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FORUMS Marketplace & Market Info Market Watch 
Thread started 12 Oct 2012 (Friday) 01:10
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Attention PayPal Users - New Policy Update

 
cdo221
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Oct 12, 2012 01:10 |  #1

There have been many threads about the "necessary evil" that is PayPal but the new policy change seems to make it worse...
https://cms.paypal.com …icies_full&loca​le.x=en_US (external link)

"14.3 Agreement to Arbitrate. You and PayPal each agree that any and all disputes or claims that have arisen or may arise between you and PayPal shall be resolved exclusively through final and binding arbitration, rather than in court, except that you may assert claims in small claims court, if your claims qualify. The Federal Arbitration Act governs the interpretation and enforcement of this Agreement to Arbitrate. "

Basically any disputes with PayPal can no longer be settled in class action law suits - obviously I have no plans or have ever heard of anyone suing PayPal but I do hear stories of PayPal screwing sellers out of their money many times. I think this just gives them even more leverage to "protect the buyer" even in illegitimate cases of scam buyers. Anyway, I guess it's time to switch over to another form of payment?


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dgrPhotos
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Oct 12, 2012 08:07 |  #2

That's not going to stop people from trying.




  
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rick_reno
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Oct 12, 2012 09:20 |  #3

maybe they got dragged into court too many times.




  
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uOpt
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Oct 12, 2012 10:32 |  #4

Saying it doesn't mean they can enforce it. I'm not speculating whether they can one way or another other than saying don't just assume they can.


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isoMorphic
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Oct 15, 2012 19:13 |  #5

As laws change so do terms of engagement and every company out there wants to cover it's assets.

http://en.wikipedia.or​g/wiki/Personal_jurisd​iction (external link)




  
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TeamSpeed
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Oct 15, 2012 21:15 |  #6

Just opt out, as a US citizen, and that Paypal is just a vendor that I use to service funds online, I feel I should never sign off from being able to use our US legal system should paypal become deficient in their services.

'
Opt-Out Procedure.

You can choose to reject this Agreement to Arbitrate ("opt out") by mailing us a written opt-out notice ("Opt-Out Notice"). For new PayPal users, the Opt-Out Notice must be postmarked no later than 30 Days after the date you accept the User Agreement for the first time. If you are already a current PayPal user and previously accepted the User Agreement prior to the introduction of this Agreement to Arbitrate, the Opt-Out Notice must be postmarked no later than December 1, 2012. You must mail the Opt-Out Notice to PayPal, Inc., Attn: Litigation Department, 2211 North First Street, San Jose, CA 95131.

The Opt-Out Notice must state that you do not agree to this Agreement to Arbitrate and must include your name, address, phone number, and the email address(es) used to log in to the PayPal account(s) to which the opt-out applies. You must sign the Opt-Out Notice for it to be effective. This procedure is the only way you can opt out of the Agreement to Arbitrate. If you opt out of the Agreement to Arbitrate, all other parts of the User Agreement, including all other provisions of Section 14 (Disputes with PayPal), will continue to apply. Opting out of this Agreement to Arbitrate has no effect on any previous, other, or future arbitration agreements that you may have with us.


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Antho789
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Oct 15, 2012 21:42 |  #7

i found an opt out template from consumerist.com

http://consumerist.com …aypal-arbitration-clause/ (external link)




  
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isoMorphic
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Oct 15, 2012 23:39 |  #8

TeamSpeed wrote in post #15127420 (external link)
I feel I should never sign off from being able to use our US legal system should paypal become deficient in their services.

Even if you were to win a class settlement at the most you would get a token sum. It's not like class action suits tend to be carried out with the best interest of plaintiffs in mind except in very rare instances. This is why companies like Paypal want to protect themselves from predatory law firms that do nothing but line their pockets from class actions.




  
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TeamSpeed
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Oct 16, 2012 04:08 |  #9

isoMorphic wrote in post #15127936 (external link)
Even if you were to win a class settlement at the most you would get a token sum. It's not like class action suits tend to be carried out with the best interest of plaintiffs in mind except in very rare instances. This is why companies like Paypal want to protect themselves from predatory law firms that do nothing but line their pockets from class actions.

Sometimes class action lawsuits keep a company on the straight and narrow. Knowing eBay and PayPal, I am opting out.


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rick_reno
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Oct 16, 2012 09:21 |  #10

TeamSpeed wrote in post #15128524 (external link)
Sometimes class action lawsuits keep a company on the straight and narrow. Knowing eBay and PayPal, I am opting out.

Me too.




  
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isoMorphic
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Oct 16, 2012 11:09 |  #11

TeamSpeed wrote in post #15128524 (external link)
Sometimes class action lawsuits keep a company on the straight and narrow. Knowing eBay and PayPal, I am opting out.

Laws keep companies in line while lawsuits are just payoffs that get written off as operating losses. It's a bit different when you sue a business that generates the type of money that Paypal does. About the only way a class action might actually impact them is from the bad press that might scare away new customers.




  
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TeamSpeed
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Oct 16, 2012 11:50 |  #12

isoMorphic wrote in post #15129664 (external link)
Laws keep companies in line while lawsuits are just payoffs that get written off as operating losses losses. It's a bit different when you sue a business that generates the type of money that Paypal does. About the only way a class action might actually impact them is from the bad press that might scare away new customers.

No matter, I am not allowing paypal to prevent me from being part of any lawsuit. Granted I can still take them to small claims if the need arises per this agreement without opting out. Remember, I am a customer, they are a service provider, and I don't need them imposing such restrictions on me for the future. You understand the need for their impositions on the customers' rights, I don't and am opting out. I have been an ebay and paypal customer (extensively) for over a decade, and have watched the policy changes and fee schedule changes over the years, and certain ones just rub me the wrong way. This is one of those. ;)


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gpswiz
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Oct 16, 2012 13:21 |  #13

I am avoiding paypal like a plague...


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isoMorphic
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Oct 16, 2012 14:01 |  #14

gpswiz wrote in post #15130158 (external link)
I am avoiding paypal like a plague...

Lots of businesses recieve six to seven figures in revenue via Paypal each year which even Walmart now accepts Paypal. Yet people who may have lost a few hundred bucks or have their funds frozen for a couple months have been screaming how the sky is falling for years. I say 90 million users is a hard number to ignore for anyone who is serious about doing business on the web and especially on an international level.

You can avoid it but good luck finding a superior service that offers all that Paypal does. There will always be doomsayers and there will always be risk takers who are happy to profit from taking risks.




  
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