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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 30 Dec 2013 (Monday) 09:42
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Help with the lens purchase or Settings

 
robienyshe
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Dec 31, 2013 02:21 as a reply to  @ post 16565856 |  #31

Hi Sorry for the delay.. here is the sample pic..
http://www.flickr.com …93080773@N07/11​663935566/ (external link)

http://www.flickr.com …93080773@N07/11​663405783/ (external link)

Tell me what is the mistake I made? I used flash for these pics..

I used "P" mode.

Thanks


T4i, Σ 17-50 f2.8, 18-55mm, 55-250mm, 50mm f1.8, 40mm f2.8, 85mm f1.8, 430EXII SpeedLite, LR4, DOLICA AX620B100

  
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DreDaze
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Dec 31, 2013 02:37 |  #32

you used flash for the first, but not the second...or at least it didn't fire...for the second your shutter speed was too slow without flash

for the first, if i were in your shoes i would've used a faster shutter speed, 1/200 or so...and probably lowered the ISO a bit, and just let the flash bounce provide the majority of the light

you said you have focus issues with your 50mm, but using that with an external flash assist should work out a lot better...using it on the 3 men would've helped to blur out the background(provided you have the room to back up), which causes some of the 'wow' factor people like...as for the shot of the kids, it would be hard to get the wow factor in my opinion when you want such a large DOF...you could achieve some wow in post processing, but i think the subject blur makes that one too far gone

also i can't see what focus mode you used, and there was mention of using AI Servo, but i really think you would've been fine with one shot here...just make sure to avoid AI focus


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PH68
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Dec 31, 2013 05:12 |  #33

Are you you choosing the focus point, or letting the camera do it all.
Also crank your ISO up.
Finally shoot RAW and learn to post process.

All your equipment is perfectly fine, even the 50mm lens... just learn to use it.


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JeffreyG
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Dec 31, 2013 07:04 |  #34

robienyshe wrote in post #16566037 (external link)
Hi Sorry for the delay.. here is the sample pic..
http://www.flickr.com …93080773@N07/11​663935566/ (external link)

http://www.flickr.com …93080773@N07/11​663405783/ (external link)

Tell me what is the mistake I made? I used flash for these pics..

I used "P" mode.

Thanks

The first photo:
1/60, f/4 and ISO1600 with flash. The photo is OK, but there is some softness from ghosting mainly because of the high ISO and slow shutter speed bringing in ambient light.

If you stick with flash, my first suggestion to go M mode, 1/200, f/8 and ISO 400 will solve this shot completely. Since the rooms are not especially big, the flash (when bounced) will light the entire room.

The second photo:
1/5, f/4 and ISO 800 and the flash was turned off. The blur is exactly what you would expect with an extremely slow shutter speed like 1/5th second with no flash.

I still suggest using flash for this second shot, same settings as the first. The room lighting is pretty even and blah, so there really is no good reason to try and shoot this without flash.

If you wanted to shoot it without flash, you are going to wind up at an extremely high ISO. But let's go ahead and look at this.

I really like 1/80 as a bare minimum for people that are not deliberately holding still for pictures. That is four full stops faster than the 1/5 you are at. This is also really scraping the barrel (IMO) for shutter speed both to deal with motion blur and camera shake, but as you will see even to get to 1/80 will demand very high ISO.

Sticking with the 18-55 IS lens at the wide end of the range you could shoot:
1/80, f/4 and ISO12800. I don't think this will be good for noise.

Switching to the 40/2.8 lens, which may not be wide enough you could shoot:
1/80, f/2.8 and ISO 6400. Still going to be very noisy, plus limited on focal length

Finally, you could use the 50/1.8 lens but this is a really tight field of view:
1/100, f/1.8 and ISO 3200

None of these choices look attractive to me, which is why I recommended using bounced flash and setting the camera to eliminate ambient light from the shot. The rooms are small and the flash will light the whole room.

Blending ambient light with flash will call for color gels on the flash and will risk ghosting and blur in the pictures. Best bet here is to quash the ambient.


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DreDaze
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Dec 31, 2013 09:42 |  #35

yeah, i just want to clarify that when i said to switch to the 50mm, or 40mm i still meant to use flash...just that i would use a faster aperture with the flash


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JeffreyG
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Dec 31, 2013 09:53 |  #36

DreDaze wrote in post #16566533 (external link)
yeah, i just want to clarify that when i said to switch to the 50mm, or 40mm i still meant to use flash...just that i would use a faster aperture with the flash

It was Mike_311 who was advocating to shoot without flash at all, or at the least to blend flash with ambient light.

I think for the OP's equipment and experience that neither of these suggestions are very good. I don't think their camera is really all that usable at ISO6400+, they would still be at a very slow shutter speed, and they will be unable to deal with any fast moving subjects at all, which they mentioned in the first post.

I'm all for blending flash and ambient light when the situation demands it, but in a small room with low level tungsten lighting there is just no good point. A bounced flash is going to look a lot like the available room lighting anyway, and by killing ambient I don't have to try and gel my flash to match the color temperature of the lights.

When you do gel a Canon flash to match tungsten lamps, you have to manually set the color temperature (this is just a reminder). EOS cameras in AWB will default to flash color temperature when a flash is used.


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I use a Canon 5DIII and a Sony A7rIII

  
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vengence
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Dec 31, 2013 10:33 |  #37

I agree, just set the camera to 1/100, f/8, ISO 200 and the bounce flash and you'll be much happier.




  
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ceegee
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Dec 31, 2013 10:43 |  #38

When using your flash, you shouldn't be using P mode, or AV. In both these modes, the camera will not take the flash into account as the main light; instead, it will adjust to the ambient light, giving you high ISOs and slow shutter speeds, and hence noisy, blurred images. These modes use flash as fill only. What you want to do is to use the flash as the main light for your subjects. To do that, you need to use manual (M) mode, which requires you to choose your own settings (shutter speed, aperture, ISO, white balance). Previous posters have suggested the settings you should try. Set up your camera the way they have suggested, put the flash in ETTL mode, and try a couple of sample shots. If necessary, you can then adjust your settings - shutter speed, ISO or aperture - to get the results you're looking for. Note that, when using flash, your camera has a maximum shutter speed beyond which it can't synchronize with the flash: probably 1/250 or 1/200. You shouldn't set your shutter speed higher than that.

See how that works for you. Once you've got the results you want this way, you can then try "bouncing" your flash off the ceiling or off a light-coloured wall, by pointing the flash head in different directions. Again, you'll need to adjust your settings slightly, to get the results you want. Bounced light is less harsh and will give you a more natural-looking outcome than a flash pointed directly at your subject.

Experimentation is the best way to find the settings that work for you. It sounds complicated, but it's really not. Half an hour's testing, and you should be good to go in pretty much any situation.


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robienyshe
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Dec 31, 2013 14:01 |  #39

Hey thanks for the advice.. will try to improve it. I'll use M mode. I'll try the said settings and keep you updated. However I read in this forum something about bouncing light? what does that mean? is it something like using the flash not directly towards the subject.. I have seen on the flash that I can tilt the flash head but to what angle do I need to set if that what bouncing the light means.


T4i, Σ 17-50 f2.8, 18-55mm, 55-250mm, 50mm f1.8, 40mm f2.8, 85mm f1.8, 430EXII SpeedLite, LR4, DOLICA AX620B100

  
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JeffreyG
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Dec 31, 2013 14:06 |  #40

robienyshe wrote in post #16567185 (external link)
Hey thanks for the advice.. will try to improve it. I'll use M mode. I'll try the said settings and keep you updated. However I read in this forum something about bouncing light? what does that mean? is it something like using the flash not directly towards the subject.. I have seen on the flash that I can tilt the flash head but to what angle do I need to set if that what bouncing the light means.

Bouncing means to shoot the flash at the ceiling. Hopefully your ceilings are white.

Just point it straight up. What happens is the flash makes a large, bright patch on the ceiling and this large patch of light becomes the light source in your picture. The effect will light up the whole room and make the light look very natural just like room lighting. It is much, much better than direct flash with the flashhead pointed straight at the subjects. Don't do that if you can bounce.

Try it. Get a kid or your spouse to act as a test subject. Set the camera to M mode, 1/200, f/8 and ISO 400. Try one shot with the flash pointed at the subject and one shot with the flash pointed at the ceiling.


My personal stuff:http://www.flickr.com/​photos/jngirbach/sets/ (external link)
I use a Canon 5DIII and a Sony A7rIII

  
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robienyshe
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Dec 31, 2013 16:17 |  #41

JeffreyG wrote in post #16567208 (external link)
Bouncing means to shoot the flash at the ceiling. Hopefully your ceilings are white.

Just point it straight up. What happens is the flash makes a large, bright patch on the ceiling and this large patch of light becomes the light source in your picture. The effect will light up the whole room and make the light look very natural just like room lighting. It is much, much better than direct flash with the flashhead pointed straight at the subjects. Don't do that if you can bounce.

Try it. Get a kid or your spouse to act as a test subject. Set the camera to M mode, 1/200, f/8 and ISO 400. Try one shot with the flash pointed at the subject and one shot with the flash pointed at the ceiling.

will do it soon..JeffreyG.. The said settings is for 18-55mm right? btw the ceilings is the same color of the wall- Almond color. So stick to the said settings and point the flashhead towards the ceiling right? Also what would be the best recommended settings for outdoor family pics (during day time or evening time)


T4i, Σ 17-50 f2.8, 18-55mm, 55-250mm, 50mm f1.8, 40mm f2.8, 85mm f1.8, 430EXII SpeedLite, LR4, DOLICA AX620B100

  
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JeffreyG
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Dec 31, 2013 16:21 |  #42

robienyshe wrote in post #16567522 (external link)
will do it soon..JeffreyG.. The said settings is for 18-55mm right? btw the ceilings is the same color of the wall- Almond color. So stick to the said settings and point the flashhead towards the ceiling right? Also what would be the best recommended settings for outdoor family pics (during day time or evening time)

That's getting to be too broad, you need to gain a better overall command of the camera so that you can adapt to any situation.

Here is a good starting point, and there are many more both online and in books.

https://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthre​ad.php?t=414088


My personal stuff:http://www.flickr.com/​photos/jngirbach/sets/ (external link)
I use a Canon 5DIII and a Sony A7rIII

  
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