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Thread started 09 Mar 2013 (Saturday) 14:16
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Sad day at Amazon :(

 
tgara
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Mar 12, 2013 12:21 |  #76

mafoo wrote in post #15702665 (external link)
I agree with this. The world is changing thanks to the internet, and sadly, when big changes happen to society, it has impacts that are less then desirable.

When Ford made the car accessible to everyone, entire industries shut down. No more buggies and horse whips.

Yeah, but if this happened today, the buggy manufacturers and the horse whip manufacturers would complain to the media about all the buggy and horse whip workers losing their jobs, and then pressure Congress for a bailout to allow the workers to keep their jobs and to keep their economically unsustainable businesses running at a loss and at taxpayer expense. After all, it's unfair/unjust/racist/s​exist/homophobic that the buggy and horse whip workers lose their jobs because of this new-fangled automobile! We want progress, just not *this kind* of progress! But I digress......

Part of the reason taxes are high, and are getting higher, is because the responsibility of government is growing. This is not a good thing. At some point, personal freedoms will be lost. Just look at NYC and Mayor Bloomberg trying to impose a large soda ban. Is it really the government's job to tell us what to eat or drink? Should it be?


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mafoo
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Mar 12, 2013 12:46 |  #77

tgara wrote in post #15706723 (external link)
Yeah, but if this happened today, the buggy manufacturers and the horse whip manufacturers would complain to the media about all the buggy and horse whip workers losing their jobs, and then pressure Congress for a bailout to allow the workers to keep their jobs and to keep their economically unsustainable businesses running at a loss and at taxpayer expense. After all, it's unfair/unjust/racist/s​exist/homophobic that the buggy and horse whip workers lose their jobs because of this new-fangled automobile! We want progress, just not *this kind* of progress! But I digress......

Part of the reason taxes are high, and are getting higher, is because the responsibility of government is growing. This is not a good thing. At some point, personal freedoms will be lost. Just look at NYC and Mayor Bloomberg trying to impose a large soda ban. Is it really the government's job to tell us what to eat or drink? Should it be?

I agree with everything you said, however to comment any more then that, would start to turn this into a political thread, and that's a no-no here.

So... this will have to do....

+1


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ejicon
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Mar 13, 2013 21:24 |  #78

It's easy to say.... Everyone pays sales tax but I believe here in CA, we get hit the hardest because it was at 9.75% early last year. A few propositions ended which brought it down to 8.75% and now it's at 9% even. Like others have mentioned, it's better to buy something locally because 1. You can return it if you don't want it without having to worry about shipping charges & 2. Places such like Best Buy, and Frys Electronics now does Amazon Price Matching. I'm a huge fan at hating Best Buy for their inflated prices and horrible customer service but they're slowly making it back on my list with this whole internet price matching that they now do.


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Ron ­ Bailey
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Mar 13, 2013 22:56 |  #79

tgara wrote in post #15706723 (external link)
Yeah, but if this happened today, the buggy manufacturers and the horse whip manufacturers would complain to the media about all the buggy and horse whip workers losing their jobs, and then pressure Congress for a bailout to allow the workers to keep their jobs and to keep their economically unsustainable businesses running at a loss and at taxpayer expense. After all, it's unfair/unjust/racist/s​exist/homophobic that the buggy and horse whip workers lose their jobs because of this new-fangled automobile! We want progress, just not *this kind* of progress! But I digress......

Part of the reason taxes are high, and are getting higher, is because the responsibility of government is growing. This is not a good thing. At some point, personal freedoms will be lost. Just look at NYC and Mayor Bloomberg trying to impose a large soda ban. Is it really the government's job to tell us what to eat or drink? Should it be?

Yep. I won't comment any further either since you've said it well.


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Owain ­ Glyndwr
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Mar 15, 2013 07:45 |  #80

tgara wrote in post #15706723 (external link)
Yeah, but if this happened today, the buggy manufacturers and the horse whip manufacturers would complain to the media about all the buggy and horse whip workers losing their jobs, and then pressure Congress for a bailout to allow the workers to keep their jobs and to keep their economically unsustainable businesses running at a loss and at taxpayer expense. After all, it's unfair/unjust/racist/s​exist/homophobic that the buggy and horse whip workers lose their jobs because of this new-fangled automobile! We want progress, just not *this kind* of progress! But I digress......

Part of the reason taxes are high, and are getting higher, is because the responsibility of government is growing. This is not a good thing. At some point, personal freedoms will be lost. Just look at NYC and Mayor Bloomberg trying to impose a large soda ban. Is it really the government's job to tell us what to eat or drink? Should it be?

what planet are you living on? Taxes in the US are far from high. Compared to most countries they are very low. The reason your country runs a massive budget deficit is because its citizens are indoctrinated that paying taxes is evil.

Every country needs a certain level of tax revenue to maintain a basic level of civilisation. Too few people in the US are prepared to carry their fair share of the burden, and that applies equally to the millionaires who use tax havens and write offs to avoid paying taxes as it does to ordinary wage earners who avoid paying sales taxes.


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mikeinctown
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Mar 15, 2013 08:08 |  #81

Owain, I will say that you are very wrong in your entire opinion and leave it at that.

As for amazon charging tax, is there a page or list that one can go to and check? I know they don't have a DC in Ohio and probably never will so I'm not terribly concerned right now.




  
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jemanner
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Mar 15, 2013 08:40 |  #82

I agree with Owain, compared to other modern industralized countries, our taxes are relatively low. Not sure if our citizens are indoctrinated that taxes are evil, possibly save the very wealthy, and they have found methods to escape their fair share. Too many U.S. citizens feel the government owes them. Our welfare rolls are out of sight, and entitlement programs are responsible for the debt/deficit. All states will eventually close the gates for tax-free online shopping, and so they should.


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M_Six
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Mar 15, 2013 09:07 |  #83

jemanner wrote in post #15717602 (external link)
I agree with Owain, compared to other modern industralized countries, our taxes are relatively low. Not sure if our citizens are indoctrinated that taxes are evil, possibly save the very wealthy, and they have found methods to escape their fair share. Too many U.S. citizens feel the government owes them. Our welfare rolls are out of sight, and entitlement programs are responsible for the debt/deficit. All states will eventually close the gates for tax-free online shopping, and so they should.

To get somewhat back on topic, if the big B&M stores want a level playing field, the owner's (read: politically connected) need to start pushing for a national VAT tax and to do away with individual state sales taxes. But that is, in effect, taking power away from the states, which runs counter to the constitution. But as they are written, most state sales tax laws simply cannot be applied to online merchants with no presence in the state. And asking all online merchants, including small Mom and Pop stores, to keep track of each state's sales tax rate and mail said taxes in to each state is untenable for the small retailer. It's not an easy problem to fix. Technology has jumped way ahead of many current laws.


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ntotrr
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Mar 15, 2013 12:45 |  #84

Owain Glyndwr wrote in post #15717483 (external link)
what planet are you living on? Taxes in the US are far from high. Compared to most countries they are very low. The reason your country runs a massive budget deficit is because its citizens are indoctrinated that paying taxes is evil.

Every country needs a certain level of tax revenue to maintain a basic level of civilisation. Too few people in the US are prepared to carry their fair share of the burden, and that applies equally to the millionaires who use tax havens and write offs to avoid paying taxes as it does to ordinary wage earners who avoid paying sales taxes.

When over half of my earnings are eaten up in taxes every year, that is too high. Because people in other countries are getting ripped-off more doesn't make our getting ripped-off any less of a problem. The USA does not have a problem because we believe taxes are evil, our government has a spending problem - pure and simple. To put into perspective the notion that those well-off don't pay their fair share: the top 1% of earners pay 37% of all federal income taxes collected, the top 5% pay 59%, the top 10% pay 70%, the top 50% pay 98%. The bottom 50% pay 2% of all federal income taxes.




  
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ntotrr
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Mar 15, 2013 12:52 |  #85

M_Six wrote in post #15717702 (external link)
To get somewhat back on topic, if the big B&M stores want a level playing field, the owner's (read: politically connected) need to start pushing for a national VAT tax and to do away with individual state sales taxes. But that is, in effect, taking power away from the states, which runs counter to the constitution. But as they are written, most state sales tax laws simply cannot be applied to online merchants with no presence in the state. And asking all online merchants, including small Mom and Pop stores, to keep track of each state's sales tax rate and mail said taxes in to each state is untenable for the small retailer. It's not an easy problem to fix. Technology has jumped way ahead of many current laws.

I agree, a national sales tax would take power from the states. The Constitution was foremost written to limit the power of the federal government and to eliminate sales tax in order to levy a VAT tax would be a violation, IMO. The current administration has floated the idea of a VAT in addition to a state sales tax which they could do but it would just be another tax to burden us with.

I do think that collecting and keeping track of state sales tax for merchants who sell out-of-state shouldn't be difficult. I have some experience with Telephone taxes (back when landlines were a much bigger business than now). If you want to talk about a convoluted tax system, that's one of them. Everyone from the federal government down to the lowest level of government can levy telecom taxes. You can have federal, state, city, county, town, even school district taxes. And they very from one locality to another. There are firms that specialize in the software that correctly charges and keeps track of the sales taxes. I'm sure that if they could do it with telecom, they can do it with sales taxes - it may already be done.




  
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Mar 15, 2013 13:24 |  #86

Please remember that politics discussion is not allowed here. As soon as posts start to be full of words like "government" you're there, so please keep on topic.


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M_Six
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Mar 15, 2013 13:37 |  #87

ntotrr wrote in post #15718420 (external link)
There are firms that specialize in the software that correctly charges and keeps track of the sales taxes. I'm sure that if they could do it with telecom, they can do it with sales taxes - it may already be done.

That's true, such software would make it easy enough. At the end of the year (or quarter) you just check the software and send the proper check to each state. It would require amending the current sales tax codes or implementing new ones, but that's business as usual for most legislatures. I'd have no problem with that as long as the codes were changed to make it legal. I hate when they make up dumb rationalizations for stuffing new taxes into codes that weren't ever meant for that purpose. Or use existing taxes and/or fees to pay for things for which the money was never meant to be used.


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Mar 15, 2013 15:51 |  #88

t3ichef wrote in post #15698819 (external link)
im not angry...im from mass...i enjoy watching roads being fixed, bridges being built, and construction workers working...a tax on consumption doesn't bother me one bit, and it's good for the state. they're actually talking about lowering it here in mass anyway. dont get me wrong there are things about how the government works that i dont like, but sales tax isn't something im going to nitpick over that's ruining my life. mass has a lot going for it, and partly because its citizens pay good money to fund the state.

Yeah, talking about lowering the sales tax and increasing the state income tax. But it is not a political discussion, so don't let me start about our government!


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Jim ­ K
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Mar 17, 2013 08:03 as a reply to  @ Lbsimon's post |  #89

Then there is the problem of the merchant charging the wrong amount of sales tax. Canon's CLP charged me 7% tax on my refurb when our state+county only has a 6% sales tax. Not a big deal on a refurbed 7D but quite a bit more on a new 500 II or 600 II.


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Mar 17, 2013 22:58 |  #90

Many people here talk as if sales tax is the only difference between buying online and at the local B&M store, but from my observations the local store is quite often still higher in price even before sales tax is figured in, so online would still be cheaper.

Not factoring in shipping, but it's not uncommon for shipping to be either free or pretty low, so that may or may not be a tipping factor.


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