Gear vs Skill

I can't believe this thread is 7 pages. Go shoot something

Your post makes it 8 pages.

OMG... someone had to bring the Natural light ( I dont know how to use a flash) photographer into this argument.

Im a wedding photographer. I have to control light and blend with what ever given ambient i have.........Gear is ridicously important for what we do. Your not going to photograph a wedding in a dark venue with a fricken I-phone

The answer is BOTH. You cant take great photos with limited equipment unless you know what the hell you are doing and even then it may not be possible to get great results unless you have great eqiuipment----Imagine that

This is a pointless debate. Its kind of like aperature + Shutter speed + ISO gets you a properly exposed photo

Gear + Skill + Knowledge and how these two elements work together gets you a great photo by a photographer who knows what they are doing.

A lot of silly remarks in this thread.

umphotography wrote in post #15786337
A lot of silly remarks in this thread.

What would you expect when a bunch of opinionated people get snookered by an April Fools joke?

I've been inspired...... I'm listening to Disraeli Gears

Obviously it all comes down to what gears you own.

moose10101 wrote in post #15786348
What would you expect when a bunch of opinionated people get snookered by an April Fools joke?

Well, Unfortunately, Its not an April fools joke. This topic comes up frequently on POTN. I generally stay out of these arguments because there is not a correct answer.

This past month I attended a 3 day training convention in Minnesota for professional photographers. The people that lined up the speakers to train at this event had an individual come in and speak about what they do and how they do it. The person was a natural light photographer and had no clue about lighting other than they can shoot wide open with natural light and get fuzzy backgrounds.....Thats it. A 50L at F/2.0 in front of a window and they have 29000 people following them on facebook and they are coming to photography conventions for professional photographers teaching what they are doing.......Total joke in my opinion.

What we have now accepted is that mediocrity is an acceptable form of professional photography. There is a place for all natural light, as is a place for supplementing it with flash... but thats another argument all together.

But this gear v/s Skill debate is just stupid. I cant do what i do w/o great gear. As the camera technology continues to develop, ISO will be usable at 25K for professional cameras very soon.......Imagine that. 25K usable iso ( GEAR ) with an 85L ( Gear ) shot at F/1.2 ( Skill ) with available lighting ( Knowledge) and supplemented with a flash ( GEAR and Knowledge) to get a great photograph.

umphotography wrote in post #15786400
Well, Unfortunately, Its not an April fools joke.

I still think that was the OP's intention. Either that or he was under the influence.

umphotography wrote in post #15786400
Well, Unfortunately, Its not an April fools joke. This topic comes up frequently on POTN. I generally stay out of these arguments because there is not a correct answer.

This past month I attended a 3 day training convention in Minnesota for professional photographers. The people that lined up the speakers to train at this event had an individual come in and speak about what they do and how they do it. The person was a natural light photographer and had no clue about lighting other than they can shoot wide open with natural light and get fuzzy backgrounds.....Thats it. A 50L at F/2.0 in front of a window and they have 29000 people following them on facebook and they are coming to photography conventions for professional photographers teaching what they are doing.......Total joke in my opinion.

What we have now accepted is that mediocrity is an acceptable form of professional photography. There is a place for all natural light, as is a place for supplementing it with flash... but thats another argument all together.

But this gear v/s Skill debate is just stupid. I cant do what i do w/o great gear. As the camera technology continues to develop, ISO will be usable at 25K for professional cameras very soon.......Imagine that. 25K usable iso ( GEAR ) with an 85L ( Gear ) shot at F/1.2 ( Skill ) with available lighting ( Knowledge) and supplemented with a flash ( GEAR and Knowledge) to get a great photograph.

Maybe consider for a moment that artificial light is not required to create great images. Step out of the office photographer role for a second and try to see it from a different angle.

whuband wrote in post #15786302
I can't believe this thread is 7 pages. Go shoot something

I can't...I was led to believe the gear doesn't matter so I tried to use my coffee cup as my camera

it's not working

smorter wrote in post #15786287
A bit rich coming from guys who photographed what they want when they wanted to - both were PJ's, not commercial or wedding photographers

Not that applicable for wedding photographer who is asked by their client to photograph in a particular venue, with a particular background, expecting fashiony, flattering and brilliant looking results

I very rarely use flash, but understand that it's yet another tool that can be employed - I warn against over interpreting isolated quotes as a manual for photography

I only use it when there no other option. And I know how to use it really well. And I said that already but you can learn a lot form those that have come before. It took me a long time to really understand what they really meant. Most would be really surprised at what available light can give you if you only take the time to see it instead of blasting your way through it. And no one knows anymore what fill light means

smorter wrote in post #15786464
I can't...I was led to believe the gear doesn't matter so I tried to use my coffee cup as my camera

it's not working

Thats not the point and you know it... let me ask this and maybe you'll get it -

With your skill and knowledge, If you lost all this (quoted from your gear list):

5D Mark III
5D Mark II
5D Mark I
1D Mark III (rubbish AF)
1D Mark IIN

And were left with just your 400D or 40D and a kit lens, would you be unable to capture stunning images?

Isn't that the point of having backup gear, in-case your good stuff breaks? you still have a clear vision and can execute it because you have experience in using the lower quality gear to achieve those results.

Would the results be better with better gear? - OF COURSE but that doesn't mean you are *screwed* with only your backups.

smorter wrote in post #15786464
I can't...I was led to believe the gear doesn't matter so I tried to use my coffee cup as my camera

it's not working

Like I said it matters to the point that you find equipment that allows you to capture that vision and you have to master that equipment whatever it maybe. For some and what they do, its a holga. For some its an 8X10 view camera and the zone system. Tools, not accessories are what cameras are.

I'll post this again because its more true today as when Weston said it.
"The fact is that relatively few photographers ever master their medium. Instead they allow the medium to master them and go on an endless squirrel cage chase from new lens to new paper to new developer to new gadget, never staying with one piece of equipment long enough to learn its full capacities, becoming lost in a maze of technical information that is of little or no use since they don't know what to do with it." - Edward Weston

airfrogusmc wrote in post #15786739
"The fact is that relatively few photographers ever master their medium. Instead they allow the medium to master them and go on an endless squirrel cage chase from new lens to new paper to new developer to new gadget, never staying with one piece of equipment long enough to learn its full capacities, becoming lost in a maze of technical information that is of little or no use since they don't know what to do with it." - Edward Weston

I disagree with obsessing over getting that last 1% from their existing gear, and don't understand the concept of diminishing marginal returns and that time also costs money. Using new and different gear opens up a whole new world of possibilities, and allows capture of photos that could not be possible using existing gear. Even being able to utilise 50% of a new piece of gear effectively is better than trying to squeeze that last 1-2% out of existing gear

mattertea wrote in post #15786702
Thats not the point and you know it... let me ask this and maybe you'll get it -

With your skill and knowledge, If you lost all this (quoted from your gear list):

5D Mark III
5D Mark II
5D Mark I
1D Mark III (rubbish AF)
1D Mark IIN

And were left with just your 400D or 40D and a kit lens, would you be unable to capture stunning images?

Isn't that the point of having backup gear, in-case your good stuff breaks? you still have a clear vision and can execute it because you have experience in using the lower quality gear to achieve those results.

Would the results be better with better gear? - OF COURSE but that doesn't mean you are *screwed* with only your backups.

I know, but the problem is many people in this thread seem to think that people lose or gain skill overnight based on their gear choices, e.g. those who say "I'd rather a good photographer with bad gear, rather than a bad photographer with good gear" are completely unrealistic. You can change your gear overnight, but how does one go from being good to bad instantly overnight?

The correct comparison is a good photographer with good or bad gear, and a bad photographer with good or bad gear. And in each case, better gear = winner, given skill levels stay largely the same at any one point in time.

I have yet to meet a photographer who suddenly loses his/her skill when he/she picks up good gear

But given the number of people who have said that a bad photog with good gear > good photog with bad gear, it just astounds me how a photographer suddenly becomes bad if they pick up good gear, or good if they pick up bad gear

Can anyone answer this mystery?