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FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre Bird Talk 
Thread started 01 Mar 2013 (Friday) 10:28
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Extremely unethical behavior by one of our own

 
Levina ­ de ­ Ruijter
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Jan 06, 2014 17:38 |  #226

People who grew up on the land with animals and birds often have a more no nonsense approach to them then people who did not. When I came on the forum 5 years ago Mitch was very active in the bird forum. I was a novice, both at photography and birds and I learned a great deal from him. He has great knowledge of birds and their behaviour, respects them, looks out for them and has affection for them. Those of you who don't know Mitch, please, be careful not to judge too quick. He is a great guy and a great POTN member.

Mitch, how's Red? :)


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canonloader
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Jan 06, 2014 18:15 |  #227

Levina, Red surpises me every year. He is still the Red Baron and all the other Cardinals respect him, or fear him, most likey. Remember that damaged area on his lower right side that comes in grey, molt after molt? It's still there. HA. He is not what you call friendly, but he will come close now, for peanuts in the dish outside the window. He just does not like being stared at. From me at my desk, to the dish on the power box is about 5 feet, and he is OK with that. So now he is for sure going on 8 years old. First pics of that damaged area was summer of 07 and he was an adult then. Average lifespan is said to be 15 years in the wild and 28 in captivity. He does not appear to be aging any at all. I wish I could say the same. LOL

Not a recent shot.

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Levina ­ de ­ Ruijter
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Jan 06, 2014 18:21 |  #228

Ah, he looks great, Mitch! And the grey still gives him a distinguished look. If I were a lady Cardinal I would go after him. :D


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canonloader
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Jan 06, 2014 18:38 |  #229

He's a great Dad too. Raises a couple hatches a year and even the occasional cowbird. Takes good care of them all. I think most of the Cardinals here are all related to him.


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Levina ­ de ­ Ruijter
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Jan 06, 2014 18:44 |  #230

canonloader wrote in post #16583493 (external link)
He's a great Dad too. Raises a couple hatches a year and even the occasional cowbird. Takes good care of them all. I think most of the Cardinals here are all related to him.

LOL. Red's Dynasty!! Good for him. And I think it's wonderful he's still around.


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canonloader
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Jan 06, 2014 18:54 |  #231

I know, me too. Him and Peanut. Peanut and his Mrs. are almost as big as crows now from a diet of peanuts. He's 6 or 7 years old now. I have pics of him as a juvie.

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Levina ­ de ­ Ruijter
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Jan 06, 2014 19:04 |  #232

HAHA, you fattened them up! Yes, I remember Peanut. What a sweet shot.
Mitch, have you given up bird photography altogether? I always loved your shots and it's great seeing some again.


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canonloader
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Jan 06, 2014 19:09 |  #233

I don't drive anymore and I don't walk far, and I do not have a birding lens. All I got is an old T1i I used on the microscope. Editing images takes too much time now. I keep busy with other things though. I got back into amateur radio last spring, and that's a lot of fun. I even talk to people in Netherlands now and then when the conditions are good for it. LOL


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Levina ­ de ­ Ruijter
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Jan 06, 2014 19:29 |  #234

Well, sounds like you're keeping plenty busy! Great talking to you again, Mitch. Who knows, if you keep chatting with those folks in the Netherlands we might be able to talk in Dutch next time! :)


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canonloader
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Jan 06, 2014 19:58 |  #235

LOL, I doubt that. :)


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Levina ­ de ­ Ruijter
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Jan 06, 2014 20:11 |  #236

LOL. Me too! :lol:


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jhayesvw
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Jan 06, 2014 23:16 as a reply to  @ Levina de Ruijter's post |  #237

mileslong24 wrote in post #16582838 (external link)
I guess I just happen to think there's a difference between randomly catching an owl swooping in on a small rodent and setting a rodent right in the perfect spot so that you already know exactly where it's going to land. Probably already having the camera focused to said spot and waiting for the owl to fill the frame and shoot. Big difference between reacting quickly and nailing focus on something than knowing something was going to happen and being ready for it.

I know a guy that puts mice in a clear tupperware type container to bait in raptors for photography. He is pretty famous and does workshops, tours, etc.

I removed him from my Flickr feed because his techniques are unethical. He has been known to throw things at large birds so he can get flight shots too. NO THANKS.

Every shot I get is from me walking around on trails and snapping pics of animals I happen upon. In minutes, I'm out of their zone and they are going about their business. Typically I see them for no more than 20 seconds as they land, I snap, they or I leave.

I do not respect an unethically baited shot at all. Its sad too because some people actually are at the right time and place and get THE SHOT. However their work is lumped in with the people who set up their shots with trapped mice and such.
I guess I will hop off my high horse.

Mitch, I doubt there are many, if any, people on here would walk past a bird on the ground and not try to help it in the least. I think you are reading a bit far into it. Im not trying to argue, just letting my opinion of the people on this site be know also.



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grayline
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Jan 07, 2014 01:04 |  #238

yeah I once knew a guy who tied floss around the waist of petstore mice and put them in the center of a field tied to a stake in the ground just for a shot too as well. pretty sick if you ask me ,,,


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Duane ­ N
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Jan 07, 2014 04:30 |  #239

jhayesvw wrote in post #16584275 (external link)
Its sad too because some people actually are at the right time and place and get THE SHOT. However their work is lumped in with the people who set up their shots with trapped mice and such.

I had one person insist this shot of a Red-tailed Hawk I got catching a Squirrel was set up because of the blood the Squirrel had on it's back end. I guess they thought the Squirrel was already injured and I used it as bait for the RTH. What they didn't see in this image was the ones prior to the hawk actually catching this Squirrel (the ones I managed to capture). The hawk missed the initial attack when it flew down to try to catch this Squirrel. It ended up running around the tree and then it finally managed to grab it as you see in this image.

IMAGE: http://www.3rdicreations.com/img/s9/v94/p1661544064-4.jpg


I wasn't upset that they thought that though...I actually felt sorry for them if they go around thinking every shot they see like this is set up. It also told me people do look at images of baited birds differently than natural ones.

I thought I looked at images of baited birds (raptors catching something) differently because I haven't captured one yet but after I got this one last year I look at baited images the same way. Maybe it's because I realize how much difficulty, time, patience and luck is involved in getting an image like this. It only took me 5 1/2 years and a little over 5 hours of following this hawk around on this day to get "the shot" I was after for so long.

The ethics of baiting arguement is never going to go away and each person has drawn their line on what they think is right or wrong and it's useless to try to convince someone else why you think your ideals are right. I would love to bait raptors to get the shots I'm after but for me the fun would be taken away...it would become too easy.

As far as what I think about this whole situation when it was originally posted...the baiting doesn't bother me too much it's the teasing of the Owl that bothers me the most. This Owl was obviously used to being fed by people so I don't blame the photographers for that part. What I do blame them for is taking advantage of a situation someone else created for them and taking it to the next level.

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cdiver2
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Jan 07, 2014 05:06 |  #240

Levina de Ruijter wrote in post #16583278 (external link)
People who grew up on the land with animals and birds often have a more no nonsense approach to them then people who did not. When I came on the forum 5 years ago Mitch was very active in the bird forum. I was a novice, both at photography and birds and I learned a great deal from him. He has great knowledge of birds and their behaviour, respects them, looks out for them and has affection for them. Those of you who don't know Mitch, please, be careful not to judge too quick. He is a great guy and a great POTN member.

Mitch, how's Red? :)

He is been judge the way he judges other people even those he has never spoken to. From Ohlook

canonloader, when you speak so scornfully about people whose opinions differ from yours, they and the rest of us (I've been a silent bystander up till now) will be less inclined to take seriously what you say. I know you're convinced that you're right. Don't you understand that those who believe differently are likewise convinced that they're right? In a civilized debate, one criticizes what is said but not the person who said it.




  
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Extremely unethical behavior by one of our own
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