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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 30 Oct 2013 (Wednesday) 22:25
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6D users, don't kill me...

 
OuttaCtrl
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Nov 02, 2013 23:00 |  #301

gabebalazs wrote in post #16419842 (external link)
bw! I'm still not getting my answer, how was that possible that all those pros, award winning photographer somehow still managed to use the 5DII with great results. The bought them like cupcakes.
And what about the 1DsIII? Wasn't that the "best thing out there back then"? Maybe because 5DII users did not need the super duper AF of the 1Ds and the 5DII was sufficient enough for their work.
Now, why can't the 6D be sufficient for us 6D owners?

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kin2son
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Nov 02, 2013 23:00 |  #302
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gabebalazs wrote in post #16419872 (external link)
Just for the heck of it, here is a 100% crop of one of the photos so the player isn't "tiny" :)

keep in mind the following before you make your judgement!

- Cold, drizzling weather
- Night game under stadium lights
- Sigma 70-200 2.8 OS + 2x TC (not even a bare lens). A 2x TC really drops your IQ, especially under demanding conditions.
- wide open aperture = f/5.6
- This was shot wide open
- ISO 5000 to get a decent shutter speed
- Shot with the upper center AF point

Now, keeping these in mind, here is the 100% crop.

QUOTED IMAGE

Player is clearly in focus. Good job?

Maybe bobbyz has a faulty 6D afterall? :p


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gnome ­ chompski
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Nov 02, 2013 23:01 |  #303

pwm2 wrote in post #16419733 (external link)
I just personally think Canon stripped it too hard. The 6D really did deserve to get the 7D AF improved with the extra light sensitivity of the center point.

That would still left the 5D3 with an even better AF and the two memory slots more or less needed for critical commercial jobs.

that would have been an even better body.


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gabebalazs
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Nov 02, 2013 23:03 |  #304

Here's one more, exact same shot data, except this was taken in AI Servo mode (upper center outer point):

IMAGE: http://gabebalazsphoto.com/uploads/6DouterAFtracking1crop.jpg

SONY A7RIII | SONY A7III | SONY RX10 IV | SONY RX100 | 24-70 2.8 GM | 70-200 2.8 GM | 16-35 F/4 | PZ 18-105 F/4 | FE 85 1.8 | FE 28-70 | SIGMA 35 1.4 ART | SIGMA 150-600 C | ROKINON 14 2.8
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gnome ­ chompski
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Nov 02, 2013 23:05 |  #305

what ISo were you using? edit** nevermind, I actually read the info for once...


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gabebalazs
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Nov 02, 2013 23:07 |  #306

gnome chompski wrote in post #16419889 (external link)
what ISo were you using? edit** nevermind, I actually read the info for once...

ISO3200. Here is the out of camera jpeg of the same shot, it actually may look better than the RAW I posted ;)

IMAGE: http://gabebalazsphoto.com/uploads/6DouterAFtracking1crop2.jpg

SONY A7RIII | SONY A7III | SONY RX10 IV | SONY RX100 | 24-70 2.8 GM | 70-200 2.8 GM | 16-35 F/4 | PZ 18-105 F/4 | FE 85 1.8 | FE 28-70 | SIGMA 35 1.4 ART | SIGMA 150-600 C | ROKINON 14 2.8
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gabebalazs
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Nov 02, 2013 23:08 |  #307

gnome chompski wrote in post #16419889 (external link)
what ISo were you using? edit** nevermind, I actually read the info for once...

No no, your question is valid. The second crop was ISO 3200 not 5000. My bad.

Going to bed...


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Fitness ­ Freak
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Nov 02, 2013 23:23 |  #308

This has been a GREAT thread! Of course, it took me an hour and a half to get from start to finish and I wanted to yell "STOP" to you guys so that I could catch up but could see the page numbers growing...Anyway, I have the 5D MarkII and am looking at getting a second body, well, I guess technically third since I also have a T2i but I rarely ever use it anymore. Oh, and btw, I loved someone's earlier comment (like half-way thru the thread) that said the Rebel users were out honing their skills etc....SO true. No one should be knockin' the Rebel shooters, they're out there learning and improving, not judging anyone else and clinging to their own opinions. Anyhow, I debated the MarkII or MarkIII last year and decided the MarkIII wasn't worth the additional cost. I just started researching the 6D and am now completely sold on it. It's EXACTLY what I need for my photography since in my case, noise is VERY important to me and auto focus really isn't. Thanks for helping me make my decision everyone!


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kin2son
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Nov 02, 2013 23:28 |  #309
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Fitness Freak wrote in post #16419925 (external link)
It's EXACTLY what I need for my photography since in my case, noise is VERY important to me and auto focus really isn't. Thanks for helping me make my decision everyone!

Great that we helped ;)

How often do you shoot say pass ISO3200? Reason I ask is the difference is less than a stop, maybe 3/4 of a stop at best at high ISO.

Can see a lot of landscape/architecture kind of shots on your site, also as a second body alongside your existing 5D2, I recommend the 6D in a heartbeat.


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Fitness ­ Freak
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Nov 02, 2013 23:39 |  #310

I honestly try to shoot at ISO 100 all the time-which isn't always possible but here on the border in South West Texas...it's ALWAYS freakin' sunny. And, being that I use a tripod for my sunrises, sunsets, and landscapes, long SS isn't an issue. However, I've run into some real issues with the noise problems that the MarkII has, stuff that I can't even always fix in editing. I read another thread that discussed this and someone mentioned this problem with the MarkII specifically when trying to lighten areas of shadows or backlit due to sunrises/sunsets. This is where the 6D will be awesome for me! I'm planning on keeping my 70-200L 2.8 on my MarkII and using my 50mm 1.8 and 17-40L on the 6D since when I use those two lenses, those are the times when I'm working in the most low-light situations.


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kin2son
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Nov 02, 2013 23:42 |  #311
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Fitness Freak wrote in post #16419952 (external link)
I honestly try to shoot at ISO 100 all the time-which isn't always possible but here on the border in South West Texas...it's ALWAYS freakin' sunny. And, being that I use a tripod for my sunrises, sunsets, and landscapes, long SS isn't an issue. However, I've run into some real issues with the noise problems that the MarkII has, stuff that I can't even always fix in editing. I read another thread that discussed this and someone mentioned this problem with the MarkII specifically when trying to lighten areas of shadows or backlit due to sunrises/sunsets. This is where the 6D will be awesome for me!

No, not really.

6D might not have the banding issue as much as the 5D2, but in your situation it sounds like you are lifting the shadows and unfortunately shadow lifting isn't Canon sensor's strong point, and 6D will have negligible difference compared to your 5D2.

In that regards, a Nikon D610 with the Sony sensor is much better for the task you described, or blend multiple exposure in post.


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Fitness ­ Freak
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Nov 02, 2013 23:57 |  #312

There's plenty of other times the better ISO will help. I've basically shot everything within 2 hrs of here to shoot, so now I've moved on to taking still life photos. Many times I have to handhold my camera for those shoots which means cranking up my ISO and shooting close to wide open so you can see where the 6D would be helpful in that area too.


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EverydayGetaway
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Nov 02, 2013 23:58 |  #313

kin2son wrote in post #16419960 (external link)
No, not really.

6D might not have the banding issue as much as the 5D2, but in your situation it sounds like you are lifting the shadows and unfortunately shadow lifting isn't Canon sensor's strong point, and 6D will have negligible difference compared to your 5D2.

In that regards, a Nikon D610 with the Sony sensor is much better for the task you described, or blend multiple exposure in post.

I disagree. I pull shadows pretty regularly with the 6D when needed, never seen much of an issue with noise, whereas when using my father's 5DII, I definitely did notice it. Yes, Nikon/Sony is even better in that regard, but for most users the 6D and 5DIII has plenty of DR and the noise patterns on the more modern cameras is much more pleasing than the older models.

Also, someone posted it in this thread (twice I think) a test done with 5DIII vs 6D vs 5DII for noise in long exposures and the 5DII was nowhere even close to the two newer models, so if you shoot any long exposures, the 6D has a clear advantage.


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Fitness ­ Freak
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Nov 03, 2013 00:01 |  #314

I pull shadows pretty regularly with the 6D when needed, never seen much of an issue with noise, whereas when using my father's 5DII, I definitely did notice it. Yes, Nikon/Sony is even better in that regard, but for most users the 6D and 5DIII has plenty of DR and the noise patterns on the more modern cameras is much more pleasing than the older models.

Also, someone posted it in this thread (twice I think) a test done with 5DIII vs 6D vs 5DII for noise in long exposures and the 5DII was nowhere even close to the two newer models, so if you shoot any long exposures, the 6D has a clear advantage.

Yup. I read that too. The MarkII is REALLY lacking in this area, I can attest to it myself.


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Nov 03, 2013 00:26 |  #315

gabebalazs wrote in post #16419856 (external link)
3 out of 4 were not stopped down, shot wide open at f/5.6, which admittedly has a nice deep DoF at that distance. But so does a 400mm f/2.8, whose DoF also covers the whole player at that distance. But isn't that the point of taking a photo of a player? Show me a lens that has such shallow DoF that only the player's eyes are in focus from 50-60 yards away. Nope, you can't. Even my 300 2.8 keeps the whole player (in soccer) in focus from 30-40 yards away.

But again, how was that possible with a focus and recompose, center point only camera? Don't your words imply that it shouldn't even be possible? Shouldn't the outer AF point hunt? Or produce completely out of focus images? Granted 400mm f/5.6 is not very impressive, but it can miss AF easily and produce a blurry photo if not AF'd properly.

you do bring up a good point on sports, and that's why I am very comfortable using center point. Usually, shots are a good distance away, and plenty of DOF to make things work. You can really focus on another player on the same focal plane and get an in focus shot.

I'll probably be cursing the 6D some more now that I have the 85L again for a few months :D

I have to shoot a few birthdays soon.....


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