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FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting 
Thread started 19 Jul 2012 (Thursday) 22:24
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Phottix Strato II Fires Flash Rapidly????

 
Ralph ­ III
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Jul 19, 2012 22:24 |  #1

Hello,
I just purchase a set of Photix Strato II wireless trigger & receiver and have a question.

I have two flashes btw, a Metz 48 AF-1 and a Yongnuo 468.

If I have the Phottix transmitter mounted in the camera hot shoe with the Yongnuo flash in it (hence on camera flash) with the Metz 48 AF-1 off camera, the Metz will fire rapidly for about 8 low power flashes or so with a half push of shutter?

What could be causing that as there is no issue when flashes are reversed.

Thanks,
Ralph

P.S. Great triggers, btw.


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MrScott
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Jul 20, 2012 01:47 |  #2

Not sure what camera you have, but if you push the DOF preview buttton does it look exactly the same? Does it happen every time?




  
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Ralph ­ III
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Jul 20, 2012 10:35 |  #3

MrScott wrote in post #14743274 (external link)
Not sure what camera you have, but if you push the DOF preview buttton does it look exactly the same? Does it happen every time?

I have a Canon 40d. I never use the DOF preview button and not sure of the correlation?

A) If I have the Strato II transmitter in the camera hotshoe, with the Metz 48
AF-1 setup as an off-camera flash, it acts and fires normally.

B) However, if I add my Yongnuo flash into the Stratto II's transmitter(on
camera) the Metz flash will then fire rapidly for about 6 to 8 flashes with the
push of the shutter button. It is very similar to how the pop up flash will fire in
assisting with focus in dim lighting.

Ralph


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dedsen
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Jul 20, 2012 12:40 |  #4

Ralph III wrote in post #14744544 (external link)
I have a Canon 40d. I never use the DOF preview button and not sure of the correlation?
Ralph

The correlation is that the DOF preview button defaults to being the modeling light trigger on Canon cameras. My guess is that you are pressing it by accident and since there is not real modeling light on a flash, it fires a series of flashes just like you describe. This is generally the case when this question is asked.



  
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Ralph ­ III
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Jul 20, 2012 14:34 |  #5

dedsen wrote in post #14745127 (external link)
The correlation is that the DOF preview button defaults to being the modeling light trigger on Canon cameras. My guess is that you are pressing it by accident and since there is not real modeling light on a flash, it fires a series of flashes just like you describe. This is generally the case when this question is asked.

Thanks for the input but it's not a matter of accidental pushing of the DOF button. Even when holding the camera that never occurs as my left hand is always on the lens.

In this case I've been testing the setup with the camera sitting on a counter, so all I'm touching is the shutter button.

I don't know what you mean a flash doesn't have a modeling light? My Metz does have that feature which can be activated even when not mounted to a camera, Speedlights.com (external link). I've tried adjusting the Metz with various default setting (ML = "off") but still the same result.

Any other suggestions?

Ralph


P.S. UPDATE: It has something to do with the 40d setup apparently, as that setup works fine with my 20d? The off-camera Metz even flashes once, when I turn off the on-camera Yongnuo flash. So it is receiving some additinal signals of sort...


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dedsen
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Jul 20, 2012 15:25 |  #6

I mean a real modeling light. As in a separate bulb. Not some contrived BS operation that pulses the flash tube. I have not used a Metz but I see no mention of a separate modeling light bulb, so I have to assume your Metz has the second choice as do all the flashes that I have ever seen.



  
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Ralph ­ III
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Jul 20, 2012 17:26 |  #7

dedsen wrote in post #14745843 (external link)
I mean a real modeling light. As in a separate bulb. Not some contrived BS operation that pulses the flash tube. I have not used a Metz but I see no mention of a separate modeling light bulb, so I have to assume your Metz has the second choice as do all the flashes that I have ever seen.

Dedsen I'm simply trying to trouble shoot an issue. The DOF button and the flash modeling light (feature if you wish) was brought up by you and Mr. Scott...

I don't know why you now want to debate the effectiveness of a flashes modeling light feature? It is what it is. I suppose some folks find it useful as otherwise major manufacturers such as Canon, Nikon, or Metz wouldn't incorporate it. The Metz 58 AF-2 actually comes with a secondary light and obviously better than my 48 AF-1.

None of those specifics matter. There is however something different about my 40d and 20d in regards.

Thanks,
Ralph


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dedsen
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Jul 20, 2012 17:52 |  #8

Hey sorry to bother you. It will not happen again. Good luck figuring out how to correctly work your equipment. :)



  
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Ralph ­ III
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Jul 21, 2012 00:40 |  #9

dedsen wrote in post #14746468 (external link)
Hey sorry to bother you. It will not happen again. Good luck figuring out how to correctly work your equipment. :)

No need in being so touchy Dedsen and I know how to use the equipment, btw.;)

I however didn't manufacture any of it. Are you able to explain what the difference is between the two camera's, that the 40d causes a modeling sequence of flashes whereas the 20d doesn't?

Thanks,
Ralph


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CliveyBoy
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Jul 21, 2012 01:12 |  #10

Ralph, you should listen. Your description of the "fault" reads like the output of the modelling light. It is a common question here, so of course it is suggested as a cause. You have given no evidence that you have familiarised yourself with the behaviour of the modelling light.

The fact that two camera bodies behave differently supports our diagnosis. But you will already have checked your camera manuals and the custom function settings for button re-assignment.

Can the Metz produce the modelling light? Can the YN-468?


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CliveyBoy
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Jul 21, 2012 02:38 |  #11

Do I have this right?
20D - no modeling light trigger.
40D - Dof button acts as modelling light trigger; can be re-assigned with some flashes.
YN-468 - no modelling light.
48 AF-1 - has modelling light.
40D + 48 AF-1 = unrecognised behaviour.
Hand on lens = unperceived pressure on DOF button = modeling light emitted.

Another explanation - 48 AF-1 is in Multi mode at about 8Hz.


Clive, and Great G/D Abbie
50D; 580EXII, 430EXII, 550EX, YN685EX; YN-622C II, YN622C-TX and YN560-TX controllers TOYUG II v5.10 YN622 System Guide (external link)
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Ralph ­ III
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Jul 21, 2012 10:22 |  #12

Hey CliveyBoy,

I am listening to the suggestions being given and always appreciate such! One of the posters however resorted to unrelated and derisive comments when I was simply trying to address an inquiry he himself made. I'm just interested in solving the problem and not debating the effectiveness of a flashes modeling feature. That's all I was trying to say.

I will try to answer your questions (in red) though.

=CliveyBoy;14747982]Do I have this right?
20D - no modeling light trigger (I just purchased the 20d as a backup to my 40d, so cannot say. It's also a feature that I don't use and never have)

40D - Dof button acts as modelling light trigger; can be re-assigned with some flashes. (that's what I understand and as other's have stated)

YN-468 - no modelling light. (correct)

48 AF-1 - has modelling light. (it has the standard flash modeling light feature, correct)

40D + 48 AF-1 = unrecognised behaviour. (only with the 48 AF-1 placed off-camera with the Yongnuo on-camera. Otherwise everything works properly)

Hand on lens = unperceived pressure on DOF button = modeling light emitted.
(Not Applicable. I'm testing these with the camera sitting on a counter and only touching the shutter button)

Another explanation - 48 AF-1 is in Multi mode at about 8Hz. (It doesn't have stroboscopic ability but that's what the issue is acting like. I'm setting it to Manual mode for off camera)

I've reset both the 40d and Metz flash to defaults to no avail. The setup (Metz off-camera, Yongnuo on-camera) works perfectly on the 20d. However, use the same setup on the 40d and the Metz fires rapidly (low power)? Somehow the 40d is sending additional signals that the Metz acts upon. Features or setup that apparently the 20d and Yongnuo don't possess?

Ralph


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CliveyBoy
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Jul 21, 2012 18:05 |  #13

Hi, Ralph. Thanks for describing your tests in more detail. You seem to have established the precise circumstances that produce the effect.

The reference I looked at said that the Metz 48 AF-1 does Multi, but accept that it doesn't.

I do not have the Strato triggers, but my Pixel Kings try to build up a map of the attached gear and act appropriately. They do not always get it right.

The biggest problem is with the hotshoe/hotfoot, which today is stretched way beyond its suitable use. Dirt, looseness and improper mounting cause many problems, and can be remedied by the user. Differences in engineering dimensions can produce mismatches. I'd check the Strato shoe and Metz foot, looking for any risk of intermittent contact, particularly on the rear pins. Then thre Stato case would be opened and the connections to the shoe checked. The more advanced these devices get, the more they require perfect conditions.

Oh, and batteries. Another major problem. Quite often, the batteries in new units are barely functional (low cost), and should be replaced on arrival.


Clive, and Great G/D Abbie
50D; 580EXII, 430EXII, 550EX, YN685EX; YN-622C II, YN622C-TX and YN560-TX controllers TOYUG II v5.10 YN622 System Guide (external link)
I tried retiring, but gave it up - it's a dead end

  
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MrScott
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Jul 21, 2012 18:54 |  #14

questions, does it happen when the lens is in manual focus? Does it happen in AF servo?




  
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Ralph ­ III
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Jul 21, 2012 22:02 |  #15

MrScott wrote in post #14749991 (external link)
questions, does it happen when the lens is in manual focus? Does it happen in AF servo?

Hey MrScott,
I tried several different settings, including manual focus, but not AF servo. That's a good thought, I will try various settings and post back.

Ralph


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Phottix Strato II Fires Flash Rapidly????
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