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Thread started 30 Jul 2013 (Tuesday) 13:23
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Paint Shop Pro, Photo Shop, Lightroom....?

 
reefvilla
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Jul 30, 2013 13:23 |  #1

I currently use Paint Shop Pro X5 to edit my photo's. I have use the PSP programs for the last 6 years but I would like to try something a little more advanced.

I think the most talked about is Photo Shop but I recently read a review on the new Light room 5 program and it sounds like a really nice editing tool.

Has anyone used PSP X5 AND Light room 4 or 5?? Which did you like better and why please!?


EDIT: So now after a little more reading, it looks like the Light room IS Photo shop?

.


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Merlin_AZ
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Jul 30, 2013 14:09 |  #2

LR is NOT Photoshop.
LR is the best (IMHO) cataloging and developing program for photos on the market.
Photoshop or PSP are great for things that can't be done in LR, such as cloning, layers, replacing things, etc.




  
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tonylong
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Jul 30, 2013 14:32 |  #3

Lightroom and Photoshop are totally different apps, although there is some overlapping functionality.

Photoshop is the "industry standard" photo editor, and as such it's loaded with all sorts of tools and features, ranging from basic photo "tweaks" to sophisticated graphics tools, in fact, there is a whole lot of "stuff" that most "typical" photographers will have no need of.

However, if you really want "the best" in terms of photo editing capabilities, you can't argue against Photoshop.

But then some years ago two things of real interest to photographers developed:

First, digital photographers and digital image processors began accumulating increasingly large quantities of images and began wanting good organizational tools for their digital images, sparking a serious interest in "Digital Asset Management" (DAM). While there have always been "tools" for things like keywording and such, digital assets were an "open market" for a comprehensive "solution".

Second, as digital photography and technology advanced, the ability to capture and "develop" Raw files/data began getting a lot of interest. Adobe and some others put out dedicated software to process Raw files, including a special "plug-in" for Photoshop (Adobe Camera Raw), and people were finding that for much of their digital photo processing a good Raw processor could, in fact, handle much or even most of their digital photo work.

With those two things in mind, Adobe set out to develop a product that could meet the basic needs of digital photographers in an integrated and comprehensive way without adding to the "overhead" of the entire Photoshop "collection".

And so Lightroom came out, an app that included digital asset management built around the up-to-date Raw processor that is the "engine" of Adobe Camera Raw.

It should be added that Lightroom and Camera Raw were quickly modified to support the other common digital image types (tiff, psd and jpegs) and as a result, folks who weren't shooting Raws quickly came "on board" with a lot of enthusiasm since you could get good results with the processing tools, still without necessarily needing to resort to the Photoshop editor.

However, that doesn't mean that Lightroom is "right for everyone" -- some people get put off by the organizational features of Lightroom, for example. Some people prefer to stick with Photoshop and use Camera Raw for their basic/Raw processing. Other folks will use another Raw processor such as the Canon software Digital Photo Professional (DPP) and then will use an image editor such as Photoshop/Photoshop Elements or Paint Shop Pro or whatever.

My advice is to take your time, continue "reading up", and then realize that there are free trials for apps like Lightroom and Photoshop, so you don't have to just leap in!


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Jul 30, 2013 14:43 as a reply to  @ tonylong's post |  #4

Tony, a bookworthy reply.

Thanks for the history lesson, as I was wondering "hey, LR fills a niche, how was that niche created?


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tonylong
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Jul 30, 2013 15:04 |  #5

Corbeau wrote in post #16167289 (external link)
Tony, a bookworthy reply.

Thanks for the history lesson, as I was wondering "hey, LR fills a niche, how was that niche created?

Hey, those were pretty cool times to be involved in digital photography!


Tony
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Tony Long Photos on PBase (external link)
Wildlife project pics here (external link), Biking Photog shoots here (external link), "Suburbia" project here (external link)! Mount St. Helens, Mount Hood pics here (external link)

  
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reefvilla
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Jul 30, 2013 15:11 |  #6

tonylong wrote in post #16167259 (external link)
Lightroom and Photoshop are totally different apps, although there is some overlapping functionality.

Photoshop is the "industry standard" photo editor, and as such it's loaded with all sorts of tools and features, ranging from basic photo "tweaks" to sophisticated graphics tools, in fact, there is a whole lot of "stuff" that most "typical" photographers will have no need of.

However, if you really want "the best" in terms of photo editing capabilities, you can't argue against Photoshop.

But then some years ago two things of real interest to photographers developed:

First, digital photographers and digital image processors began accumulating increasingly large quantities of images and began wanting good organizational tools for their digital images, sparking a serious interest in "Digital Asset Management" (DAM). While there have always been "tools" for things like keywording and such, digital assets were an "open market" for a comprehensive "solution".

Second, as digital photography and technology advanced, the ability to capture and "develop" Raw files/data began getting a lot of interest. Adobe and some others put out dedicated software to process Raw files, including a special "plug-in" for Photoshop (Adobe Camera Raw), and people were finding that for much of their digital photo processing a good Raw processor could, in fact, handle much or even most of their digital photo work.

With those two things in mind, Adobe set out to develop a product that could meet the basic needs of digital photographers in an integrated and comprehensive way without adding to the "overhead" of the entire Photoshop "collection".

And so Lightroom came out, an app that included digital asset management built around the up-to-date Raw processor that is the "engine" of Adobe Camera Raw.

It should be added that Lightroom and Camera Raw were quickly modified to support the other common digital image types (tiff, psd and jpegs) and as a result, folks who weren't shooting Raws quickly came "on board" with a lot of enthusiasm since you could get good results with the processing tools, still without necessarily needing to resort to the Photoshop editor.

However, that doesn't mean that Lightroom is "right for everyone" -- some people get put off by the organizational features of Lightroom, for example. Some people prefer to stick with Photoshop and use Camera Raw for their basic/Raw processing. Other folks will use another Raw processor such as the Canon software Digital Photo Professional (DPP) and then will use an image editor such as Photoshop/Photoshop Elements or Paint Shop Pro or whatever.

My advice is to take your time, continue "reading up", and then realize that there are free trials for apps like Lightroom and Photoshop, so you don't have to just leap in!


Yeah, for sure thanks for the reply!

I downloaded GIMP and have messed with it a little but it will take some time to learn where stuff is compared to PSP.
I think Light room sounds like what I'm looking for so I'll go find a trial and give it a whirl! Thanks again


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Tomi ­ Hawk
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Jul 31, 2013 17:15 |  #7

reefvilla wrote in post #16167386 (external link)
Yeah, for sure thanks for the reply!

I downloaded GIMP and have messed with it a little but it will take some time to learn where stuff is compared to PSP.
I think Light room sounds like what I'm looking for so I'll go find a trial and give it a whirl! Thanks again

The only thing I don't like about LR4 is I always forget how to "save as" ..
drives me crazy .. am I the only one? :rolleyes:


  
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Jul 31, 2013 18:00 |  #8

Tomi Hawk wrote in post #16170765 (external link)
The only thing I don't like about LR4 is I always forget how to "save as" ..
drives me crazy .. am I the only one? :rolleyes:

yes :)


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tonylong
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Jul 31, 2013 18:14 |  #9

Tomi Hawk wrote in post #16170765 (external link)
The only thing I don't like about LR4 is I always forget how to "save as" ..
drives me crazy .. am I the only one? :rolleyes:

Ah, well, take some time to learn how it works!

Lightroom doesn't have a "Save As" because the work you are doing in LR is not on particular files but in a database. The original files stay "untouched" -- until you either are finished with your work and do an Export or you want to open in an external app or plug-in (which typically creates a "hard copy", your photos in your file system will stay "as is".

One very cool feature of LR that alleviates the "Save As" burden is the Virtual Copy function. To do this you can select a photo (or a group of photos), right-click and select "Create Virtual Copy/Copies". When you do this LR creates a database entry for a copy of the photo but doesn't create a new file to clutter up your files. You can work on that virtual copy independently of the original, and you can Export it or edit it independently as well, with the end result that you can "simulate" the Save As function whenever you wish, preserving the original but the Virtual Copy has given you an alternate "version" of your processing that you can keep in whatever form you wish. It only takes up hard drive space when you have decided that you want to create a file for that version.


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Aug 04, 2013 20:21 |  #10

I've also used PSP for several years. I was real skeptical when Corel bought Jasc. The first few "Corel" releases were not all that great. However they have been improving. I currently use PSP X4, along with Lightroom 4. PSP is only used when I need to make some changes that LR simply is not designed to handle.

FWIW I was one of the site administrators for Corel's User to User help forum, and beta tested several of their video and photo programs. If you want to lay out the cash for PS, that's fine, but I think just adding LR will do the trick.


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reefvilla
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Aug 04, 2013 20:28 |  #11

frozenframe wrote in post #16181407 (external link)
I've also used PSP for several years. I was real skeptical when Corel bought Jasc. The first few "Corel" releases were not all that great. However they have been improving. I currently use PSP X4, along with Lightroom 4. PSP is only used when I need to make some changes that LR simply is not designed to handle.

FWIW I was one of the site administrators for Corel's User to User help forum, and beta tested several of their video and photo programs. If you want to lay out the cash for PS, that's fine, but I think just adding LR will do the trick.

I actually bought Light room 5 today. It is way different than PSP X5 so it will take some learning. I want to know or learn "Layers" and how, what, why, when about them so that is my goal for this fall...


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Aug 05, 2013 00:33 |  #12

reefvilla wrote in post #16181428 (external link)
I actually bought Light room 5 today. It is way different than PSP X5 so it will take some learning. I want to know or learn "Layers" and how, what, why, when about them so that is my goal for this fall...

Well, I haven't used Corel photo products for a number of years...does PSP x have layers?

If not, I'd suggest looking into Photoshop Elements as a "starter kit" for working with layers!


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Aug 05, 2013 05:30 |  #13

Yes, PSP has layers, just like PS. It also supports many RAW files, such as Canon's CR2. When you open a RAW file it opens in the Camera Raw Lab, similar to PS'.


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reefvilla
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Aug 05, 2013 06:44 as a reply to  @ frozenframe's post |  #14

It does have Layers and is a really nice editing program. I have used Paint shop Pro for years and basically done general touch up on photos but I am getting a little deeper into it and would really like to understand the whole program as well as all of Light Room 5.


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Aug 05, 2013 16:02 |  #15

These are fantastic tools with varying uses and also depends on your comfort level. I have LR4, PSPX4, Elements 11, Photo Paint X5, (From the Corel Draw/Graphics suite) and Canon's DPP among my choices.

I find that LR allows a range of flexibility in RAW processing that the non destructive nature is excellent. LR is an excellent choice for cataloging and RAW processing. I first used LR1 but it didn't win me over then. DPP isn't a thought these days. ACR in Elements is quite good but having LR is even better. Corel's conversion is nice but I'd become more familiar with Adobe to stick with it. 85%+ I can do in LR quickly.

Most my post editing is simple masking/layers or cloning so diving into Photoshop CS wasn't necessary. For panoramics, PSP X4 was deficient. I don't know how it is in X5. Adobe's stitching in Elements 7 gave very useable results with minimal clean-up in most instances. Photoshop users have more control after the merge but various adjustments exist in other editors though not necessarily as comprehensive-sophisticated as in PS. I'd tested Hugin and Microsoft's ICE programs for other stitching projects and in that regard Hugin did very well. Adobe's panoramic capabilities in Elements won me over and I bought Elements just for the stitching capabilities then on. (It came with other nice updates over the years too.)

Tutorials for both exist in good numbers so finding answers for questions isn't hard. I would give the nod to the Adobe users in terms of sheer numbers so there is plenty of support out there in many forms.

Reading between the lines, this was my attempt at not opening the wallet up for PS. In the end, the lower cost alternatives add up. These editors are good basic tools and learning to use them efficiently is the challenge. If you crave or will foresee the use for the sophistication that comes with PS, you'll have to balance the time, money aspect.

I've used Photo Paint since V8 and Elements from V4 to achieve the results desired. One of the big NY photo suppliers has a promotional on PS till the 15'th, I'll probably take advantage of that. I'll be looking forward to the integration between LR and PS. I may ask myself, why didn't the move to PS come sooner? ;) OTOH, the depth of such a huge program for what works out to be superficial uses is also a thought. Toss a coin time but I've not heard a person say they regretted having PS available on their system.




  
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