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Thread started 09 Sep 2012 (Sunday) 12:02
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Full-frame, fixed-lens Sony RX1 leaked!!

 
rjx
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Sep 13, 2012 06:27 |  #61

ching wrote in post #14980584 (external link)
Owning the smallest FF camera in the world, Priceless!!! :lol:

:lol:

Billginthekeys wrote in post #14980588 (external link)
With this..... you are going to have a very expensive and quality lens always attached to what will eventually become an outdated system, and have to buy a new body and new lens to get the latest tech.

Says who? Is a digital camera that’s been recently replaced all of a sudden a piece of junk? No.
Can a 450D not record great images? It can.
When it comes to photography, sometimes we put too much emphasis on technology. We split hairs over the smallest differences only we the photographer can decipher, sometimes only at 100% crops.

I understand acquiring new gear is fun and the rapid development in technology is usually a good thing. But seriously, how much technology do we as photographers really need that's not already being produced?

Modern cameras + modern lenses + good photographic technique + basic post production techniques can pretty much already produce images that are sharper than anyone really needs. We can take great high iso photos with great detail and clean it up quickly in post. Just because a camera gets replaced with a newer model doesn't mean you're going to create better pictures with the new model. It doesn't mean your camera that was capable of creating amazing images will not be able to create amazing images once the replacement comes out. We as photographers might notice a slight difference from one lens to the other, or one camera to the other, but the viewer looking at our work won't be able to tell (or probably care) what gear was used.

When is enough actually enough?

It’s ironic (to me) that when I routinely seek out great photography on flickr, I’m seeing more film users, and often surprised when I find a great image and realize it was taken with an iphone. In fact, many pros are shooting often using an iphone for fun and their fans love it. And it seems like more people are buying these state of the art DSLR’s with the newest tech and using software to degrade the image quality, emulating the characteristics of film. I can’t even grasp how many fashion campaigns I’ve viewed in the last 6 months where image quality was anything but perfect. And those photographers are using great full frame and medium format cameras.

Many immature comments how this camera is worthless, crippled, etc. This camera won’t fit the needs for everybody, no such camera exists. But for those that will utilize this camera, it seems to me they’ll be rewarded. This camera will be great for wedding photographers, street photographers, documentary photographers, event photographers and anyone else that wants a high quality, unobtrusive 35mm camera.

Yes, a used 5D2 + 35L might be more practical for some people. But for the types of photography I mentioned above, a smaller, less obtrusive high end camera can make all the difference in the world, especially for street photography. Otto Schulze, one of my favorite wedding photographers supplements his DSLR and MF kit with a Leica M9 because of how the people are more comfortable in front of a smaller, more compact camera. Yes, they know he’s the photographer and that he’s taking pictures. But the subjects are more in their natural state and not worried about some big camera pointed at them.

In 4+ years when they’re on version 3 of this camera, the RX1 mki will still be able to record breathtaking images, regardless of what the current tech is.


"It doesn't matter what camera you have if your photography has nothing worthwhile to say"
“Photos are everywhere. You just have to know how to look.”

  
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Billginthekeys
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Sep 13, 2012 07:37 |  #62

rjx wrote in post #14984919 (external link)
Says who? Is a digital camera that’s been recently replaced all of a sudden a piece of junk? No.
Can a 450D not record great images? It can.
When it comes to photography, sometimes we put too much emphasis on technology. We split hairs over the smallest differences only we the photographer can decipher, sometimes only at 100% crops.

Okay, here is the thing, in many ways I agree with you. I still have and shoot my original 20D on occassion. It still takes pictures just as well today as it did then. If it broke tomorrow would I go out and spent $1,200 again on another 20D? No. Not because it is a bad camera now, but now the technology is just so much better in new cameras for the same money. Like it or not the same thing will eventually happen to the RX1, yes in 5 years it will still take just as good of pictures as it will today, but it will become outdated. Just like the 5D3, the D800, 1DX, ect. some day, in the future, some people (not me or you it sounds like) will laugh at them and call them outdated and terrible compared to whatever is out at the time. It will happen, I've watched it happen to the 1D MKII, MKIII, 1Ds MKII, 5D, even lately the 5D MKII. All at one time objects of pure photographic legend, the stuff of dreams for an amateur.

Glass on the other hand is largely timless. I have the same 17-40mm F4L, the second lens I ever bought, that has lived on four camera bodies (20D, 1Dc, 1DIII, 5D) in the past 7 years. Heck, plenty of people have 50 year old lenses from long obsolete systems they are still using; some that they have owned since new. Great optics can be passed down over and over.

So, in short, quality glass is almost ageless, digital technology moves extremely rapidly, so it just doesn't make a ton of sense to glue the two together.

Plus in another year they will have an interchangable version for probably similar money and the problem will be solved. As usual, it costs a lot to be an early adopter. In the case your friend is a professional, and it could be a tool that he can justify and depreciate for his living, which is great, but is not what everyone can do.


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andrikos
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Sep 13, 2012 08:51 |  #63

The more I read about this, the less it makes sense to me...

A $3,500 "high end" camera solution that
CANNOT
and
WILL NOT
do:

Macro/ supermacro
Ultrawideangle
Wideangle
Sports
Wildlife
Low light photography (only f/2 and Sony is not exactly renowned for its high ISO capabilities)
birds in flight
medium telephoto
telephoto
supertelephoto
Tilt/Shift

and many many more...

Other than that, it's fantastic!


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ching
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Sep 13, 2012 09:01 |  #64

Lecia M9 can't do all on the list plus no AF :p
They are doomed! :lol:

andrikos wrote in post #14985289 (external link)
The more I read about this, the less it makes sense to me...

A $3,500 "high end" camera solution that
CANNOT
and
WILL NOT
do:

Macro/ supermacro
Ultrawideangle
Wideangle
Sports
Wildlife
Low light photography (only f/2 and Sony is not exactly renowned for its high ISO capabilities)
birds in flight
medium telephoto
telephoto
supertelephoto
Tilt/Shift

and many many more...

Other than that, it's fantastic!


Nikon D800

  
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andrikos
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Sep 13, 2012 09:08 |  #65

ching wrote in post #14985328 (external link)
Lecia M9 can't do all on the list plus no AF :p
They are doomed! :lol:

Not true, you can change lenses with a Leica.
That was my whole point.


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cptrios
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Sep 13, 2012 09:30 |  #66

I think people are really missing the fact (mentioned briefly on page 1, then forgotten) that this is pretty much Sony's version of the X100. It's a glorified prototype that they likely don't expect to sell all that well but offers an important proof of concept for future products. Yes, it's significantly overpriced, and they'd sell about 50x more of them if it were $1799 (including to yours truly), but it's also an insanely small full-frame camera. It's substantially smaller than even the M9 (ignoring the lens, of course). The ridiculous pricing of the accessories ($599 for the OVF????) just rams the point home that Sony is aiming just under the Leica crowd and really doesn't care about mass-market appeal.

For those harping on a "lack of manual control" and saying it's a P&S - the thing's got an aperture ring, two rear adjustment wheels, and a dedicated EV dial. How much more manual control do you need? And if you wanted a 35/1.4...the lens that's on there now is already impressively small for a 35/2 with AF that has to deal with what's most certainly an incredibly short flange distance.

All that being said, I sort of can't believe that I'm actually sitting here defending Sony. I do like my NEX-7, but pretty much everything else in the NEX system that isn't a camera is awful. Plus, they abandoned us NEX-7 users more or less the day after the camera became available. So I'll end with this: I'm almost positive that the RX-1 will have terrible field curvature problems and therefore be pretty much worthless.


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andrikos
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Sep 13, 2012 09:40 |  #67

This product reminds me of the "Sony Qualia" projector line (HT: another expensive hobby! :) )

In 2004, Sony introduced the first 1080p projector (an 80lb behemoth) for the fantastic price of $30k! The plan for Sony was to introduce a bunch of high class components carrying the Qualia name including a $2k 2MP (!!!) P&...
Needless to say, the insanity lasted a couple of years and the whole Qualia line was scrapped...


Ahhh, Sony, will you ever learn....


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KenjiS
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Sep 13, 2012 14:43 |  #68

cptrios wrote in post #14985460 (external link)
Plus, they abandoned us NEX-7 users more or less the day after the camera became available. So I'll end with this: I'm almost positive that the RX-1 will have terrible field curvature problems and therefore be pretty much worthless.

3 new lenses and a new body is abandoning you? ;)


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cptrios
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Sep 13, 2012 19:19 |  #69

KenjiS wrote in post #14986828 (external link)
3 new lenses and a new body is abandoning you? ;)

NEX-7 users, I said :D. It's the only advanced camera I've ever owned that's never gotten a single firmware update. The new lenses are a good start, though...I have extremely little faith in the pancake zoom having good IQ (I'm all over it if it does), but the 35/1.8 is the very first Sony E-mount lens I've ever been truly interested in buying. A step in the right direction.


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KenjiS
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Sep 13, 2012 20:12 |  #70

cptrios wrote in post #14987821 (external link)
NEX-7 users, I said :D. It's the only advanced camera I've ever owned that's never gotten a single firmware update. The new lenses are a good start, though...I have extremely little faith in the pancake zoom having good IQ (I'm all over it if it does), but the 35/1.8 is the very first Sony E-mount lens I've ever been truly interested in buying. A step in the right direction.

I dismissed the 10-18 at first but came around to realize its possibly the neatest lens of the three, a 15-27mm(equiv) fixed aperture zoom is nothing to sneeze at, especially at only $850, if its pretty sharp and has good distortion control that is


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whtchocla7e
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Sep 13, 2012 21:06 |  #71

Haters gonna hate.
:)




  
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rjx
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Sep 13, 2012 21:20 |  #72

whtchocla7e wrote in post #14988245 (external link)
Haters gonna hate.
:)

Hating on a camera that's not even released yet! LOL


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“Photos are everywhere. You just have to know how to look.”

  
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Full-frame, fixed-lens Sony RX1 leaked!!
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