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FORUMS Post Processing, Marketing & Presenting Photos The Business of Photography 
Thread started 24 Jan 2013 (Thursday) 09:20
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My photograph has been used without permission

 
Ben ­ Daniels
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Jan 24, 2013 09:20 |  #1

Hi all,
Yesterday I thought I would tap into google images Shetland Sheepdog puppies, as I have a Shetland sheepdog and had a few minutes to kill looking at the cute puppies!

I scrolled down the first page and saw what I thought was my dog Oskar. I thought the link would be to my Flickr page - see link
http://www.flickr.com …/in/set-72157616677197008 (external link)

But it didnt, it lead to this company who have taken it without my knowledge or permission - scroll about halfway down to view.
http://www.dog-obedience-training-review.com …nd-sheepdog-training.html (external link)

Is there anything I can do to get a payment for the use of the image?
I realise it's not the crime of the century, but I will be interested it what I may be able to do.



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jra
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Jan 24, 2013 09:25 |  #2

Yes....get a lawyer.....around here I think they call it "instant millionaire" ;)

In all honesty, pursuing legal action is probably a waste of time. I would suggest sending a polite e-mail to the company (polite if you would like to potentially be paid). Let them know that the image is yours and that you would be happy to allow them to use it for a licensing fee.....otherwise please remove it from your web page. They will most likely apologize and simply remove the photo.




  
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gonzogolf
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Jan 24, 2013 09:27 |  #3

You could always send them an invoice for using your photo. They likely won't pay without legal action but its a fun way so scare them into taking it down.




  
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gonzogolf
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Jan 24, 2013 09:28 |  #4

Make sure you get screen captures of the offending post.




  
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ATP
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Jan 24, 2013 17:32 |  #5

gonzogolf wrote in post #15527909 (external link)
You could always send them an invoice for using your photo. They likely won't pay without legal action but its a fun way so scare them into taking it down.

^^ DO that lol


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Dan ­ Marchant
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Jan 24, 2013 21:35 |  #6

jra wrote in post #15527902 (external link)
Yes....get a lawyer.....around here I think they call it "instant millionaire" ;)

Sadly the OP is in the UK, not the US, where they don't have statutory damages on registered copyright - so this isn't the instant lottery win it would be in the US. Having said that there is plenty they can do to get a decent settlement, without having to go to court. Failing that a take down notice to the web host will work well to get the image removed.

Ben Daniels wrote in post #15527875 (external link)
...Is there anything I can do to get a payment for the use of the image?
I realise it's not the crime of the century, but I will be interested it what I may be able to do.

Yes, firstly start by reading this article by Simon Crofts http://www.epuk.org …en-photographs-what-to-do (external link). It explains the correct way to go about contacting an infringing party with a view to convincing them that...
a) you aren't an idiot who can be ignored.
b) that it would be better to pay you a reasonable sum to settle rather than get dragged into court.

Second you should check out the new small claims court for copyright, which the government are introducing in the UK. Not sure exactly when it will be brought in but it is designed for exactly this sort of situation. You will be able to take action in a small claims court with very low costs, provided the sum you are after is below (I think) 5000 pounds.


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P51Mstg
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Jan 24, 2013 22:00 |  #7

Cool... send them an invoice....

Now you go from a VALUABLE COPYRIGHT CASE into a simple collection case. Not to mention that they don't have to take it down since you have now put yourself into the position of SELLING them the image instead of the position of THEY STOLE IT.......

Guess what, you send the invoice and they don't have to take it down since its no longer copyright infringement.

Mark H


Too Much Camera Stuff......

  
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gonzogolf
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Jan 24, 2013 22:06 |  #8

P51Mstg wrote in post #15530656 (external link)
Cool... send them an invoice....

Now you go from a VALUABLE COPYRIGHT CASE into a simple collection case. Not to mention that they don't have to take it down since you have now put yourself into the position of SELLING them the image instead of the position of THEY STOLE IT.......

Guess what, you send the invoice and they don't have to take it down since its no longer copyright infringement.

Mark H

How valuable do you actually believe this case is?




  
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alintx
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Jan 25, 2013 00:27 |  #9

I would send them an invoice.


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tim
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Jan 25, 2013 03:46 |  #10

Copyright law's a PITA in the UK. You can claim for actual damages, not punitive. Prove worth of the image, show damages, send invoice. You'll probably need a lawyer and you'll never get rich.

I'm in the process of using a very good attorney for a similar thing. It's a long drawn out process that may end up costing money.


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P51Mstg
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Jan 25, 2013 09:36 |  #11

I think the copyright case is worth more than the value of selling the photo.

NOW IN GENERAL, NOT PICKING ON THE OP in the THREAD.........

These discussions area a lot like law school where everyone comes up with wild ideas and theories of recovery. In the real world, (NOT SPECIFICALLY THIS CASE) the photo wasn't worth a lot, it was going to sell for a lot and it costs more to drive to the lawyer's office than it you are going to net off the case.

The ones I really love reading are "I'm the unpaid second shooter at a small wedding is the CR mine?"... Yeah like you are going to get some shots you can actually sell? They have people in them that limits what you can do with the shots to start with. The only market is the people at the wedding and they already paid the paid photographer.....

Really one thing that amazes me about photographers in general is that they:

1. Make some kind of mistake and the photo gets out
2. Realize they need legal help, then not ask a lawyer (a copyright lawyer that is)
3. Compound the problem by asking other NON LAWYER photographers for their opinions
4. Happily take no money and a "photo credit"
5. Complain about not making any money in photography

I know several photographers who make a lot of money taking pictures. They are generally GREAT BUSINESSMEN and their business happens to be photography. Give them a shoe store and it will be successful. They spend more time on the business and networking end than they do taking pictures. They have a lawyer and an accountant, they have real paid employees, they do that well. Interestingly enough all of them realize that they don't make enough money to afford a piece of commercial property for a "studio" or office. They work out of a building on their property (back yard) or in the "basement".

To me the business end of anything is really interesting. Watching these guys work is a lot more fun that taking pictures sometimes.

Its entertaining to say the least....

Mark H


Too Much Camera Stuff......

  
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Dan ­ Marchant
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Jan 25, 2013 19:04 |  #12

P51Mstg wrote in post #15530656 (external link)
Guess what, you send the invoice and they don't have to take it down since its no longer copyright infringement.

Sending an invoice doesn't legally alter the fact that it is copyright infringement. However your correct that it isn't a good idea because you have no legal basis to collect.

The only ways to collect are if the two parties form an agreement or a court decides that money is owed. That means...
1. The company agrees to license the image, you supply it, you invoice, they pay. If they fail to pay they are in breach of contract and you can take them to court to recover the money or get a debt collector on the case. or,
2. They infringed your copyright by using the image without permission, you take them to court and the court orders them to pay you.

Of course it is perfectly legal for the agreement to come after the infringement. This is exactly what the article I posted a link to deals with. Someone uses your image without permission, you write to them pointing out the infringement and offering to license the image for a fee, so that they can avoid court action. They agree to this offer and an agreement has been formed. You can invoice them and legally collect (yes you could send the invoice along with the initial offer letter to save time).


Dan Marchant
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P51Mstg
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Jan 25, 2013 19:47 |  #13

The problem is if you just send them the invoice, then there is no "contract" legally and you can't enforce it. How can you send them an invoice for something you NEVER SOLD THEM?????

If your next door neighbor steals your cameras, are you going to call the cops or send them a bill?

In easy terms, you can't have your cake and eat it too and you can't do that UNILATERALLY.

Now, if you sue for Copyright infringement, and decide to settle half way through and they pay, thats a different matter.

HOW ABOUT THIS ONE??? It opens all kinds of problems. Built a quick website with your picture on it and explain in no uncertain terms, the kinds of people these are who would steal your picture..... Maybe you can use that to let them counter sue you for defamation too....

In terms of legal advice, you get what you pay for.

Mark H


Too Much Camera Stuff......

  
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P51Mstg
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Jan 27, 2013 19:07 as a reply to  @ post 15534593 |  #14

Sounds like we should be related.....

Mark H


Too Much Camera Stuff......

  
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Yaryman
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Jan 27, 2013 19:39 |  #15

Just a hunch, but when you do contact them, they will claim their web designer did it without their approval.


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My photograph has been used without permission
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