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FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre General Photography Talk 
Thread started 04 Apr 2012 (Wednesday) 08:26
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Composition and all that Arty stuff - discussion thread.

 
airfrogusmc
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Jan 11, 2014 21:00 |  #2386

jetcode wrote in post #16598018 (external link)
Well that's most certainly a step up on my demeanor! I've gotten so picky my camera groans when I put my hands on her. LOL!

I know the feeling. ;)




  
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airfrogusmc
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Jan 11, 2014 22:09 |  #2387

How about a portfolio of street & stranger portraits.

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DocFrankenstein
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Jan 11, 2014 22:31 |  #2388

jetcode wrote in post #16596920 (external link)
So well composed shots of uninteresting subject matter is the way to establish a working identity? Rot's O' Ruck with that career. No one shops Getty for photographers or brand identity. They shop Getty for compelling images. No one goes to a show because X is showing their work. They go to the show for the imagery that X is presenting. The photographer is immaterial and should be. It's all about the content. You have to be literally brain dead to shoot a crappy image of a compelling subject. Now compelling means different things to different people. That's a given.

Photography is like a skating rink. Some do hockey on it, some do figure skating.

This is composition and arty stuff thread. I see little overlap with commerical and stock oriented photography. So I don't know how why those topics need to be dragged in here.

It's like saying "it'll never sell" to a beginner painter who's drawing a rainbow to practice mixing colors.


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jetcode
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Jan 12, 2014 00:52 |  #2389

DocFrankenstein wrote in post #16598262 (external link)
Photography is like a skating rink. Some do hockey on it, some do figure skating.

This is composition and arty stuff thread. I see little overlap with commerical and stock oriented photography. So I don't know how why those topics need to be dragged in here.

It's like saying "it'll never sell" to a beginner painter who's drawing a rainbow to practice mixing colors.

Should people who plan on selling their photography create a new thread called Composition and the Arty stuff for money? Everyone starts somewhere. We all do. No one should feel penalized for where they are at. If anything these posts should provide insight and inspiration. People improve when exposed to information and craft.

Here's some art shot a couple of months ago. I plan on selling this in a series. This entire effect is the result of a lawn chair set table with marbled glass, a rickety old footstool, a nice ammonite specimen, and great afternoon light. Post is contrast and exposure adjustment and a little grit removal.

Ammonite

IMAGE: http://www.joethibodeau.com/photo/Ammonite_4491.jpg



  
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Owain ­ Shaw
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Jan 12, 2014 09:16 |  #2390

Back to the previous page, the photographs of Blackpool are excellent. I've always found seaside towns in winter fascinating, and I shot one a few years ago but I think Blackpool must be the ultimate in terms of this particular subject matter - the scale of it and the contrast between a sunny day at the pleasure beach and deserted winter's day is beautifully illustrated by those photographs - they're very emotive of days I've spent walking along windy, rainy beaches that are heaving in summer, but encountering about three other windswept people and their dogs because you've gone there in the first week of December. Thanks very much for sharing, Bidkev.

Allen, I particularly like your portraits of the Cigar vendor and the dry-cleaning (I think) worker, and there are a few other shop workers/vendors I can see in the series as well, these could be very interesting. Also the top right is a beautiful candid, along with the one immediately below it. A lot of strong images there.

Finally, jetcode, yours is a lovely image with the painterly texture and softness to the light, even with the strong shadow visible below the table, a really clever use of the marbled glass to capture something different. Shows the range of possibilities with Photography and photographing the real that can be achieved through thought and application.


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Jan 12, 2014 10:50 |  #2391

airfrogusmc wrote in post #16594844 (external link)
I don't think money should even enter into the questioning but does the image make me think? Does it invite me in to participate because the artist trusted my knowledge and me enough to include me? Does it keep showing me more every time I look? Does it make me want to keep coming back to see more?

Again I think there are some prodigies but I think even they have to work at it to become great. Even the greatest still needed the right kind of nurturing. Michael Jordan had great coaches. Adams had Stieglitz, Weston, John Szarkowski and many other great artist of the 20th century.

Totally agree Allen. Bobby Fischer was the greatest chess player that ever lived. Was he a prodigy? Absolutely. He also spent his entire life studying chess. You can't rest on your talent because it will only get you so far.


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Jan 12, 2014 10:56 |  #2392

jetcode wrote in post #16598481 (external link)
Should people who plan on selling their photography create a new thread called Composition and the Arty stuff for money?

No more than that they should start threads called "Portraits of Yorkshire Terriers for Money" or "Coping with High ISO for Money." It's just that whether to sell one's photography is outside the scope of this topic. Some people don't sell their photography. Trying to convince them that they should shoot with possible profit in mind doesn't help them.


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elrey2375
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Jan 12, 2014 10:59 |  #2393

airfrogusmc wrote in post #16597530 (external link)
So you are saying the works of Siskind, Baltz, Haas are without taste?

Awesome content according to who? You want to make pretty pictures that's the absolute easiest thing in the world to do. Just take a look around. I think the real challenge is to make meaningful photographs.

Not saying anything about being a starving artist just talking about creating form a place thats real and not creating to only make money. I have my professional work to feed the beast and it feeds everything nicely. What I sell at exhibits is fine but my commercial work gives me the freedom to not keep creating the same ole same ole just to sell.

The work of these photographers that I mentioned all made meaningful photographs and they were far beyond just picking up a camera ad shooting. If thats all they did they still wouldn't be in the conversation.

And Bresson is probably one of three of the most important photographers of the mid 20th century.

I can't remember the photographer but the quote went something like 'I take pictures because I like the way things look when photographed.' I don't think it's easy to take pretty pictures. Tell that to a landscape photographer or a night photographer who spends all night and day trying to get a particular scene. You can lift up the artful side of photography without simultaneously demeaning the rest of it. Sometimes a photo is just a photo. They won't all be masterpieces.


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airfrogusmc
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Jan 12, 2014 11:56 |  #2394

elrey2375 wrote in post #16599224 (external link)
I can't remember the photographer but the quote went something like 'I take pictures because I like the way things look when photographed.' I don't think it's easy to take pretty pictures. Tell that to a landscape photographer or a night photographer who spends all night and day trying to get a particular scene. You can lift up the artful side of photography without simultaneously demeaning the rest of it. Sometimes a photo is just a photo. They won't all be masterpieces.

Winogrand and heres a couple of really cool pieces I thought might fit here.
This is my fav
http://www.youtube.com​/watch?v=3RM9KcYEYXs (external link)

this is great also
http://www.youtube.com​/watch?v=Tl4f-QFCUek (external link)




  
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jetcode
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Jan 12, 2014 13:31 |  #2395

Winogrand certainly keeps it real.

Everything in photography is relative to ambition, goal, skill, and taste. There are millions of photographers. All levels. I can't imagine anyone who can speak for anyone else. It's impossible. I can imagine having an opinion. And there is no doubt an ample path of opportunity in exploring suggestion, influence, and the art of photography at large.

airfrogusmc wrote in post #16597530 (external link)
And Bresson is probably one of three of the most important photographers of the mid 20th century.

I wonder how Bresson felt about Bresson and whether he considered himself one of three of the most important photographers, etc, etc. It sounds more like idol worship than truth. No doubt these folks were influential. History is filled with influential people. He was there. He shot what he saw. He edited out what didn't work and printed the rest. That is the job of a photographer. Again if you look at his images is it Bresson who makes the image or the subject and setting which make the image? First image below as an example.

http://iconicphotos.wo​rdpress.com/tag/henri-cartier-bresson/ (external link)




  
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airfrogusmc
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Jan 12, 2014 15:09 |  #2396

I doubt he would have liked it but the fact he influenced so many photographers and the fact he is still very relevant as was seen in the big exhibit of his work a couple of years ago. It was an amazing exhibit. Showed the real depth of his vision. Hundreds of his images and a lot of his words.
http://www.moma.org …/calendar/exhib​itions/968 (external link)

And yes it is Bresson that made the work. He was the one that saw the moment and captured. He made the decision of what to turn his camera on, how to frame the shot and when to push the shutter and it was when he saw all of those things he wrote so much about come together.




  
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Jan 12, 2014 15:12 as a reply to  @ jetcode's post |  #2397

If we're to ask if it was Cartier-Bresson who made the image or if it was the subject or the setting, then we have to apply this question to all photographers and photography in general. We can debate the answer (actually I won't), but then by doing so, the potentially circuitous nature of the discussion could too easily distract from explaining why some photographers manage to translate the subject and setting in a more aesthetically appealing way than others, despite equal access to same subject and setting.

Of course, there is the not so trivial matter of being able to recognize that there is a subject and setting worth photographing.

Cartier-Bresson was an excellent photographer, and his catalogue proves that, at least as far as I'm concerned. No one walks away unscathed, and the "master" of any art has his or her critic. And besides, for some folks, it's too tempting to be iconoclastic for its own sake.

But to be sure, Cartier-Bresson had the financial means and time to place himself in propitious positions that most others didn't, and in many situations, luck played a considerable role, as in being at the right place at the right time.

This said, when it comes to framing a scene in a visually compelling manner, Cartier-Bresson was particularly adept, demonstrating a sense of composition and timing that to this day remains exceptional. This isn't idolization; this is just my personal observation. Others are free to disagree.

Also, how many photos he took and then edited out is somewhat irrelevant, since a) you still have to have the aesthetic sensibilities to select the best, and b) lots of photographers take lots of photographs (in this day and age, some probably take as many photos in one day as Cartier-Bresson took in a month on average), but great photography still remains elusive for many despite the high shutter counts.

And from what I've read, Cartier-Bresson really didn't put as much weight in his photography as he did in his sketches. But I'm sure he was aware of the accolades.


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airfrogusmc
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Jan 12, 2014 15:23 |  #2398

I admire a lot of photographers, Bresson is one of many like Frank, Helen Levitt, Callahan, Siskind, Weston, Adams, Evans, DeCarava, Eggleston, Meyerowitz, Lange, Davidson, Erwitt, and so many more but I don't idolize any of them but most that I mentioned have influenced me in one way or another and they are all so very different.

And yes sjones he was a painter and thats what he really loved. In fact IIRC thats all he did in the later years of his life.




  
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Jan 12, 2014 18:55 |  #2399

bugadrienne wrote in post #16597727 (external link)
Those are beautiful images of an empty place! Just the way I like it. The lines and contrast in the first image are lovely! I know what I like but I will leave it to the artsie fartsies to find a deeper meaning.

Thank you


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Jan 12, 2014 18:57 |  #2400

jetcode wrote in post #16597743 (external link)
Nice set. The first one is stunning. I'd hang that on my wall. Nice thematic work with obvious geometries native to the scene. Well done. This will sound crazy but I know one pro with a big name who would have actually swept up the steps and sidewalk in the first image and then shoot it. Either way it's a dandy. A great example of visual seduction. That S curve leads us right to the pier and atmospherics all of which add to a delight in the eye or eye candy.

Thank you. I did think of cloning out the seaweed and then thought, "no, that's one of the things I remember, the smell of the seaweed tossed up on high tides"


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