Approve the Cookies
This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and our Privacy Policy.
OK
Index  •   • New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Guest
New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Register to forums    Log in

 
FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 13 Oct 2012 (Saturday) 12:00
Search threadPrev/next
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

Canon 400mm II & 500mm II?

 
MikeV99
Senior Member
251 posts
Joined Sep 2007
     
Oct 13, 2012 12:00 |  #1

I tested the 400mm II in May and was very impressed with it. I have the 800mm f/5.6 lens and am thinking about getting a middle lens (also have the 70-200mm f/2.8 II). I am sorta stuck between the new 500mm and the 400mm.

500mm II - slower (f/4), longer reach, less weight, longer body, less expensive than the 400mm II.

[Edit: Forgot to consider lens speed] I would have thought the 500mm II would cost more than the 400mm II - anyone have thoughts about the pricing?

The shorter length of the 400mm II is appealing when trying to pack for flying with a 800 & 70-200 and two camera bodies.

Comments?

Thanks

Mike


.
-- Mike -- The older the boy, the bigger and costlier the toys!

:) My Gear List :)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)
LBaldwin
Goldmember
Avatar
4,490 posts
Likes: 2
Joined Mar 2006
Location: San Jose,CA
     
Oct 13, 2012 12:12 |  #2

Hi Mke, tough problem to have ;)

I have the 400 (original non IS) and have use the 500 quite a bit too. The issue is reach vs speed. the 400 is 2.8, the 500 is f4. In your photography do you use the 1.4 II or the 2x at all? if so then the 400 is the answer. If max MTF sharpness is the goal then either will work, but the 400 is sharper but just a tad. The reason I like the 500 is the reduced weight and the extra 100mm. But these days I shoot almost exclusively on tripod/Wimberely II combo. If you shoot sports then the 400 is king, if you shoot birds then the 500 may be what you want. Can you rent from your location?


Les Baldwin
http://www.fotosfx.com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
MikeV99
THREAD ­ STARTER
Senior Member
251 posts
Joined Sep 2007
     
Oct 13, 2012 14:20 |  #3

Um, good point, I did not consider the lens speed. I do mostly wildlife and birds. If I need a big reach, the 800 jumps in. I used the 400 II in May (rental) in St. Augustine and other FL locations and found the f/2.8 speed to be useful. Although the 1D4 has nice ISO abilities, sometimes 2.8 is very useful at daybreak. I am like you, tripod with gimbal (Mongoose 3.6) pretty much all the time.

When I rent it has to be via UPS. I kinda hate paying rental charges since it does not take too many rentals to make purchase cost effective.

I am trying to get organized for a trip to Africa in January. I envision the 800 on a gimbal on top of the vehicle with another lens on a different body ready to shoot quickly either handheld on top or from a bean bag through a window.

I did do a few handheld shots with the 400, but would not want to do a lot. Besides, I am nowhere near steady enough anymore to do much handheld with anything. So, I am not sure that is a factor for me with the 500.

I had thought about the 300mm II, but found it in my testing to be too close to the 70-200.

So, it is f/2.8, 13.5" & 8.5 lbs. versus f/4.0, 15.1", & 7 lbs.

Mike


.
-- Mike -- The older the boy, the bigger and costlier the toys!

:) My Gear List :)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
LBaldwin
Goldmember
Avatar
4,490 posts
Likes: 2
Joined Mar 2006
Location: San Jose,CA
     
Oct 13, 2012 16:51 |  #4

From what I have seen, most africa shoots really only need around 200mm or so. They get the vehicles really close to the animals. Birds are of course a different subject. See if you can talk to the safari guide and get some ideas of distance from subject to camera.


Les Baldwin
http://www.fotosfx.com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
MikeV99
THREAD ­ STARTER
Senior Member
251 posts
Joined Sep 2007
     
Oct 13, 2012 18:03 |  #5

The guide says that almost all his shots use 600mm+.


.
-- Mike -- The older the boy, the bigger and costlier the toys!

:) My Gear List :)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
LBaldwin
Goldmember
Avatar
4,490 posts
Likes: 2
Joined Mar 2006
Location: San Jose,CA
     
Oct 15, 2012 02:01 |  #6

Then I wiuld go by what they say. I've had 3 friends go over and a few from POTN as well and the concensus was that short was OK. Go loaded for bear tho.. I hope you have fun, but don't turn your back on anything that could whack you.. LOL


Les Baldwin
http://www.fotosfx.com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Neilyb
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
5,192 posts
Gallery: 19 photos
Likes: 444
Joined Sep 2005
Location: Munich
     
Oct 15, 2012 03:41 |  #7

Depends where the safari is, alot of Masai Mara drives tend to need 700-800mm as they do not approach the game when it is hunting.

Just bear in mind the 400 with 2xTC will slow the AF considerably.


http://natureimmortal.​blogspot.com (external link)

http://www.natureimmor​tal.com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
mesodan
Senior Member
Avatar
407 posts
Likes: 21
Joined May 2006
Location: Dubai/New Zealand
     
Oct 15, 2012 09:27 |  #8

I reckon the 400L. If you need abit more reach but not 800, the 1.4x would work well with the 400.

800mm is good for cats etc. in Africa, but 400 is all you really need for giraffes, elephants, hippos etc.


5DIV | 16-35L f2.8 III | 24L II | 35L II | 50L | 85L II | 70-200L II | 300L II IS | 1.4x III | 2x III | 580EX II
www.dsw-photo.com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Motor ­ On
Senior Member
Avatar
941 posts
Likes: 50
Joined Feb 2007
     
Oct 15, 2012 09:53 |  #9

400 5.6L? Light enough to hand hold (~200g lighter than the 70-200 IS II) and much easier to back, AF of the prime should be much faster than a 70-200 with a 2x TC, and if you've got the right body, with a 1.4 TC the AF should still work. Would give you 70-200 2.8 then add TC 98-280 f4 then 400 5.6 add TC 560 f8 then 800 5.6 add tc 1120 f8 the price difference between the 5.6 and the 2.8 being enough to put a 1DX on the back that will handle the f8 AF (if you're not already shooting on one). For the specific use you mentioned I wouldn't be so worried about the speed of the lens, as I would if you were doing something like sports, and using the TC will tighten up that DOF. I don't know what you're expecting weather wise but daytime sunny outdoors it should give you a good balance of sufficient speed, weight size and a somewhat even incremental reach, like a well rounded set of golf clubs.


Website (external link) | Facebook (external link) | Instagram (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
MikeV99
THREAD ­ STARTER
Senior Member
251 posts
Joined Sep 2007
     
Oct 15, 2012 10:47 |  #10

Neilyb wrote in post #15123793 (external link)
Depends where the safari is, alot of Masai Mara drives tend to need 700-800mm as they do not approach the game when it is hunting.

Just bear in mind the 400 with 2xTC will slow the AF considerably.

As example of what I was told, these photos (external link) were all (100%) taken at 600+ (Nikon lens) on his 2012 Tanzania trip.

I am taking my 800 and 70-200 f/2.8.

I am trying to decide whether to take a 400/500 II (to have something in between, but which one?) and whether I will need that lens later on. Short term, long term decision. Also, taking an in between lens will give me backup should something go wrong with the 800. I can rent, but for a 3 week trip the cost starts to make me wonder if purchase might not be better.

Mike


.
-- Mike -- The older the boy, the bigger and costlier the toys!

:) My Gear List :)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Madweasel
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
6,223 posts
Likes: 58
Joined Jun 2006
Location: Fareham, UK
     
Oct 15, 2012 11:48 |  #11

Motor On wrote in post #15124704 (external link)
...put a 1DX on the back that will handle the f8 AF ...

I don't believe the 1DX supports f/8 AF.


Mark.

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
WesternGuy
Senior Member
Avatar
774 posts
Likes: 2
Joined Jul 2006
Location: Southern Alberta, Canada
     
Oct 15, 2012 12:22 |  #12

MikeV99 wrote in post #15117754 (external link)
...edited...
I am trying to get organized for a trip to Africa in January. I envision the 800 on a gimbal on top of the vehicle with another lens on a different body ready to shoot quickly either handheld on top or from a bean bag through a window.

Mike

Mike, where are you going in Africa? If you are going to game reserves (sort of like National Parks in US and Canada), then the guides are not allowed to drive off the roads, so your "camera to subject distance" may be small, or can be quite large. I have been to Africa twice in the past two years, the first was to Botswana in a "private reserve" where the guides could go off the main roads and into the grass, and I found that my 100-400 was quite sufficient, although a 500 to 600 would have been quite useful - the zooming capabilities of the 100-400 was the most useful. I also found that I could use my 1.4 or 2.0 (Mk II) teleconverters to some advantage if the subject wasn't moving too much.

My second trip, last month, was to 3 different National Game Reserves in Kenya. Here the guides were restricted to the roads in the park - rangers don't take well to guides who do drive off the roads and they can ban guides from the park if they are caught, so you will not see good guides driving off the roads. This means, as I have said that your "camera to subject" distance can vary considerably. In this case, my 100-400 with the two TCs worked quite well. Again, it would have been nice to have had a 600mm (I do have one on order and will take it next time).

As far as support goes, those of us with long lenses were using bean bags exclusivley. They worked very well because the action can change quite quickly and having you camera mounted on a gimbal, or other support, means you have to take it off and swing to the other side and get the bean bag ready, etc., etc. and I suspect you might lose some shots in the delay, but I did see one jeep with a chap who had a Wimberley on what looked like a Manfrotto clamp mounted on the bar around the viewing port at the top of the jeep - he wasn't using it at the time, but I am assuming, since he was the only one in the jeep, that he could get the guide to turn around to be able to use it as required. Of course, if it rains, which it did most afternoons in the Mare, the gimbal is kind of useless.

As far as bean bags go, make sure you can get "beans" at the camp, or that you can buy some in a local store somewhere. I also used two cameras: 100-400 on one and the 24-105 mounted on the other - made things a lot easier when trying to shoot panos, or just general scenery.

HTH. My 0.02ยข FWIW. Have a great time and enjoy Africa - it is an adventrue, well actually two of them, that I will never forget.

WesternGuy




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
MikeV99
THREAD ­ STARTER
Senior Member
251 posts
Joined Sep 2007
     
Oct 15, 2012 12:23 |  #13

Madweasel wrote in post #15125107 (external link)
I don't believe the 1DX supports f/8 AF.

That is correct, it does not. There is !rumor! of a firmware update in Dec that will add it.

I probably will be using my two 1D4's for a long time.


.
-- Mike -- The older the boy, the bigger and costlier the toys!

:) My Gear List :)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Motor ­ On
Senior Member
Avatar
941 posts
Likes: 50
Joined Feb 2007
     
Oct 15, 2012 14:23 |  #14

Madweasel wrote in post #15125107 (external link)
I don't believe the 1DX supports f/8 AF.

My understanding form this:https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1224821 Was that it does, if you select the proper 1.4x TC.

Even if it doesn't 70-200 (98-280) 400 800 seems be a logical progression. There is also the 400 f4 DO, which could take a 1.4 TC and would be about 40% lighter than the 500 f4, and the 400 f4 plus TC is still 560 f5.6; yet is still heavier than the 400 5.6. The OP hinted lens speed wasn't a primary consideration but size and hand holding are; hence my recommendation, even though they may not be as fast, big or expensive.


Website (external link) | Facebook (external link) | Instagram (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Neilyb
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
5,192 posts
Gallery: 19 photos
Likes: 444
Joined Sep 2005
Location: Munich
     
Oct 15, 2012 14:47 |  #15

http://www.andyrouse.c​o.uk/index.php?link=bl​og (external link)

Check down from 13/09. Andy is a Nikon shooter who took the 1Dx and 800 to the Mara.


http://natureimmortal.​blogspot.com (external link)

http://www.natureimmor​tal.com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

3,656 views & 0 likes for this thread
Canon 400mm II & 500mm II?
FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
AAA
x 1600
y 1600

Jump to forum...   •  Rules   •  Index   •  New posts   •  RTAT   •  'Best of'   •  Gallery   •  Gear   •  Reviews   •  Member list   •  Polls   •  Image rules   •  Search   •  Password reset

Not a member yet?
Register to forums
Registered members may log in to forums and access all the features: full search, image upload, follow forums, own gear list and ratings, likes, more forums, private messaging, thread follow, notifications, own gallery, all settings, view hosted photos, own reviews, see more and do more... and all is free. Don't be a stranger - register now and start posting!


COOKIES DISCLAIMER: This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and to our privacy policy.
Privacy policy and cookie usage info.


POWERED BY AMASS forum software 2.1forum software
version 2.1 /
code and design
by Pekka Saarinen ©
for photography-on-the.net

Latest registered member is gardenchefs
1143 guests, 344 members online
Simultaneous users record so far is 15144, that happened on Nov 22, 2018

Photography-on-the.net Digital Photography Forums is the website for photographers and all who love great photos, camera and post processing techniques, gear talk, discussion and sharing. Professionals, hobbyists, newbies and those who don't even own a camera -- all are welcome regardless of skill, favourite brand, gear, gender or age. Registering and usage is free.