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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 08 Jul 2012 (Sunday) 03:40
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7D - Sports & Wildlife

 
stsva
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Aug 21, 2012 13:08 |  #16

propolis wrote in post #14886953 (external link)
Hi,

Just came back from safari and did not use the 7D, as even just auto pictures of nature had bits not focussed. We bought a small pocket camera, canon and then took the same picture with the 7d.

The small camera had everything in focus and good colour to the image. The 7d picture has some bit blurred, like depth of field was very shallow, e.g. 2 trees about 18 inches behind the first one was out of focus or blurred. On the small camera it was all in focus.

So I think its back to reading and trying the camera more before going on the next safari trip next year

Eddie :)

In general the smaller the sensor the greater the depth of field, so it's not surprising the pocket cam would have more depth of field than the 7D. Try posting some 7D samples with 100% crops showing where you think there are problems - include the full shooting info. - focal length, f-stop, shutter speed, and ISO, along with what focus mode you used (AI Servo, One Shot) and how you were using your focus points (all 19 active, selected one, etc.).

Also, take a look at this depth of field calculator to get a feeling for what you can realistically expect from your 7D:
http://www.dofmaster.c​om/dofjs.html (external link) It might be that the "fix" is something as simple as stopping down from a large aperture (say f/2.8) to a smaller aperture (say f/8 or f/11).


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apersson850
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Aug 21, 2012 19:02 as a reply to  @ stsva's post |  #17

What you see is what to expect from a "real" camera like the 7D, and even more if you had bought yourself a camera with a larger sensor, like a 5D Mark III or similar.
Learn to use the shallow depth of field to your advantage. It makes it possible to show what you consider being important in an image, by blurring less important things.


Anders

  
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itzmered
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Aug 21, 2012 20:03 |  #18

This has been an informative thread. I just upgraded to the 7d and am learning.


Chris ~
Canon 7d gripped |24 - 105L| Sigma 150 - 500 OS

  
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wayne.robbins
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Aug 23, 2012 23:54 |  #19

This sounds more like "a recipe for disappointment" thread than anything else.
Post #15- "Here's the difference between a smaller sensor and a larger sensor "...

"Recipe for disappointment" Rush out, purchase an expensive camera because "it's good for sports and wildlife"- which it is. Then jump into a safari with very little practice or time to learn the camera and put it thru the paces - i.e. using it in a similar manner to which you will be using it during the safari. In the Army, there used to be a saying about "practice like you fight, fight like you practice" - meaning here- if you expect to be taking pictures like "this" or "that"- then that is how you should practice and get better- is by practicing it in advance. Anything short of that- is a recipe for disappointment. Simple..

So, if you are planning to go to take some pics of your kids on stage- without flash- and you go to the park - mid-day to practice beforehand ... Not gonna help much. Planning on a night out on the town - in NYC- shooting pictures of your remote inside the house- probably is not going to help.
The 7D - it's going to take time to master- and the best way to master it - is to practice what you want to be prepared for- beforehand. Don't worry- we've been there beforehand- all of us- where we thought we knew what we needed to know- and got there- and found out we didn't.


EOS 5D III, EOS 7D,EOS Rebel T4i, Canon 70-200 f/2.8 IS II, Canon 24-105L, Canon 18-135 IS STM, 1.4x TC III, 2.0x TC III, Σ 50mm f/1.4, Σ 17-50 OS, Σ 70-200 OS, Σ 50-500 OS, Σ 1.4x TC, Σ 2.0x TC, 580EXII(3), Canon SX-40, Canon S100
Fond memories: Rebel T1i, Canon 18-55 IS, Canon 55-250 IS, 18-135 IS (Given to a good home)...

  
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huntersdad
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Aug 24, 2012 07:01 |  #20

Here you go (albeit, late): http://www.deepgreenph​otography.com …ing-up-your-new-canon-7d/ (external link)


Facebook (external link)

http://WWW.BLENDEDLIGH​TPHOTOGRAPHY.COM (external link)
1DxII x 2 / 24-70L II / 70-200L II / 85 1.4L / 300 II / AD600Pros

  
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Aug 26, 2012 05:29 |  #21

Unless you can explain why a wider gamut can be useful, and when it is not useful, I would recommend totally ignoring the recommendation on this page to shoot in aRGB and leave your camera in sRGB.


Frank Hollis - Retired mass spectroscopist
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rx7speed
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Aug 26, 2012 11:18 |  #22

Hollis if you know why not share with us?


digital: 7d 70-200L 2.8 IS MKII, 17-55 2.8 IS

  
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hollis_f
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Aug 26, 2012 12:07 |  #23

rx7speed wrote in post #14908599 (external link)
Hollis if you know why not share with us?

I would if I could, but I don't understand the topic of different colour spaces well enough to explain it. However, I do know that using the wrong colour space is responsible for a lot of people complaining about their images looking washed out.


Frank Hollis - Retired mass spectroscopist
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DutchVince
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Aug 26, 2012 14:06 as a reply to  @ hollis_f's post |  #24

My settings for my 7D for BIF. The % of keepers is very high :)
This should definitely work for sports, since people tend to be bigger and slower than the birds I shoot.

All settings saved under C1 (this is such an excellent feature!)

1. Use Zone AF or single point with expansion. Don't use 19 pointAF, it seems slower.
2. Use AI servo (AI focus reacts slower)
3. Auto ISO
4. Tv 1/1500
(5. Overexpose 1.5 stop [only for BIF])
6. Hi speed continuous shooting

7. Custom functions: CFN III
No.1: slightly slow or totally slow.
No.2: 0
No.3: 1
No.4: 1

8: turn IS of: there is no hand tremor at 1/1500 anyway.

for explanations on the custom functions see:
http://cpn.canon-europe.com …om_functions_ex​plained.do (external link)
Pages 4 and 5. (can't hotlink to the correct pages)

Example using these settings:

IMAGE: http://www.allalin.nl/photogallery/images/20110105202207__mg_5856w900.jpg

7D|400D|10-22|60 Macro|18-55|100-400L|600
Or: just about anything from real close to infinity
Mac Pro|calibrated Eizo monitor
Some of my photo's: http://www.allalin.nl/​photogallery/ (external link)

  
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rx7speed
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Aug 26, 2012 15:49 |  #25

hollis_f wrote in post #14908816 (external link)
I would if I could, but I don't understand the topic of different colour spaces well enough to explain it. However, I do know that using the wrong colour space is responsible for a lot of people complaining about their images looking washed out.

fair enough. I admit I don't know much at all myself and I generally just leave it is sRGB just because that is what it defaulted to. don't know enough about the other spaces to use them.


digital: 7d 70-200L 2.8 IS MKII, 17-55 2.8 IS

  
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philmar
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Aug 26, 2012 23:11 |  #26

amfoto1's post #5 deserves recognition for being an incredibly detailed and helpful post. Sir, you are what makes the internet great!!


A photo I took HERE published in National GeographicTime on your hands? Then HERE'S plenty more photos to nibble on (external link):
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propolis
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Aug 29, 2012 10:59 as a reply to  @ philmar's post |  #27

Hi,

I have found lots of great information in these post and the external links.
Also bought a book for some guidance and will be starting a photograpy course in 1.5 months time

One if the lenses I used before (which is a Sigma which is a 70 - 200mm 2.8) with my old camera stopped working on the 7D - send it in and is not repairable.

So as I am doing sports and wildlife, I would like to hear members recommendations for a good lens 200 - 300 mm

As this will be an investment, it will either be a zoom or prime, again, I will take advise on that.

Eddie :)




  
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propolis
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Aug 29, 2012 11:30 |  #28

amfoto1 wrote in post #14687245 (external link)
7D is not a beginner oriented camera... it seems to be designed with fairly experienced shooters in mind. It takes some time and effort to learn to use it... and then it can perform quite well.

My best suggestion to get you up and shooting quickly is to keep it really simple...

Use One Shot and AI Servo normally.... One Shot for stationary subjects and AI Servo for moving subjects.

I suggest mostly to use Single Point AF and select the point manually... probably the center point most of the time (though don't hesitate to use any of the others, all 19 are the better dual-axis/cross-type). This leaves you in control of the AF, not leaving it up to the camera to decide where to focus (Expansion Points, Zone Focus, Auto/All Points all leave a lot to the camera, but they have their uses in some specialized situations).

Yes, the first thing to do is go into the Custom Function, to Autofocus/Drive, C.Fn III - 6... and enable all the options there (two or three will already be enabled).

Next go to C.Fn III - 1 and set AI Servo tracking sensitivity one notch toward "slow". This determines how fast the AF jumps from one subject to another... it doesn't slow down AF. With practice using the camera, you might be able to turn it back up. Also, if shooting a subject that changes direction a lot, with few or no obstructions, you might be able to turn it up a notch toward "fast".

I suggest using Single Point, manually selected, most of the time. Probably the center point mostly... but the others are usable and you can navigate to them normally.

Spot Focus might be useful, too. It uses a smaller AF point, for greater precision. It's also a single point, but Canon doesn't recommend using it all the time because it's a bit slower tracking movement. I mostly use it for stationary subjects and One Shot. But, some people use it successfully with AI Servo and moving subjects... It probably depends upon your lens, as well as the ambient condition... light levels, subject contrast and detail.

The times I find Expansion Points and Zone Focus most useful is when there is a single subject against a plain background... for example a bird in flight against a blue or solid overcast sky, or a few distant clouds. If using a long lens relatively close, be sure to set an f-stop that will cover wingtip to wingtip, have plenty of depth of field, so that if the camera chooses to focus on the closest wingtip you won't have the rest of the bird OOF.

Back Button Focus (external link) really helps with action photography and makes it possible to leave the camera in AI Servo all the time (you can use it just like One Shot, except lift pressure off the rear button when focus is achieved if you want to use a focus/recompose method for example). 7D is highly configurable, to set up BBF, for example, you can go into the Custom Function menu, Operation Others, C.Fn IV-1.... change the shutter release button to "metering only" in the half=press position, leave AF-On button at it's default setting. Or you can switch AF-On button function with the */AE Lock button function, if you wish.

Two other things often mistaken for focusing problems....

7D uses a very densely packed sensor... which might make it more susceptible to camera shake, a little more likely to blur an image due to movement. In a white paper Canon recommended using a little higher shutter speeds whenever possible... Using mirror lockup and other stabilizing methods when it's not possible. I just use a stop higher ISO than I was in the habit of using with previous cameras.

Also, 7D uses a strong anti-alias filter, to prevent moire with such a densely packed sensor (it has twice as many pixel sites per square mm as 5DII/III, for example).... So 7D images tend to need more sharpening than images from many earlier cameras. If you shoot JPEGs, dial up in-camera sharpening. If you shoot RAW, dial up sharpening in post-production (unless using Canon DPP and letting the software use the in-camera settings to process images).

Keep it simple, it will take a while to learn a lot of the 7D's modes.

You have to learn to trust the camera... It's very fast focusing and the two I've been using for a couple years now very seldom let me down (still miss a few... but it's hard to say if it's me or the camera in a lot of cases).

Oh, and in One Shot you won't see the AF point blink red Focus Confirmation when focus is achieved (the green LED will light, and if you have it enabled you'll get the audible "beep").... This is because of the transmissive LCD used for focus screen. You can use Autofocus/Drive C.Fn III - 8 VF display illumination set to 1:Enable to turn on a red flash overall, if you want it. (Default is "auto" which will only work under certain conditions).

On 7D and all Canon for that matter, there is no Focus Confirmation in AI Servo (can't be, it's continuously focusing) so this doesn't matter. But a lot of people coming from other cameras are accustomed to seeing the selected AF point(s) blink red momentarily to indication AF start when in AI Servo mode. You won't see that in 7D. The selected AF point(s) are the only ones displayed on the 7D's focus screen. On other cameras, all AF points are displayed all the time. On 7D, only the active one(s), are shown as black boxes. Once accustomed to it, you can tell immediately what mode and selection you have set... just don't expect it to blink at you.

One tool I find very handy is the "on demand" grid in the viewfinder... it really helps me keep my horizons level and vertical objects vertical! To enable the grid in the viewfinder, you need to go into the menu, the second Yellow Wrench tab, it's at the bottom of the list. (There is another grid display choice in the fourth Red Camera menu tab, but that's the one for Live View on the rear LCD monitor).

Finally, coming from a 10MP camera you might be in the habit of viewing your image files at 100% on your computer monitor. If you do the same with 7D, the much larger 18MP images will actually be displayed far larger and you'll be looking at them much more critically. So they might actually appear "worse". Don't expect them to be "better" unless you scale things the same way: Either back off to about 50% when viewing the 7D files, or resize them to the same dimensions of the images from the 10MP camera, if you want to compare.


Thank you for all the information provided :)

Eddie




  
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stsva
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Aug 29, 2012 12:51 |  #29

propolis wrote in post #14922016 (external link)
Hi,

I have found lots of great information in these post and the external links.
Also bought a book for some guidance and will be starting a photograpy course in 1.5 months time

One if the lenses I used before (which is a Sigma which is a 70 - 200mm 2.8) with my old camera stopped working on the 7D - send it in and is not repairable.

So as I am doing sports and wildlife, I would like to hear members recommendations for a good lens 200 - 300 mm

As this will be an investment, it will either be a zoom or prime, again, I will take advise on that.

Eddie :)

For zooms up to 200mm, any of the various Canon EF 70-200mm L lenses would be excellent, but some are more expensive than others. They range from the f/4 non-IS at about $600 new through the f/2.8 IS II at about $2,200, with the f/4 IS, f/2.8 non-IS, and f/2.8 IS in between at around $1,200, $1,400, and $2,000 respectively. IS is helpful for handheld shots, as it helps eliminate blur from camera movement, but it will not help with blur from subject movement; camera movement will be less of an issue if shooting from a tripod. The f/2.8s have somewhat better (one stop) low-light capability than the f/4s, which may or may not be important to you.

For zooms up to 300mm, the Canon EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6L has a good reputation; there are some recent threads here on POTN discussing its image quality, and most seemed to conclude that it is very good. It runs for about $1,400.

You might also consider the EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS, which sells for about $1,600. This will give you more range than the 200-300mm lenses, and is a very well thought of lens for nature/wildlife photography.

Canon also has well-regarded primes at 200mm and 300mm ranging in price from around $800 up to about $7,200.

Zooms are more flexible than primes, and the zooms listed above have excellent image quality that in some cases may equal that of equivalent primes (e.g., the EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II). On the other hand, primes may be somewhat smaller and lighter than the equivalent zoom, and sometimes may have better image quality.


Some Canon stuff and a little bit of Yongnuo.
http://www.pbase.com/s​tsva/profile (external link)
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Submariner
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Aug 31, 2012 15:17 as a reply to  @ stsva's post |  #30

I have a 70-300L F4 IS USM and I think it is brilliant value. Great Optics, very compact, brilliant build for the £'s, super fast AF, Water/dustproof, IS works fabulously, not tooooo heavy.

Just love it to bits. Big advantage is I needed a 24-70 L IS USM as well, which in the UK is £2,300. So the good price on the 70-300L £1,090 [LIST price £1600] was very helpful in the overall budget.

Only negatives
1. you may need to listen to the BIF guys as maybe it's not long enough.
2. The tripod ring is extra and a complete rip off [ranges from £130 to £190] but needed!

Other recommendationis the 40mm Pancake - trust me you won't regret it!


Canon EOS 5DS R, Canon EF 70-200 F2.8 L Mk II IS USM, Canon EF 70-300 F4-5.6 L IS USM, EF 40mm F2.8 STM , RC6 Remote. Canon STE-3 Radio Flash Controller, Canon 600 EX RT x4 , YN 560 MkII x2 ; Bowens GM500PRO x4 , Bowens Remote Control. Bowens Pulsar TX, RX Radio Transmitter and Reciever Cards. Bowens Constant 530 Streamlights 600w x 4 Sold EOS 5D Mk III, 7D, EF 50mm F1.8, 430 EX Mk II, Bowens GM500Rs x4

  
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7D - Sports & Wildlife
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