:16 |  #6

I went from a 50D to a 7D, and am quite happy with it. I shoot lots of cycling events (bike races) and the acquisition speed of focus is a lot faster with the 7D than with the 50D. The 7D handles noise a lot better than the 50D, in spite of loads of posts **** about the noise.

The 7D requires you to do a better job choosing your settings, but when you get "tuned in", it's a great machine.

I've got 3 "L" lenses, 5 non-"L", and although the better grade of glass is great to have, there are non-"L" lenses that are great, such as the Canon 85/1.8, Sigma's 50/1.4, Sigma's 17-70 OS, Canon's 40/2.8, and loads of others. A large part of your success has nothing to do with lens quality, although it sure helps!

Happy deciding!
Don


dmadson.photoreflect.c​om
T'ai Chi Ch'uan...Relaxation, with an attitude!
---------------
70D, Mamiya 645 Pro TL, some lenses, a tripod, a monopod, some filters, a few straps, some batteries, 2 flash units, a few bags...;)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
ALPrasetio
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
41 posts
Joined Jul 2012
     
Jul 18, 2012 13:42 |  #7

^^Haha, true about the lens quality. I guess the question was directed more towards the speed of the lens since I know all of the AF besides the center cross focus is soot.


5Dc Gripped|Sigma 50mm 1.4 |430 EXII

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
amfoto1
Cream of the Crop
10,251 posts
Likes: 84
Joined Aug 2007
Location: San Jose, California
     
Jul 18, 2012 14:19 |  #8

ALPrasetio wrote in post #14735281 (external link)
Hmm...so then should I go for a 5Dc? Also, as I stated before in my original post, will I have to have the L series lenses to really bring out the beauty of the 5Dc or will any fast prime do?

No, that would be a big step backward in many respects. 5D Classic is now a 7 year old model, was contemporary with the 30D. Yes, it's still a decent camera, but now I'd suggest at least holding out for a 5D Mark II (a 4 year old model).

For what you shoot, the 5DII is what I'd recommend. It's AF isn't improved over the 5DC and even the 50D has, in some respects, better AF. But, used right, the AF on 5DII is fine for the types of subjects you shoot and can be used occasionally for sports/action, but isn't as good following movement.

I don't know what your problem was with 50D. I have shot with three of them and find their AF system to work quite well. You just have to keep it simple... I used center point only most of the time, and Back Button Focusing.... much of what I shoot is moving and for that I have to use AI Servo.

With 50D, I could pretty consistently get 95% of shots acceptibly within focus. Now shooting with a pair of 7Ds, I get 97-98%, using the same lenses and techniques to shoot the same types of subjects. The 7Ds, and before them the 50Ds, are my "AI Servo" action cameras.

I use 5D Mark II differently. It's my "One Shot" camera... mostly used with stationary subjects such as you describe. It's the best high ISO camera too... I'll use it to 6400 without much concern (higher if I need to, but more post processing will be needed). With 7D, I try to stick to 3200 or lower ISO. With 50Ds, I tried not to go above 1600 unless really necessary. So, whatever you were happy with using 50D, figure about an extra stop with 7D and an extra two stops with 5D Mark II. The 5DC is also quite good at high ISO, but it's highest available setting is 3200 (5DII goes to 25600 and 7D tops out at 12800.... but I'd only use those for B&W conversions, in all likelihood).

I have two out of three of your lenses, too. The 28-135 works well for me (it's a backup lens and a lightweight alternative I use for backpacking and such). I've used three copies of that lens over the years and it's always impressed me. It's sort of the Rodney Dangerfield of Canon lenses... gets no respect, but really is quite good and versatile. I have to say, I can't imagine shooting what you say you like to shoot, with nothing wider than 28mm on a crop camera (I use a Tokina 12-24 on crop and a 20/2.8 on full frame).

If your 100/2.8 Macro is the USM model (not the L with IS, but also not the earlier non-USM model), it's a superb lens that I wouldn't be too quick to sell off. Actually, all three of the Canon 100/2.8 Macros are excellent. The two later ones with USM are a bit more versatile though, thanks to USM focus that makes them more useful for non-macro shooting.

If you aren't getting sharp shots with either of the above two lenses shooting stationary subjects, you have to be doing something wrong or maybe you have "protection" filters on your lenses that are messing with image sharpness or causing focus errors?

For what you say you shoot, AI Servo isn't necessary or the best choice... actually is the least accurate focus method and makes focus/recompose technique impossible unless also using Back Button Focusing. One Shot would be more accurate, with stationary subjects. Live View, which is available on 50D, 7D, 5DII... but not 5DC... is the most accurate focusing method of all, though it's slow.

The 50/1.8 I don't have. I've looked at them over the years and think I'd break one in half or snap off the bayonet mount in short order. That lens isn't USM and are known to be very erratic about focus accuracy (Reikan FoCal couldn't calibrate several copies they tried, the lens just didn't re-focus consistently enough). Is this the lens where you saw most of your focus/image softness problems? If so, I'm not surprised. It's a great, cheap starter lens for someone who has never used primes, for occasional use it's a good intro to using larger apertures. But an upgrade might be in order... either the Canon or Sigma 50/1.4 would likely give you much better results.

No, you do not have to have L-series lenses. In fact, there are many excellent lenses that give great image quality, that aren't L-series. About half my lenses are L's, the rest aren't. I just get the appropriate/best lens for the job and don't really care if it has a red stripe painted on it or not. I do try to stick with USM lenses, for their better accuracy and focus speed (Sigma offers similar HSM and Tamron has begun offering similar USD). These tend to be better built, too... call it "mid-grade".

You wouldn't see much difference in image quality, going to 7D. It does allow for a little higher ISO. Mostly, it's a more feature filled camera... heavier and more pro-oriented. It takes more thinking to set it up, more time to learn to use well, especially the much more complex auto focus system. It is versatile, can be used for just about anything.... But 7D's true forte is action/sports shooting.... you pay extra for features on 7D that are especially useful for that type of photography. So since that's not what you shoot (at least rarely), in a sense you would be paying for features you'll have little use for. I'd have recommended 60D (which I understand you don't care for) or your 50D instead, for what you say you like to shoot. T2i/550D, T3i/600D or T4i/650D give virtually identical image quality to 7D and 60D... but if you don't like 60D, you probably won't like them either. T2i and T3i also have AF system simpler than 50D, similar to 5DII.... T4i has almost identical focus system to 50D and 60D.

I think 5DII would be fine, and perhaps the best for the type of things you want to shoot... though it's AF system is a slight step backward compared to your 50D. To get top IQ and top AF performance in full frame, you'd have to go to 5D Mark III (an lay out another big chunk of money) to get better AF. And, from what I've seen, 5DIII doesn't ratchet up image quality very much over 5DII. It appears to produce cleaner JPEGs at higher ISOs, but the RAW files don't appear all that different. So I'm guessing it's in the JPEG conversion process where the gains are being made, not so much the sensor and processor. It would be interesting to see if the latest version of Canon DPP makes higher ISOs from 5DII more usable.


Alan Myers (external link) "Walk softly and carry a big lens."
5DII, 7DII(x2), 7D(x2) & other cameras. 10-22mm, Tokina 12-24/4, 20/2.8, TS 24/3.5L, 24-70/2.8L, 28/1.8, 28-135 IS (x2), TS 45/2.8, 50/1.4, Tamron 60/2.0, 70-200/4L IS, 70-200/2.8 IS, 85/1.8, Tamron 90/2.5 Macro, 100/2.8 USM, 100-400L II, 135/2L, 180/3.5L, 300/4L IS (x2), 300/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, EF 1.4X II, EF 2X II. Flashes, studio strobes & various access. - FLICKR (external link) - ZENFOLIO (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
ALPrasetio
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
41 posts
Joined Jul 2012
     
Jul 18, 2012 14:42 |  #9

@amfoto1: Thanks alot for that thoughtful response. I guess I'll have to reconsider my decisions then. With a modest budget of around $1k, the 5dmkii isnt an option, sadly. :o.

I think my focusing issue was with that particular 50/1.8 lens. The 100mm macro is the later USM model of the lens and had no problem with one shot focusing with that particular lens.

Of course, the 50d body I had was used and looked in a little bit of a rough condition with 70k actuations, when purchased. I guess I'll try to give the 50D another shot and see how I feel before trying to move on to a new body.


5Dc Gripped|Sigma 50mm 1.4 |430 EXII

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Grudiowerx
Goldmember
1,001 posts
Likes: 5
Joined Oct 2009
     
Jul 18, 2012 15:09 as a reply to  @ ALPrasetio's post |  #10

I LOVED my 50D and miss it...but NO REGRETS moving to a 5D classic!


Canon 60D and 50mm f1.4
Canon SX130is sample here https://photography-on-the.net …p?p=15824044&po​stcount=46
Almost out from this hobby...

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
rinthiran
Member
84 posts
Joined Jul 2005
     
Jul 18, 2012 15:30 |  #11

ALPrasetio wrote in post #14735474 (external link)
^^Haha, true about the lens quality. I guess the question was directed more towards the speed of the lens since I know all of the AF besides the center cross focus is soot.

I used my 5Dc for 5 years never complaining about AF speed for a variety of uses. Got my 5D3 3 weeks ago and now the 5Dc feels like a slug. Haha, go figure. My 5Dc and 100mm macro combo is painfully slow! Great for macro work, slow for portrait work (although very capable of producing fantastic results).

I agree with amfoto1 but would recommend either the 5Dc or 5D2 (depending on your budget) as appropriate upgrades. Yes, the 5d2 has better features, more pixels for cropping and much better ISO performance; but the 5Dc is no slouch in good light and landscape photography. Also, good lenses will make a difference in both cameras. Primes (even the cheap 50mm f1.8) produced sharp and saturated results on my 5Dc.


5D3, EOS M, 350D/XT, EOS Elan 7e, 580EX, 270EX II, EF 17-40 f4L, EF 24-70 f2.8L, EF 70-200 f2.8L, EF 100mm f2.8L IS Macro, EF 50mm f1.4, EF 40mm f2.8 STM, EF 28mm f1.8, EFM 22mm f2.0 (5Dc sold, 30D sold); '82 Nikon FE, Nikkor Ai 50mm f1.8.

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
smmokan
Goldmember
Avatar
1,199 posts
Likes: 132
Joined Jan 2009
Location: Boulder, CO
     
Jul 18, 2012 15:43 |  #12

Personally, I don't think the 7D warrants twice the price of a 50D for marginal performance increase. I have used a 50D for the last two years and never once had an issue with focus. In fact, I've managed to nail the focus on quite a few skiing shots, which have to be some of the more difficult situations to follow the skier and get the focus spot-on. The 7D has a fancier AF system, but I don't think it's much better than the 50D... definitely not $700 more. As for the IQ, I don't see the 7D producing much better images than the 50D to warrant the price there either.

By the way, I was in your exact situation a couple of months ago and decided to get a 5Dc... but I also kept a 40D I had as backup so I can use it for skiing shots. I'll be upgrading soon if Canon ever announces the $1500 full frame Rebel. :)


www.ChasingEpicMTB.com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
KCMO ­ Al
Goldmember
Avatar
1,115 posts
Likes: 1
Joined Sep 2006
Location: Kansas City, MO
     
Jul 18, 2012 16:35 |  #13

Autofocus was a bit of a problem on the 5Dc but it worked well when used correctly. I used center point only and recomposed. It's how I worked in manual focus.
You mentioned you don't have any experience with full frame? Ever shoot film? If so, then you do have experience.
I know it's out of your price range, but the 5dIII is a HUGE improvement. Autofocus is much, much improved. The sensor technology is entirely new and it improves raw files as well as .jpg. AND the high ISO performance is absolutely phenomenal. You practically don't need light anymore.


Film: Leica M-4, Elan 7E, Rolleiflex 2.8f, Pentax 645 -- Digital: Canon Pro-1, EOS 5D Mk III
EOS Lenses: Sigma 24-70 f2.8 EX - Canon EF 17-40 f4.0L - Canon EF 24-105 f4.0L - Canon EF 35 f1.4L USM - Canon EF100-400 f4.5-5.6L IS USM - Canon EF100 f2.8 Macro - Other stuff: MR 14EX - 430EX - 580EXII - ST-E2 - TC1.4x - TC-80N3

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
ALPrasetio
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
41 posts
Joined Jul 2012
     
Jul 18, 2012 17:53 |  #14

@KCMO Ai: Haha, silly me, film completely slipped my mind. I guess I was on the "digital" mind set.

I forgot to mention I do quite a bit of high ISO shooting and anything past the 800 ISO was unusable for me with the 50D, which is another reason why I was going full frame. SO I narrowed down the decision to 2 different bodies (sorry folks the 7D is out of the picture :o).

Option A: $800 for a 5Dc Gripped around ~15K shutter count

Option B: $1000 for a 5D Mark II gripped with 124k shutter.

Im worried about going with option B for the fact that it's such a high shutter count. I know shutter count is one of those hit and miss type of deal so I was just wondering how much would I be spending on a replacement shutter if it were to die.

And with option A, I would probably try to go with a 50/1.4 and sell my clumsy 50/1.8, so around the same ballpark for both options.


5Dc Gripped|Sigma 50mm 1.4 |430 EXII

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
tempest68
Senior Member
Avatar
980 posts
Gallery: 1 photo
Likes: 4
Joined Aug 2008
Location: Manchester, PA
     
Jul 18, 2012 18:28 |  #15

I went from a 50D to the 5D II. To me, the AF doesn't seem any better or worse between the two. But the high ISO performance of the 5D II is so much better.

I tried the 50mm f1.8 a long time ago and it is the worst lens for AF that I've ever used. I now try to stick with USM lenses when I can.


Jim
Canon: EOS 3, 40mm f2.8 STM, 85mm f1.8 USM. Voigtlander: R3A, 28mm F2.8 SL II, Nokton 40mm f1.4, 50mm f2 Heliar.
Nikon: SB-25. Yongnuo: YN565EX, YN-622C transceiver (x2)
Sony: A7S, a6000, 24-240mm f3.5-6.3 G, Nissin i40.

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

3,206 views & 0 likes for this thread
Upgrading from a 50D
FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
AAA
x 1600
y 1600

Jump to forum...   •  Rules   •  Index   •  New posts   •  RTAT   •  'Best of'   •  Gallery   •  Gear   •  Reviews   •  Member list   •  Polls   •  Image rules   •  Search   •  Password reset

Not a member yet?
Register to forums
Registered members may log in to forums and access all the features: full search, image upload, follow forums, own gear list and ratings, likes, more forums, private messaging, thread follow, notifications, own gallery, all settings, view hosted photos, own reviews, see more and do more... and all is free. Don't be a stranger - register now and start posting!


COOKIES DISCLAIMER: This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and to our privacy policy.
Privacy policy and cookie usage info.


POWERED BY AMASS forum software 2.1forum software
version 2.1 /
code and design
by Pekka Saarinen ©
for photography-on-the.net

Latest registered member is VTKRZY
830 guests, 264 members online
Simultaneous users record so far is 15144, that happened on Nov 22, 2018

Photography-on-the.net Digital Photography Forums is the website for photographers and all who love great photos, camera and post processing techniques, gear talk, discussion and sharing. Professionals, hobbyists, newbies and those who don't even own a camera -- all are welcome regardless of skill, favourite brand, gear, gender or age. Registering and usage is free.