Would you do this? Need your opinion please.

I need your opinion here when you have time.

I got this gig of a school yearbook. the services i do for the school is free. The bread and butter is when the parents orders copies of their kids photos break down in different packages. Which is not a 100% if the parents will order. Parents orders is not mandatory.

The PTO/PTA of the school is asking for a 60/40 split. Do you think it's worth it?

I asked them if we can cut the printing cost first before the split, they did not answer yet.

If they won't cut the printing cost, 60/40 is ridiculous, right? I'm investing gears, time(shooting and editing) plus the skill.

Would you do it?

They have to be kidding? No way..

No only would I not do it, I wouldn't even be asking for a 2nd opinion on it before telling them to shove it.

yeah that's ridiculous, they want money for doing what exactly?

* It's pretty standard for school portrait photographers to give a significant cut to the school. I don't know how big a cut, but that's pretty much the way school photogs get contracts. Quality and service take a back seat to revenue. There may be some room to negotiate but your competitors are offering a hefty kickback.

* The only way to make that profitable is to have a very efficient, assembly line process for shooting, processing, ordering and order fulfillment. You'll need marketing materials, order forms, etc. The reality is we're talking about mugshots, not portraits.

The photogs who do this profitably do it on a large scale with cheap help, and in-house printing and mailing facilities to keep costs to a minimum.

Every year I shoot a tournament for my home schools v-ball team & make a poster for the graduating seniors. If the school wanted a cut, I'd tell them that they could have it after my day rate was covered. Which ain't gonna' happen. ; )

In your situation, if you go along with giving them 40%, I'd raise my rate so that I still made the same amount on prints. Which probably means that you wouldn't make the same amount because total prints ordered would drop. So you raise your rates again...

Vinz,

Before I go off on my long wordy post, I have several questions. Are you saying that you are a volunteer that takes pictures that are used by the yearbook, that you are a yearbook publisher and providing the free services to the school as part of your contract, that you are selling images as a non-yearbook service, that you take images that you offer as packages to parents/students that are also being provided to the yearbook, or what exactly? Does your gig provide you with any perks such as: free admission to paid school events, reserved seating, access to any areas that most non-school employees would not have access (football playing field access, close to the team seating, back stage access, etc.), or advertising of your “bread and butter” sales to parents or students?

If you are paying to get into the event, not being provided any access that any other ticket purchaser would have, advertising your sales on your website and not through the school, then you really do not need to pay them anything.

Curtis N wrote in post #15434251
* It's pretty standard for school portrait photographers to give a significant cut to the school. I don't know how big a cut, but that's pretty much the way school photogs get contracts. Quality and service take a back seat to revenue. There may be some room to negotiate but your competitors are offering a hefty kickback.

* The only way to make that profitable is to have a very efficient, assembly line process for shooting, processing, ordering and order fulfillment. You'll need marketing materials, order forms, etc. The reality is we're talking about mugshots, not portraits.

The photogs who do this profitably do it on a large scale with cheap help, and in-house printing and mailing facilities to keep costs to a minimum.

wow, that's overwhelming. I think i'm gonna pass for now. I'm gonna end up losing.

thanks for your headsup, really helps me with my decision. for a stabilized place like lifetouch or creative imaging who has been in the business and already has a proven system of doing the process, it's ok but for me who is just starting...

sometimes in business you have to lose a bit in order to open yourself to a more gig but i'm losing and at the same time having so much headache, no way.

thanks again for your help.

Curtis N wrote in post #15434251
* It's pretty standard for school portrait photographers to give a significant cut to the school. I don't know how big a cut, but that's pretty much the way school photogs get contracts. Quality and service take a back seat to revenue. There may be some room to negotiate but your competitors are offering a hefty kickback.

To add: It's also pretty standard in Illinois for the school to require an upfront cash payment of several thousand dollars from the photographer to the school as well as to require the photographer to provide free services as requested by the school through the year.

Inasmuch as this is all slush-fund money "off the books" of the school budget, it never ceases to amaze me that there aren't school officials doing perp walks every year.

Thanks for your time. No i'm not a volunteer. As Curtis N, stressed out. It's pretty much the game here. Free pics for the school, earn money from the ordering parents -minus the cut.

I'm not doing the yearbook. But have to upload section by section to a certain website who's creating the yearbook. I'm afraid there might be a template and I have to fix it there. That's additional time killer.

Plus the tradition is parents gets to choose a color background so i planned to shoot them with green screen so i can easily change the background. An easy thing to do for a few kids but i'm talking about 500 students. i think it's gonna kill me.

Hawks Feather wrote in post #15435098
=Hawk's Feather;15435098]Vinz,

Before I go off on my long wordy post, I have several questions. Are you saying that you are a volunteer that takes pictures that are used by the yearbook, that you are a yearbook publisher and providing the free services to the school as part of your contract, that you are selling images as a non-yearbook service, that you take images that you offer as packages to parents/students that are also being provided to the yearbook, or what exactly? Does your gig provide you with any perks such as: free admission to paid school events, reserved seating, access to any areas that most non-school employees would not have access (football playing field access, close to the team seating, back stage access, etc.), or advertising of your “bread and butter” sales to parents or students?

If you are paying to get into the event, not being provided any access that any other ticket purchaser would have, advertising your sales on your website and not through the school, then you really do not need to pay them anything.

RDKirk wrote in post #15435359
To add: It's also pretty standard in Illinois for the school to require an upfront cash payment of several thousand dollars from the photographer to the school as well as to require the photographer to provide free services as requested by the school through the year.

Inasmuch as this is all slush-fund money "off the books" of the school budget, it never ceases to amaze me that there aren't school officials doing perp walks every year.

they had me already for one event.... and they never talked about money when i did that. i think i really pass.

thanks guyz.

Good choice.

So you work for free and give them a 40% cut of whatever additional sales you get - er no.

Don't get me wrong I have and still do spec work and will give a kickback (in the region of 10-15% after my printing costs) but the client does not get any images that they don't pay for.

Taking the risk of shooting without any guarantee is one thing - shooting for free and then giving the images to someone who will sell them in the yearbook and hoping that parents will buy additional prints OF THE SAME PHOTOS is something that I would not do.

Walk away... Now, it explains why most school pics are crap

thanks buddies, i made up my decision. Heck NO. thanks for you help.