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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 29 Aug 2013 (Thursday) 06:14
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What % of FF buyers just want "the best"

 
2ndviolinman
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Aug 29, 2013 20:09 |  #61

"Personally, I never come across anyone **** about how their camera doesn't work. I come across more people quite pleased with their images, even though a lot of them could have been shot using a much cheaper camera...but who cares, they are quite pleased with themselves even if they have their camera on green box mode."

My brother in law, with his 7D for 2 years, 24-70/2.8L, 100-400L, 17-40L, and experience with film SLRs back to the 80's, had never taken the camera out of green box mode, and complained about focus not being sharp much of the time. He was grateful for the introduction to center point, but that's as far as we got.

Another friend...well, colleague, owned a 5Dii from the first month it was out, owned a D800 from the first month it was out, all the fastest cards, is ALWAYS bugging me why I don't buy a grip for the battery capacity. He even put Magic Lantern on his 5Dii because it was cool. I looked, and he had not even taken enough shots to run the battery down for the first time.

I'm not jealous. It is comedy. I don't feel big. Both of these people can do things I cannot. It's just plain comical. Next time it will be at my expense. This time, it's my turn to laugh.


David
5Dc, 5Dii, Canon 16-35 f/4L IS, 40/2.8 Pancake, 85/1.8, 100/2.8 Macro, 135/2.0L, 200/2.8L, converted 35mm TS, Sigma 50/2.8 Macro, 70/2.8 Macro, Zeiss ZE 21/2.8, Zeiss Contax 28/2.8, 50/1.7 & 85/2.8, Jena 135/3.5, Voigtlander 90mm f/3.5 APO, Canon 28-135.

  
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Frodge
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Aug 29, 2013 20:16 |  #62

eli2055 wrote in post #16251756 (external link)
Just a few words that might offer another perspective: i purchased a Nikon D7000 when it first came out, hoping to get a certain look from my photos that i could not get from the P&S cameras i was using. I had used a Nikon before the DSLR age, and i enjoyed photography despite my failure to learn it as a craft. It is not my profession, but i had an idea about a project i wanted to shoot - a series of photos - but, once purchasing the 7000 i realized the project could not be arranged. I love the experience of taking photos, but would never imply i have learned all there is to learn - about the camera and about exposure and the art of photography. I anticipate always growing and learning more. . . and then, the D600 and the 6D came out and i want one of them. I love the idea of their advantages, especially with DOF and bokeh. Yet they are costly and i am a professor. I could afford one of them, but i cannot say the camera would bring me up to a level that most of you here imply you are at as photographers. But so what? Why can't i just enjoy using the camera, experiencing the excitement of nailing a shot, as i perceived the shot, without offending all of you who are knowledgeable and gifted photographers. I admire your knowledge and your craftsmanship, your art and, if i can even approach it a little bit, i might get some pleasure and share some of that pleasure with individuals who mean something to me. That is all there is to this. DOn't begrudge the amateur an experience that gives them pleasure just because you have more knowledge. After all, our lack of knowledge may be temporary and art is to be shared and, thusly, is a beautiful thing. Now, if i could only learn to post-process my shots to their maximum beauty!

I agree. Most people are just jealous blowhards. I have a T3i that I've taken some pretty damned good shots with, and will continue to use it. I also just bought a 60d. I don't care what other people own. It's silliness.


_______________
“It's kind of fun to do the impossible.” - Walt Disney.
Equipment: Tokina 12-24mm, Canon 40mm 2.8, Tamron 17-50 2.8 XR Di, Canon 18-55mm, Canon 50mm 1.8, Tamron 70-300VC / T3I and 60D

  
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Hogloff
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Aug 29, 2013 20:17 |  #63
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2ndviolinman wrote in post #16251793 (external link)
"Personally, I never come across anyone **** about how their camera doesn't work. I come across more people quite pleased with their images, even though a lot of them could have been shot using a much cheaper camera...but who cares, they are quite pleased with themselves even if they have their camera on green box mode."

My brother in law, with his 7D for 2 years, 24-70/2.8L, 100-400L, 17-40L, and experience with film SLRs back to the 80's, had never taken the camera out of green box mode, and complained about focus not being sharp much of the time. He was grateful for the introduction to center point, but that's as far as we got.

Another friend...well, colleague, owned a 5Dii from the first month it was out, owned a D800 from the first month it was out, all the fastest cards, is ALWAYS bugging me why I don't buy a grip for the battery capacity. He even put Magic Lantern on his 5Dii because it was cool. I looked, and he had not even taken enough shots to run the battery down for the first time.

I'm not jealous. It is comedy. I don't feel big. Both of these people can do things I cannot. It's just plain comical. Next time it will be at my expense. This time, it's my turn to laugh.

Well it looks like you have a mitt full of some nice gear. You do realize many pro's produce fabulous photos with half the gear you have. I wonder if they walk by you and have a good chuckle as they watch you with all your gear.

Just a thought...what goes around comes around.




  
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2ndviolinman
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Aug 29, 2013 20:19 |  #64

Yup. I'm fine with that. Even a blind pig finds an occasional acorn. If that's me, I can live with that.


David
5Dc, 5Dii, Canon 16-35 f/4L IS, 40/2.8 Pancake, 85/1.8, 100/2.8 Macro, 135/2.0L, 200/2.8L, converted 35mm TS, Sigma 50/2.8 Macro, 70/2.8 Macro, Zeiss ZE 21/2.8, Zeiss Contax 28/2.8, 50/1.7 & 85/2.8, Jena 135/3.5, Voigtlander 90mm f/3.5 APO, Canon 28-135.

  
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DocFrankenstein
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Aug 29, 2013 20:22 |  #65

eli2055 wrote in post #16251756 (external link)
Just a few words that might offer another perspective: i purchased a Nikon D7000 when it first came out, hoping to get a certain look from my photos that i could not get from the P&S cameras i was using. I had used a Nikon before the DSLR age, and i enjoyed photography despite my failure to learn it as a craft. It is not my profession, but i had an idea about a project i wanted to shoot - a series of photos - but, once purchasing the 7000 i realized the project could not be arranged. I love the experience of taking photos, but would never imply i have learned all there is to learn - about the camera and about exposure and the art of photography. I anticipate always growing and learning more. . . and then, the D600 and the 6D came out and i want one of them. I love the idea of their advantages, especially with DOF and bokeh. Yet they are costly and i am a professor. I could afford one of them, but i cannot say the camera would bring me up to a level that most of you here imply you are at as photographers. But so what? Why can't i just enjoy using the camera, experiencing the excitement of nailing a shot, as i perceived the shot, without offending all of you who are knowledgeable and gifted photographers. I admire your knowledge and your craftsmanship, your art and, if i can even approach it a little bit, i might get some pleasure and share some of that pleasure with individuals who mean something to me. That is all there is to this. DOn't begrudge the amateur an experience that gives them pleasure just because you have more knowledge. After all, our lack of knowledge may be temporary and art is to be shared and, thusly, is a beautiful thing. Now, if i could only learn to post-process my shots to their maximum beauty!

One school of thought is not to focus on post processing too much and instead on looking for good light and composition.

Everybody loves to hate the guy, but it's worth a read:
http://www.kenrockwell​.com …-to-learn-photography.htm (external link)


National Sarcasm Society. Like we need your support.

  
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EverydayGetaway
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Aug 29, 2013 21:15 |  #66

2ndviolinman wrote in post #16251793 (external link)
"Personally, I never come across anyone **** about how their camera doesn't work. I come across more people quite pleased with their images, even though a lot of them could have been shot using a much cheaper camera...but who cares, they are quite pleased with themselves even if they have their camera on green box mode."

My brother in law, with his 7D for 2 years, 24-70/2.8L, 100-400L, 17-40L, and experience with film SLRs back to the 80's, had never taken the camera out of green box mode, and complained about focus not being sharp much of the time. He was grateful for the introduction to center point, but that's as far as we got.

Another friend...well, colleague, owned a 5Dii from the first month it was out, owned a D800 from the first month it was out, all the fastest cards, is ALWAYS bugging me why I don't buy a grip for the battery capacity. He even put Magic Lantern on his 5Dii because it was cool. I looked, and he had not even taken enough shots to run the battery down for the first time.

I'm not jealous. It is comedy. I don't feel big. Both of these people can do things I cannot. It's just plain comical. Next time it will be at my expense. This time, it's my turn to laugh.

I've encountered that plenty of times too, but I've definitely encountered the opposite too, I don't get why people have an issue with people being annoyed by it. My own brother told me that he needed to buy a new camera because his Rebel (XT, XSi?) couldn't take shots as good as my camera and that his shots would sometimes come out blurry or grainy and he was tired of it. I took his camera and showed him that he had his ISO set to the max, and he for whatever reason was shooting in "Landscape" mode and he had one of the outer focus points selected. He didn't know what any of those settings meant or how to even change them, aside from the landscape mode. I gave him a brief explanation of what the settings did and how to select them and then put his card into my camera (T2i at the time) and took a few shots and asked him if he could tell a difference on his computer at home, which he later admitted he couldn't.

Hogloff wrote in post #16251814 (external link)
Well it looks like you have a mitt full of some nice gear. You do realize many pro's produce fabulous photos with half the gear you have. I wonder if they walk by you and have a good chuckle as they watch you with all your gear.

Just a thought...what goes around comes around.

Why are you looking for a fight? Seriously?


Fuji X-Pro2 // Fuji X-T1 // Fuji X-100T // XF 18mm f2 // XF 35mm f1.4 // XF 60mm f2.4 // Rokinon 12mm f2 // Rokinon 21mm f1.4 // XF 18-55mm f/2.8-4 // XF 55-200mm f3.5-4.8 // Rokinon 85mm f1.4 // Zhonghi Lensturbo ii // Various adapted MF lenses
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Hogloff
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Aug 29, 2013 21:39 |  #67
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EverydayGetaway wrote in post #16251964 (external link)
I've encountered that plenty of times too, but I've definitely encountered the opposite too, I don't get why people have an issue with people being annoyed by it. My own brother told me that he needed to buy a new camera because his Rebel (XT, XSi?) couldn't take shots as good as my camera and that his shots would sometimes come out blurry or grainy and he was tired of it. I took his camera and showed him that he had his ISO set to the max, and he for whatever reason was shooting in "Landscape" mode and he had one of the outer focus points selected. He didn't know what any of those settings meant or how to even change them, aside from the landscape mode. I gave him a brief explanation of what the settings did and how to select them and then put his card into my camera (T2i at the time) and took a few shots and asked him if he could tell a difference on his computer at home, which he later admitted he couldn't.

Why are you looking for a fight? Seriously?

I'm not. Just don't like people going around putting down others because they might not be as skilled. Want to make sure people understand that they themselves are not at the top of the mountain and there ate others that can look down upon them, just like they look down upon others.

What about you...the discussion was not even involving you...what's your beef?




  
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ronfin
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Aug 29, 2013 21:45 as a reply to  @ EverydayGetaway's post |  #68

It doesn't bother me what camera, or lens someone else buys, or how good/bad they are with it. I'm only concerned with my own ability, and how I can get better. I do this as a hobby, and a passion. I'm by no means a Pro, and although I've had a few pictures published online, and worked a few local events, I've never grown an ego over it. I'll probably never do this as a "Pro". I've been trolling this site for a while just picking up tips, and advice. (thank you all)
I started back in the 90's with a Canon, and always loved Canon. I bought a 50D years ago, then upgraded to a 7D because the camera offered more. I also just dumped the 7D for a 5DIII this year because it too offered more than the 7D. I've used the "green box" many times when time is crucial, and I'm not fluent enough with it yet to make the right choices. Does that make my pictures worse than the guy who uses M? After Lightroom I doubt it. If it's exposed right, and composed right, does it matter if it was shot with M, P, of GB? The end result is what we strive for isn't it? Caring who bought what, for whatever their reasons is pointless IMO. I know from experience that the 5DIII handles low-light a lot better than the 7D did, and that's what makes me happy. If it's shot in P, M, Av, Tv, or GB is just a silly argument that comes across as arrogant. .02




  
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EverydayGetaway
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Aug 29, 2013 21:45 |  #69

Hogloff wrote in post #16252021 (external link)
I'm not. Just don't like people going around putting down others because they might not be as skilled. Want to make sure people understand that they themselves are not at the top of the mountain and there ate others that can look down upon them, just like they look down upon others.

What about you...the discussion was not even involving you...what's your beef?

OK, and these other people never implied in anyway that they weren't aware of that, that's my beef. You come off as very "holier-than-though". Here you are talking about how you can't stand it when people look down on others, yet you're doing it right back...


Fuji X-Pro2 // Fuji X-T1 // Fuji X-100T // XF 18mm f2 // XF 35mm f1.4 // XF 60mm f2.4 // Rokinon 12mm f2 // Rokinon 21mm f1.4 // XF 18-55mm f/2.8-4 // XF 55-200mm f3.5-4.8 // Rokinon 85mm f1.4 // Zhonghi Lensturbo ii // Various adapted MF lenses
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ronfin
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Aug 29, 2013 22:01 as a reply to  @ EverydayGetaway's post |  #70

This might be off topic, but I thought was sorta relevant given this discussion. I was at a wedding and was talking to one of the photographers. Asking them random questions, checking out their gear etc, and asked "Are you shooting in RAW?", and the guy laughed at me. He said, and I'll paraphrase because the exact quote eludes me, "*laugh* No, I shoot in jpeg because I get it right in the camera first before I shoot..." I then asked "Aren't you ever concerned about missing a shot because while you're moving around, and the ambient light is constantly changing, and other bulbs are going off, especially with a white wedding gown, that if you get a great shot and the exposure is wrong that it would be harder to fix in post if it's not in RAW?", and he snubbed me with a snobby "no" and walked away. Is this common? I later asked him for his card only so I remember who NOT to use when I get married in the next year or so. Sorry if this has strayed OT, but given that we were discussing how others thought when buying equipment, wouldn't it pertain also to how they use that equipment, and their attitudes towards others while shooting? Not trying to open a RAW vs JPEG debate. Just thought the guy was arrogant and way too confident about "getting it right in camera" when that's just silly. We all get it wrong from time to time. Even the best of the best.




  
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DocFrankenstein
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Aug 29, 2013 22:10 |  #71

EverydayGetaway wrote in post #16252035 (external link)
OK, and these other people never implied in anyway that they weren't aware of that, that's my beef. You come off as very "holier-than-though". Here you are talking about how you can't stand it when people look down on others, yet you're doing it right back...

He's turning the OP's argument back at the OP to point out certain issues.

It's called moral universalism or "what's good for the goose is good for the gander" and you seem to be missing the point.


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kin2son
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Aug 29, 2013 22:15 |  #72
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Shooting jpeg is just plain dumb.

It isn't just about fixing the flaws, but more about enhancing and producing better end result thru pp.


5D3 Gripped / 17-40L / Σ35 / 40 Pancake / Zeiss 50 MP / Σ85 / 100L Macro / 70-200 f2.8L II IS / 430 EX II / 580 EX II / Canon 2xIII TC / Kenko Ext. Tubes
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2ndviolinman
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Aug 29, 2013 22:17 |  #73

Like I said, next time it will be at my expense. People are funny, there is not much else to laugh at. I never laughed at a landscape. Now, life and death arguments about filters- THAT'S funny.


David
5Dc, 5Dii, Canon 16-35 f/4L IS, 40/2.8 Pancake, 85/1.8, 100/2.8 Macro, 135/2.0L, 200/2.8L, converted 35mm TS, Sigma 50/2.8 Macro, 70/2.8 Macro, Zeiss ZE 21/2.8, Zeiss Contax 28/2.8, 50/1.7 & 85/2.8, Jena 135/3.5, Voigtlander 90mm f/3.5 APO, Canon 28-135.

  
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Rittrato
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Aug 29, 2013 22:25 |  #74

Kolor-Pikker wrote in post #16249733 (external link)
On the bright side - these same people fuel all the good deals you can get on eBay!

That's actually not true. Majority of these people has no idea how the market works. You can actually find these type of people polluting the For Sale forum. Canon 5D Mark II's with 25,000 actuations with asking price of $1650 plus 3% fee.




  
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DocFrankenstein
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Aug 29, 2013 22:26 |  #75

ronfin wrote in post #16252097 (external link)
"Aren't you ever concerned about missing a shot because while you're moving around, and the ambient light is constantly changing, and other bulbs are going off, especially with a white wedding gown Is this common?

You can't expect a photographer in the middle of the wedding to just hang loose and talk gear until you get bored. There's pictures to take. When you start questioning his methods and whether he's got the skills to properly expose for a wedding dress, very few photographers are going to hang around...

Photography is art and people pick their equipment and workflow for personal reasons depending on style. Enforcing your preferences on a professional doing his job is bound to touch a string.


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