Approve the Cookies
This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and our Privacy Policy.
OK
Index  •   • New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Guest
New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Register to forums    Log in

 
FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 19 Dec 2012 (Wednesday) 05:54
Search threadPrev/next
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

Investment in lenses

 
Frodge
Goldmember
Avatar
3,075 posts
Gallery: 2 photos
Likes: 145
Joined Nov 2012
     
Dec 19, 2012 05:54 |  #1

I currently have a T3i. Have a couple lenses and am getting into photography again. It bought a Tokina 12-24 yesterday. This is an Ef-S lens. My question is pretty simple. I am just starting to understand the difference between different equipment etc. my main question is ef-s vs ef. I know you can't use ef-s on full frame, but is it a bad in investment to buy any ef-s lenses? The last thing I want to do is build up an arsen of lenses and have the aps-c defunct. Will canon produce an adapter to use ef-s with newer formats? Should I return my Tokina for something that will be useable in years to come? I want to be able to buy lenses and build on them and be able to use them on newer bodies as older ones wear out.


_______________
“It's kind of fun to do the impossible.” - Walt Disney.
Equipment: Tokina 12-24mm, Canon 40mm 2.8, Tamron 17-50 2.8 XR Di, Canon 18-55mm, Canon 50mm 1.8, Tamron 70-300VC / T3I and 60D

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)
kin2son
Goldmember
4,546 posts
Likes: 3
Joined May 2011
Location: Sydney, Australia
     
Dec 19, 2012 06:03 |  #2
bannedPermanent ban

What is wrong with crop camera with ef-s lens? That's the question you have to ask yourself.

An adapter is impossible as ef-s uses less glass (sensor in crop camera is smaller), therefore it will never ever cover the full frame sensor.


5D3 Gripped / 17-40L / Σ35 / 40 Pancake / Zeiss 50 MP / Σ85 / 100L Macro / 70-200 f2.8L II IS / 430 EX II / 580 EX II / Canon 2xIII TC / Kenko Ext. Tubes
EOS M / EF-M 18-55 / EF-M 22f2 / Ricoh GR aka Ultimate street camera :p
Flickr (external link) | My Images on Getty®‎ (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
convergent
Goldmember
Avatar
2,211 posts
Gallery: 34 photos
Likes: 9
Joined Jan 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC
     
Dec 19, 2012 06:09 |  #3

EF-S isn't going anywhere. Canon has made it clear their consumer DSLRs will be EF-S mount. As for if its a good "investment", I'd stick with mutual funds for that. You should buy a lens because you need it to create an image. Their value will generally hold better than bodies, but its still highly dependent on market prices which you have no control over. If you are worried about retaining value, its also better to buy like new used, and stick with Canon over the other brands. A new third party lens will depreciate significantly more than a Canon lens.

If you think a full frame body is in your future then you should minimize your EF-S purchases since they aren't compatible.


Mike - Victory Photo (external link) | Full Gear List | Feedback
5D3 gripped - 7D2 gripped - 17-40L f/4 - 18-135 f/3.5-5.6 IS STM - 24-70L f/2.8 II - 70-200L f/2.8 IS II - 100-400 L f/4.6-5.6 IS II
135L f/2 - 300L f/2.8 IS - Siggy 15 f/2.8 Fisheye, 100 f/2.8 Macro - TC1.4 II - TC2 III - (2) 600EX-RT - ST-E3-RT

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Frodge
THREAD ­ STARTER
Goldmember
Avatar
3,075 posts
Gallery: 2 photos
Likes: 145
Joined Nov 2012
     
Dec 19, 2012 06:11 |  #4

I don't have cash for full frame. I'm just dandy with aps-c. Just want to make sure I'll be able to buy a new body in a couple years if need be.


_______________
“It's kind of fun to do the impossible.” - Walt Disney.
Equipment: Tokina 12-24mm, Canon 40mm 2.8, Tamron 17-50 2.8 XR Di, Canon 18-55mm, Canon 50mm 1.8, Tamron 70-300VC / T3I and 60D

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
TSchrief
Goldmember
Avatar
2,099 posts
Joined Aug 2012
Location: Bourbon, Indiana
     
Dec 19, 2012 06:15 |  #5
bannedPermanent ban

I don't think EF-s lenses will ever be obsolete. There are way too many APS-c bodies out there for Canon to abandon the market for lenses. Of the three best EF-s lenses in existence, I own two of them. They are worth the cost of admission. Most people will tell you that the 10-22, 15-85 and 17-55 are among the best lenses Canon has ever made. They are certainly better than a lot of the old EF (non-L) lenses out there.


Gear List

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
TSchrief
Goldmember
Avatar
2,099 posts
Joined Aug 2012
Location: Bourbon, Indiana
     
Dec 19, 2012 06:20 |  #6
bannedPermanent ban

convergent wrote in post #15384705 (external link)
If you think a full frame body is in your future then you should minimize your EF-S purchases since they aren't compatible.

I've heard this before. I disagree. My 60D, 10-22 and 15-85 did not change at all when I picked up a 5D. There are no APS-c Police who will come and confiscate you EF-s glass if you buy a full-frame model.

And the lenses are very different when mounted on a FF vs. APS-c body. If you just love your 24-105 on your cropper, because you went with all EF glass, when you put it on a FF body it becomes MUCH wider and MUCH shorter. You now need a new lens, just because you switched formats, EVEN THOUGH ALL YOU HAD WAS EF-GLASS!

Buy the lens that does what you need to do.


Gear List

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
jimewall
Goldmember
1,871 posts
Likes: 11
Joined May 2008
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
     
Dec 19, 2012 07:34 as a reply to  @ TSchrief's post |  #7

Get what you need in order to get the pictures you want, with the equipment you have. Most lenses typically don't go up in value, though some stay close to purchase price (yes there are exceptions). They therefore are not an investment into anything but your photography. Get the lenses that work for you.

When I picked up my first DSLR it was a Rebel. I prefer longer FL, so my widest originally started a 24mm. At the time I also shot some film in my Elan camera, so I wanted lenses that could be used on both cameras. So for me it made sense to get EF and not EF-S. Eventually I picked up a Sigma 10-20 (it was the cheapest and it had excellent IQ - IMO real close to Canon's 10-22) for the occasional times that I wanted UWA on the Rebel.

A side note on the Sigma 10-20. Without modification other than adding a Kenko 1.4X TC (any non-Canon made TC?), It can be used on a FF camera. It has little to no vignetting, IQ is pretty good, and it still auto-focuses. Since I don't go ultra wide all that often, that gives me a slow 14-28mm f/5.6-8 on my FF. That is a reasonable amount wider than my 17-40L.

I do not know if this works with all crop lenses that are not Canon (the EF-S has a protrusion that does not allow a TC to be added). I only have three lenses for crop, two EF-S lenses and the Sigma 10-20.


Thanks for Reading & Good Luck - Jim
GEAR

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
saintz
Senior Member
428 posts
Joined Mar 2012
     
Dec 19, 2012 12:52 |  #8

APS-C is not going anywhere for a long time. While the 6D shows an attempt to move users from APS-C to full frame, the Canon M shows an attempt to move users from "micro" to APS-C. The APS-C format will continue to be popular.


Sony A6000 | 18-55 | 16-50 | 50 f1.8

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Nightdiver13
Unabashed nerd!
Avatar
2,272 posts
Likes: 38
Joined May 2010
Location: Bigfoot Country
     
Dec 19, 2012 12:58 |  #9

Moving P&S users to the Eos M may involve moving them to APS-C, but isn't moving them to EF-S. If the Eos M were to come to dominate, that could involve the extinction of EF-S while continuing APS-C.


Neil

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
RPCrowe
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
8,056 posts
Likes: 1196
Joined Nov 2005
Location: San Diego County, California, USA
     
Dec 19, 2012 13:06 |  #10

Frodge wrote in post #15384679 (external link)
I currently have a T3i. Have a couple lenses and am getting into photography again. I bought a Tokina 12-24 yesterday. This is an Ef-S lens. My question is pretty simple. I am just starting to understand the difference between different equipment etc. my main question is ef-s vs ef. I know you can't use ef-s on full frame, but is it a bad in investment to buy any ef-s lenses? The last thing I want to do is build up an arsen of lenses and have the aps-c defunct. Will canon produce an adapter to use ef-s with newer formats? Should I return my Tokina for something that will be useable in years to come? I want to be able to buy lenses and build on them and be able to use them on newer bodies as older ones wear out.

First off, the 12-24mm Tokina is NOT an EF-s lens. Although it is designed for 1.6x format cameras, it is an EF mount lens and can be used both on 1.6x cameras which don't have EF-s capability (D30, D60 and 10D) or on full frame cameras.

It will begin to vingette at shorter focal lengths when shooting with full frame cameras however, you can use it down to somewhere around 16mm or so. I don't shoot full frame so I never paid attention to the exact focal length.

I would not worry about Canon discontinuing the 1.6x format. But that's just my opinion...


See my images at http://rpcrowe.smugmug​.com/ (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
amfoto1
Cream of the Crop
10,251 posts
Likes: 84
Joined Aug 2007
Location: San Jose, California
     
Dec 19, 2012 14:53 |  #11

RPCrowe wrote in post #15386031 (external link)
First off, the 12-24mm Tokina is NOT an EF-s lens. Although it is designed for 1.6x format cameras, it is an EF mount lens and can be used both on 1.6x cameras which don't have EF-s capability (D30, D60 and 10D) or on full frame cameras.

It will begin to vingette at shorter focal lengths when shooting with full frame cameras however, you can use it down to somewhere around 16mm or so. I don't shoot full frame so I never paid attention to the exact focal length.

I would not worry about Canon discontinuing the 1.6x format. But that's just my opinion...


This is true...

Only select Canon lenses are EF-S. They use the EF-S or EF-"Short" bayonet mount that only allows the lens to be fitted to the APS-C crop sensor cameras after the 10D (all Rebel series, plus 20, 30, 40, 50, 60D and 7D). All third party lenses (Tokina, SIgma, Tamron, etc.) simply use the standard EF mount, even though some of them are designed and intended for crop cameras only. The Tokina 12-24 is one of these.

Tokina and the other third party manufacturers use coding on their lenses to indicate if they are crop only or usable on full frame and crop. Tokina's codes are "DX" for crop only and "FX" for full frame capable (the same designations that Nikon uses, BTW). Tamron marks their full frame lenses "Di", their APS-C crop sensor lenses "Di II" and has started to introduce a third series for mirrorless cameras labelled "Di III". Sigma designates their full frame lenses "DG", their APS-C specific lenses "DC", and has begun to introduce some "DN" lenses for mirrorless cameras.

It's also correct that the Toki 12-24 "DG"", in particular, can be used to a limited extent on a full frame camera... Just out of curiousity I've tested the 12-24 on my 5D Mark II (though I bought it for use on 7D, 50D, 30D and 10D cameras) and can tell you that it will work to 18 or 19mm before it starts to vignette. There is some distortion and the corners of the image are softer than when I use the EF 20/2.8 lens that I prefer... but it works. I would be cautious of using crop-only lenses on full frame, though. In addition to vignetting the images, some lenses also use a retrofocus design that causes the rear elements of the lens to protrude into the camera body. This might physically interfere with and damage the larger mirror in full frame cameras.

The crop format is here to stay and continues to sell strongly. It's really a more practical format for most people. On forums like this one, where a lot of "gearheads" hang out and participate, you do get quite a few full frame fanboys chanting "go full frame or go home"... But out in the real world the vast majority of DSLRs sold continue to be some sort of crop sensor. Crop sensor cameras are considerably less expensive and lenses for crop cameras also can be less expensive, smaller and a lot lighter weight than what's required for full frame. Also, crop cameras can be used with both crop/EF-S lenses and full frame/EF lenses. Full frame cameras, for all practical purposes, can only be used with FF/EF lenses.

So, don't worry.... There will likely be plenty of EF-S/crop sensor cameras and lenses for many years to come.

If anything, DSLRs might be challenged in the future by EVIL cameras (Electronic Viewfinder, Interchangeable Lens) and similar. The Canon M-series cameras and lenses are one example, though it's lacks any viewfinder at all (uses the LCD monitor on the back to view the image). Canon is late getting into this type of camera, so they don't offer a lot of choices yet. But other manufacturers have developed similar, too, and this is likely to be a faster growing segment of the camera market compared to DSLRs.


Alan Myers (external link) "Walk softly and carry a big lens."
5DII, 7DII(x2), 7D(x2) & other cameras. 10-22mm, Tokina 12-24/4, 20/2.8, TS 24/3.5L, 24-70/2.8L, 28/1.8, 28-135 IS (x2), TS 45/2.8, 50/1.4, Tamron 60/2.0, 70-200/4L IS, 70-200/2.8 IS, 85/1.8, Tamron 90/2.5 Macro, 100/2.8 USM, 100-400L II, 135/2L, 180/3.5L, 300/4L IS (x2), 300/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, EF 1.4X II, EF 2X II. Flashes, studio strobes & various access. - FLICKR (external link) - ZENFOLIO (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sonofjesse
Senior Member
Avatar
687 posts
Likes: 3
Joined Aug 2006
     
Dec 19, 2012 16:01 |  #12

IF you got a crop the stick with EF-S lenses especially if your just starting out. APS-C should be around forever cause sports/wildlife people love the burst rates and the "Free" crop reach.


FeedBack
Feedback 2
Feedback 3
Feedback 4
Feedback 5

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
pdrober2
Goldmember
Avatar
2,318 posts
Joined Nov 2010
Location: Durham, NC
     
Dec 19, 2012 22:22 |  #13

When I made the switch to FF, I sold everything, body and efs lenses. I took a 10% loss on the glass, which is what you would lose on any lens, ef or efs.

Buy what you need now and worry about upgrading when you are ready to buy. No sense getting lenses best for FF if you won't have the body for a year from now.


Fujifilm X-T1 | 23 | 27 | 56 | 90 | 55-200
Feedback

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
convergent
Goldmember
Avatar
2,211 posts
Gallery: 34 photos
Likes: 9
Joined Jan 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC
     
Dec 19, 2012 22:34 |  #14

TSchrief wrote in post #15384717 (external link)
I've heard this before. I disagree. My 60D, 10-22 and 15-85 did not change at all when I picked up a 5D. There are no APS-c Police who will come and confiscate you EF-s glass if you buy a full-frame model.

What are you talking about? You can't mount a Canon EF-S lens on a full frame camera. The lens protrudes into the body and the mirror will physically hit the lens and cause damage. Of course if you keep the crop body you can still use them. That is not what I was talking about, and is pretty obvious.


Mike - Victory Photo (external link) | Full Gear List | Feedback
5D3 gripped - 7D2 gripped - 17-40L f/4 - 18-135 f/3.5-5.6 IS STM - 24-70L f/2.8 II - 70-200L f/2.8 IS II - 100-400 L f/4.6-5.6 IS II
135L f/2 - 300L f/2.8 IS - Siggy 15 f/2.8 Fisheye, 100 f/2.8 Macro - TC1.4 II - TC2 III - (2) 600EX-RT - ST-E3-RT

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
SiaoP
Goldmember
Avatar
1,406 posts
Joined Dec 2009
Location: Bay Area
     
Dec 19, 2012 22:40 |  #15

Canon won't get rid of the EF-S anytime soon. It's here to stay as most people buy APS-C cameras. I'd just get the gear you need to use. Lenses hold up their value pretty well. I recommend investing in good quality glass as the higher end ones hold their values even better.


My Flickr (external link) | Gear List

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

5,186 views & 0 likes for this thread
Investment in lenses
FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
AAA
x 1600
y 1600

Jump to forum...   •  Rules   •  Index   •  New posts   •  RTAT   •  'Best of'   •  Gallery   •  Gear   •  Reviews   •  Member list   •  Polls   •  Image rules   •  Search   •  Password reset

Not a member yet?
Register to forums
Registered members may log in to forums and access all the features: full search, image upload, follow forums, own gear list and ratings, likes, more forums, private messaging, thread follow, notifications, own gallery, all settings, view hosted photos, own reviews, see more and do more... and all is free. Don't be a stranger - register now and start posting!


COOKIES DISCLAIMER: This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and to our privacy policy.
Privacy policy and cookie usage info.


POWERED BY AMASS forum software 2.1forum software
version 2.1 /
code and design
by Pekka Saarinen ©
for photography-on-the.net

Latest registered member is RHustler
2054 guests, 246 members online
Simultaneous users record so far is 15144, that happened on Nov 22, 2018

Photography-on-the.net Digital Photography Forums is the website for photographers and all who love great photos, camera and post processing techniques, gear talk, discussion and sharing. Professionals, hobbyists, newbies and those who don't even own a camera -- all are welcome regardless of skill, favourite brand, gear, gender or age. Registering and usage is free.