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FORUMS Sony Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Sony Cameras 
Thread started 05 Nov 2013 (Tuesday) 14:50
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Sony a7(R): Best thing that happened to Canon users this year.

 
Ginga
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Jan 23, 2014 14:52 as a reply to  @ post 16630386 |  #1246

Does anybody know of a good charger for the A7R batteries? A charger that can charge more than one battery at once?.. Like 3.

David Arbogast wrote in post #16630022 (external link)
Sony should at least provide a menu quality option for an uncompressed raw format.

Yeah. I can not understand why they didn't do that.

This is the one thing they really have to include in a firmware update.


Sony A7R * 70-200 2.8L II * 24-70L II * Samyang 14
Recently sold: 5DIII * Sigma 35 *

  
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navydoc
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Jan 23, 2014 16:25 as a reply to  @ Ginga's post |  #1247

Curiosity got the best of me today so I had to try out my EF-S 17-55 lens. This shot is at 17mm and f2.8 (with an EC of -2/3 because I forgot to reset it :confused: ). I forgot to mention that the 17-55 images were auto cropped in camera. The raw files are 4800 x 3200.

Sorry to keep using my patio for tests...it's just so close.;)

IMAGE: http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7313/12108438395_efbd4b68f6_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com …66040953@N03/12​108438395/  (external link)
EF-S 17-55 at 17mm (external link) by navydoc45 (external link), on Flickr

For comparison, here is the same shot using the 17-40 at 17mm. I didn't do any lens correction and only a little rotation to minimize any cropping.

IMAGE: http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5482/12108953585_dee0bcf292_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com …66040953@N03/12​108953585/  (external link)
EF 17-40 at 17mm (external link) by navydoc45 (external link), on Flickr

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Take nothing but photos - leave nothing but footprints - break nothing but silence - kill nothing but time.

  
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navydoc
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Jan 23, 2014 16:43 as a reply to  @ navydoc's post |  #1248

Shot from the same spot but at 55mm.

IMAGE: http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3673/12109076134_c387f189bd_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: http://www.flickr.com …66040953@N03/12​109076134/  (external link)
EF-S 17-55 at 55mm (external link) by navydoc45 (external link), on Flickr

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Take nothing but photos - leave nothing but footprints - break nothing but silence - kill nothing but time.

  
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x_tan
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Jan 23, 2014 20:46 |  #1249

David Arbogast wrote in post #16630022 (external link)
http://www.dpreview.co​m/reviews/sony-alpha-a7 (external link)

DPReview's a7 review is interesting. They reference an issue with the a7(R) that I have had my own suspicions about: posterization caused by Sony's compressed raw format. I have seen some posterization in continuous tone areas of my photos (more than from my 5D III) and wonder if it is due to the compresse raw. Sony should at least provide a menu quality option for an uncompressed raw format.

All-in-all, it's a nice review by DPReview and, all things considered, the a7 is a great best-fit camera for me. :)

Yet, Sony lossy compress ARW file is NOT a RAW file by definition.

Hope a new firmware update can give us a true RAW file for the good or BAD (We never know what we wish for ;))


Canon 5D3 + Zoom (EF 17-40L, 24-105L & 28-300L, 100-400L II) & Prime (24L II, 85L II, 100L, 135L & 200 f/2.8L II; Zeiss 1,4/35)
Sony α7r + Zeiss 1,8/55 FE
Nikon Coolpix A; Nikon F3 & F100 + Zeiss 1,4/50
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David ­ Arbogast
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Jan 23, 2014 22:46 |  #1250

Interesting tests Gene. This camera keeps on surprising. 4800px is still usable.

Tonight I put the TS-E 17mm on. Looks cool and feels great on the a7. Now to find something to capture with it. :)

x_tan wrote in post #16631394 (external link)
Yet, Sony lossy compress ARW file is NOT a RAW file by definition.

Hope a new firmware update can give us a true RAW file for the good or BAD (We never know what we wish for ;))

I hope so too. :)


David | Flickr (external link)
Sony α7R II | CV 12mm, FE 12-24mm, Loxia 21mm, Loxia 35mm, CV 40mm, FE 50mm ZA, Loxia 85mm, Batis 85mm, Batis 135mm

  
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Tony_Stark
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Jan 23, 2014 23:48 |  #1251

Wait, so the Sony A7s don't shoot in a RAW file like say a Canon 6D or a Nikon D600? Or is it Sonys proprietary version of a RAW format but its compressed in a certain way that makes it not 100% RAW like a Canon or Nikon file?


Nikon D810 | 24-70/2.8G | 58/1.4G
EOS M | 22 f/2 STM

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x_tan
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Jan 24, 2014 01:50 |  #1252

Tony_Stark wrote in post #16631824 (external link)
Wait, so the Sony A7s don't shoot in a RAW file like say a Canon 6D or a Nikon D600? Or is it Sonys proprietary version of a RAW format but its compressed in a certain way that makes it not 100% RAW like a Canon or Nikon file?

Seen to me like that.

We have been ripped off by evil Sony as usual :lol::lol::lol:


Canon 5D3 + Zoom (EF 17-40L, 24-105L & 28-300L, 100-400L II) & Prime (24L II, 85L II, 100L, 135L & 200 f/2.8L II; Zeiss 1,4/35)
Sony α7r + Zeiss 1,8/55 FE
Nikon Coolpix A; Nikon F3 & F100 + Zeiss 1,4/50
Retiring  (external link)

  
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nekrosoft13
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Jan 24, 2014 11:59 |  #1253
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anyone here care to contribute on my dilema here?

https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1356057


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David ­ Arbogast
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Jan 24, 2014 13:28 |  #1254

Tony_Stark wrote in post #16631824 (external link)
Wait, so the Sony A7s don't shoot in a RAW file like say a Canon 6D or a Nikon D600? Or is it Sonys proprietary version of a RAW format but its compressed in a certain way that makes it not 100% RAW like a Canon or Nikon file?

Sony calls it "raw", but I do not know how it can be truly raw and be compressed (per dpreview's review it is even a lossy compression).

nekrosoft13 wrote in post #16633031 (external link)
anyone here care to contribute on my dilema here?

https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1356057

Looks like a lot of parts in those scenarios. Your gear situation is too complex and too far different from my own interests for me to provide a meaningful comment. But I wish you well and hope you get your plans sorted out. I'll say this: the a7 is the most fun I've ever had with a camera - and the size, weight, and focusing tools are the reason why. :)


David | Flickr (external link)
Sony α7R II | CV 12mm, FE 12-24mm, Loxia 21mm, Loxia 35mm, CV 40mm, FE 50mm ZA, Loxia 85mm, Batis 85mm, Batis 135mm

  
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jetcode
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Jan 24, 2014 13:33 |  #1255

All raw files are compressed. If you don't believe me shoot a white wall or some low detail subject and shoot a highly detailed subject. You will see that the file sizes differ and that's because lossless compression techniques are deployed which are proprietary. This is done to maximize media space.




  
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Tony_Stark
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Jan 24, 2014 13:36 |  #1256

jetcode wrote in post #16633303 (external link)
All raw files are compressed. If you don't believe me shoot a white wall or some low detail subject and shoot a highly detailed subject. You will see that the file sizes differ and that's because lossless compression techniques are deployed which are proprietary. This is done to maximize media space.

Wouldn't that just be because with more detail the sensor is picking up more information than a white wall with a single feature? Also the file size increases more when higher ISO is used, hence the sensor is picking up more information. So if I shoot a white wall at ISO 100 and ISO 1600, the 1600 file will be larger.


Nikon D810 | 24-70/2.8G | 58/1.4G
EOS M | 22 f/2 STM

Website (external link) | flickr (external link)

  
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David ­ Arbogast
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Jan 24, 2014 13:37 |  #1257

jetcode wrote in post #16633303 (external link)
All raw files are compressed. If you don't believe me shoot a white wall or some low detail subject and shoot a highly detailed subject. You will see that the file sizes differ and that's because lossless compression techniques are deployed which are proprietary. This is done to maximize media space.

Perhaps the problem/issue is that Sony is using a lossy raw file format?


David | Flickr (external link)
Sony α7R II | CV 12mm, FE 12-24mm, Loxia 21mm, Loxia 35mm, CV 40mm, FE 50mm ZA, Loxia 85mm, Batis 85mm, Batis 135mm

  
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jetcode
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Jan 24, 2014 13:46 |  #1258

David Arbogast wrote in post #16633318 (external link)
Perhaps the problem/issue is that Sony is using a lossy raw file format?

Or they have a lossless compression schema that is buggy! I was wondering about that because I heard there are some issues with raw files and color fidelity. The guy at the camera shop was demonstrating a A7r in monochrome. I suspect that Nikon dealt with those issues with algorithms they use to filter out noise that arises from processing color with Bayer filters. In the 5DII there were quirky white dots that would arise on high detailed images because the processor algorithm could not deduce a color and instead resolved the pixel to white. It was an artifact. I do not see that artifact with the d800e however I do see some moire on occasion which takes on one or more artifact like qualities obvious at 100% and higher.




  
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jetcode
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Jan 24, 2014 13:51 |  #1259

Tony_Stark wrote in post #16633316 (external link)
Wouldn't that just be because with more detail the sensor is picking up more information than a white wall with a single feature? Also the file size increases more when higher ISO is used, hence the sensor is picking up more information. So if I shoot a white wall at ISO 100 and ISO 1600, the 1600 file will be larger.

File size is proportional to the ability to reconstruct visible differences. If these differences are minimal compression is optimal. If these differences approach infinity the compression is sub-optimal to the point of writing the data stream in entirety without compression or producing a file size larger than native uncompressed file size.

An increase in ISO typically means the sensor is picking up more noise which can appear to be a difference in tonality when in fact it is noise.

This is the land of voodoo because these algorithms are very complex and often derived on perceptual integrity of the viewer.




  
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nekrosoft13
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Jan 24, 2014 13:53 |  #1260
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what other smart adapter options are there (other then metabones)?


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Sony a7(R): Best thing that happened to Canon users this year.
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