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Thread started 22 Jan 2014 (Wednesday) 20:58
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Canon 70D - First Impressions & Review'ish Thread

 
whothafunk
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Jan 23, 2014 07:55 |  #16

nice review, although most of your real world pictures of that butterfly arent sharp or are focused on a wrong area of it. you either need to work on your shooting or probably the lens is just crap for such things.

and while high ISO looks decent in such good lit rooms, try shooting indoor sports. ISO3200, 4000 if you crop a little, becomes quite crappy.


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hokiealumnus
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Jan 23, 2014 08:10 |  #17

Pretty sure it's my shooting. I'm still getting used to the camera and its auto-focus system. Coming from the less than stellar but very easy to handle AF system on the T3, this is a whole different world. The lenses aren't great, but they are sharp enough, they just hit the wrong spot thanks to the operator.

Believe me, the room was NOT well lit. It may have been better than a dark Gym, but it's not great in there. However, I'll try to shoot in some darker situations and see what happens. :)

EDIT - FWIW, I went back and looked at them and here's what I saw; if I'm not seeing properly, don't hesitate to correct me!

In the first post, the first one, though a heavy crop and not well lit, was focused right on the eye. The second was definitely too far to the rear of the butterfly. The third was dead on the eye, fourth too far rear, fifth dead on eye. There's only one butterfly in the next photo and that one does look missed. After looking at it again, I'm not sure why I posted that one TBH. :p

Anyway, it wasn't too bad, but I missed every butterfly facing away from me; that can only be my fault, without question. IIRC, I was using the 19-point single-shot mode and it caught the rear-end of #2 & #4, then was confused by the wing reflections on #6 (wild guess), or just missed altogether.


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msowsun
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Jan 23, 2014 08:15 |  #18

hokiealumnus wrote in post #16629355 (external link)
The count I'm referring to is the photo naming count. Unless the prior owner reset it, it was sitting at when the camera got to me. I could try EOSInfo (external link)to be sure of course, in case that count has been altered before, but the thing was three months old when I bought it and as you can see above, it was clean as a whistle. All that was done was to pull it out of the box and start taking photos. I don't doubt its newness. But hey, EOSInfo is free, so why not try it, yes? It might be next week, but I'll report back with the result. :)

I agree ~300 is probably the correct count, and even if it wasn't, I wouldn't be concerned.

You should be aware though that the file count sequence can can be easily altered either by accident or by choice. If you insert a used card from another camera, the file count can change or you can also change to any number you want by performing the procedure outlined below.

Chuck Westfall

* An initial file numbering sequence is established by shooting a set of photos.
* Subsequently, a CF card with a higher file numbering sequence is used. The EOS digital SLR resets its internal file numbering system to the new numbering sequence.
* The user wants to revert to the initial file numbering sequence.
If this is the case, then the correct procedure to get back to the original file numbering sequence is going to depend on a couple of conditions.

CONDITION A: The user still has a CF card with images that are exclusively from the initial file numbering sequence, ideally from the end of that sequence.
In this case, use the following procedure:

1. Find a spare CF card that you don't mind formatting.
2. Set the 10D's file numbering setting to Auto Reset.
3. Format the spare CF card. This resets the file numbering sequence to 100-0001.
4. Set the 10D's file numbering sequence to Continuous.
5. Replace the spare CF card with the CF card that has the last image from the initial file numbering sequence. The 10D will resume file numbering from that point.

CONDITION B: The user no longer has a CF card from the original file numbering sequence.
In this case, use the following procedure: (Please note, this procedure requires a card reader.)

1. Find a spare CF card that you don't mind formatting.
2. Set the 10D's file numbering setting to Auto Reset.
3. Format the spare CF card. This resets the file numbering sequence to 100-0001.
4. Set the 10D's file numbering sequence to Continuous.
5. Take a photo on the spare CF card.
6. Remove the CF card from the camera and mount it on your computer's desktop via the card reader.
7. Open the DCIM folder and locate the folder named 100CANON. Open this folder to locate the image named IMG_0001.JPG.
8. Rename the image to the desired sequence number, i.e, one number higher than the last image from the original file numbering sequence. For example, IMG_0238.JPG.
9. Rename the 100CANON folder to the desired folder name. For example: 204CANON.
10. Place the newly renumbered CF card in the 10D and take at least one shot. The camera's file numbering sequence is now reset as originally intended.

A few other tips:

All of this is unnecessary if you decide to rename your files with Canon software such as File Viewer Utility or 3rd-party software with file renaming capabilities.

If you really want to keep the camera's file numbering sequence intact, be very careful to control exactly which CF cards you are using. Only use your own cards with the desired file numbering sequence.

As a matter of general "good housekeeping," consider following this procedure which is slightly amended from one posted here a few weeks ago by Richard Smith:

1. Start by locating the CF card that has the most recent image from the file numbering sequence you wish to preserve. PUT THIS CARD IN A SAFE PLACE AND DON'T LOSE IT.
2. Gather all (ALL!) the rest of your CF cards in one place.
3. Set camera to Auto Reset.
4. Format all (ALL!) the rest of your CF cards.
5. Set camera back to Continuous.


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hokiealumnus
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Jan 23, 2014 08:41 |  #19

Thanks for the detail on that msowsun, that's quite helpful, now and in the future. The SD card I put in it was blank for sure, so the number didn't come from me putting one with images in there. The number definitely came from the prior owner. Hopefully he didn't reset it. I'll check anyway just for the heck of it.


Canon 70D - First Impressions & Review'ish Thread
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Jan 23, 2014 14:17 |  #20

whothafunk wrote in post #16629359 (external link)
nice review, although most of your real world pictures of that butterfly arent sharp or are focused on a wrong area of it. you either need to work on your shooting or probably the lens is just crap for such things.

and while high ISO looks decent in such good lit rooms, try shooting indoor sports. ISO3200, 4000 if you crop a little, becomes quite crappy.


no, it´s not going to be much different from FF at all from any modern crop cameras... Try harder.


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hokiealumnus
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Jan 31, 2014 09:28 |  #21

msowsun wrote in post #16629404 (external link)
I agree ~300 is probably the correct count, and even if it wasn't, I wouldn't be concerned.

You should be aware though that the file count sequence can can be easily altered either by accident or by choice. If you insert a used card from another camera, the file count can change or you can also change to any number you want by performing the procedure outlined below.

Happy to report that it turns out the guy I bought it from didn't reset the photo count as expected, so I really did get it with only ~300 actuations for ~$300 off. Yay!


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Canon 70D - First Impressions & Review'ish Thread
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khwaja
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Feb 01, 2014 23:38 as a reply to  @ post 16629355 |  #22

OP,
Thanks for very nice review and all those ISO comparisons with specific areas to look for.


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hokiealumnus
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Feb 05, 2014 20:39 |  #23

I didn't want to bump the thread just saying thanks, but thanks for your post khwaja. Here is some more hopefully good info. :)

Kingston is sending what they call their "Fastest SDHC/SDXC UHS-I Speed Class 3 (U3) Card for 4K and Ultra-HD Video Capture" (link to page (external link)) for me to have a look at since I have this camera. I'll of course post file transfer speed numbers but more importantly for photography purposes, we'll get to see how much, if any, effect it has on the 70D's ability to shoot more RAW and RAW+JPEG without filling the buffer. As such, I needed to have some comparison numbers!

These were run with a 16GB Transcend Class 6 SDHC card. Class 6 is rated for a minimum 6MB/s transfer speed, making it just on the edge of acceptable for 1080p video, or so Wikipedia tells me (external link). As this camera uses ALL-I format, that may or may not be a problem. So far it hasn't, but I haven't recorded much ALL-I and have the camera set to IPB to save hard drive space. Regardless of video stuff, this is a DSLR, not a video camera, despite its great abilities when shooting video. So what concerns us for the purposes of this thread is a) FPS and b) buffer performance. I'll save info about the new card for when it gets here, but here is the 70D's FPS and buffer performance with a far less than top of the line SDHC card.

You can see the shooting info in the graph, but for reference f/3.5 is wide open aperture on the EF-S 18-135mm IS at 18mm, so that aperture wouldn't slow it down. Obviously all of these numbers will be reduced somewhat in real-world use, but setting the camera like this and shooting with the lens cap on ensures repeatable performance so that you can obtain proper comparison numbers. I didn't note it in the graph, but the lens was set to manual focus.

IMAGE: http://photography.hokiealumnus.com/upload/2014/02/05/20140205210527-4c57e99c.jpg

As you can see, if you shoot in JPEG only mode, the camera does over its rated 7 FPS even with this kind of card. After 15 seconds of shooting, the camera took a total of 108 JPEG shots. As such, I consider the buffer to be not-fill-able when shooting JPEGs. The chances of anyone actually shooting 15 seconds at 7 FPS seem to be slim, so I didn't feel the need to go further and will consider that conclusive.

Once you get to RAW and especially RAW+JPEG, card speed will matter, potentially a lot. The interface can only transfer so fast of course, and after a certain point card speed will be greater than what the camera can transfer, but with a Class 6 card you're seeing just how limited things can get. At the end of the buffer-fill period, it had taken 18 RAW shots and 9 RAW+JPEG shots. After 15 seconds, those numbers were 25 and 17, respectively. Once the buffer fills, you're looking at RAW FPS of .57 FPS and RAW+JPEG of .44 FPS.

When shooting JPEG only, you can get a Class 6 card and be happy. When shooting RAW even, 18 shots before filling the buffer really isn't that bad. It will catch most of anything for any purpose for most people other than maybe dedicated sports or air show shooters. RAW+JPEG? Not so much.

I'm not sure when the Kingston card will arrive nor when I'll get it done, but these numbers should increase with that card. You'll just have to wait and see how much when the time comes. :)

Canon 70D - First Impressions & Review'ish Thread
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lescrane
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Feb 13, 2014 00:11 |  #24

RAW vs. jpg in camera processing: well, I guess the cameras have incredible array of jpg processing, (picture styles) and if your personal style is to want to get preprocessed shots SOOC, that's ok. I do think you are overestimated the difficulty of RAW post processing in Lightroom ACR, etc. (if I can learn it, anyone can!). you just play around w/sliders..

I only do RAW because I don't want to have to decide in advance how I want the "look and feel" of the images to be. With picture styles you can "set it and forget it", but then what happens if your shots are overly sharp or contrasty, for example? You can still do PP on a jpg, but limited. I've been doing RAW since 2003 so it's second nature, but you can manually optimize a file in less than a minute(assuming it doesn't have major problems). So that's my take on it. I'll add that I enjoy sitting in front of the monitor and experimenting w/different renditions of an image...You may not,. that's my take.




  
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hokiealumnus
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Feb 13, 2014 08:25 |  #25

Thanks for sharing your perspective! I might come around to RAW eventually. :)


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Feb 13, 2014 08:42 as a reply to  @ hokiealumnus's post |  #26

Oh I hope you do use RAW eventually, much more latitude. Any there are a lot of good EF-S lenses. I used a 17-40 L and a 10-22 and the 10-22 lens was just as good or better, granted I was using it on a cropper like yours (20D). So the fact that the 17-40 was really made for full frame cameras might have something to do with it.
Its a camera I was considering as well, and I think for your use its a perfect match. Thanks for the review, and If you ever have any questions, don't hesitate to ask here or PM me.


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Feb 13, 2014 08:47 |  #27

hokiealumnus wrote in post #16686201 (external link)
Thanks for sharing your perspective! I might come around to RAW eventually. :)

Try this, change your mode to do raw and JPG. I guarantee you that at some point, you will see your JPG in all its bad white balance or exposure glory, and wish you could do better with the JPG. At this point pull out the raw and do everything there, then save out the JPG. The results will always be better than what you can do with just the JPG.


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hokiealumnus
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Feb 13, 2014 09:40 |  #28

Bsmooth wrote in post #16686236 (external link)
Oh I hope you do use RAW eventually, much more latitude. Any there are a lot of good EF-S lenses. I used a 17-40 L and a 10-22 and the 10-22 lens was just as good or better, granted I was using it on a cropper like yours (20D). So the fact that the 17-40 was really made for full frame cameras might have something to do with it.
Its a camera I was considering as well, and I think for your use its a perfect match. Thanks for the review, and If you ever have any questions, don't hesitate to ask here or PM me.

Thanks for the lens tip, if I need an ultrawide, I'll keep the 10-22 in mind. Thanks for the PM offer as well!

TeamSpeed wrote in post #16686244 (external link)
Try this, change your mode to do raw and JPG. I guarantee you that at some point, you will see your JPG in all its bad white balance or exposure glory, and wish you could do better with the JPG. At this point pull out the raw and do everything there, then save out the JPG. The results will always be better than what you can do with just the JPG.

I've started doing just that in some situations (RAW+JPEG), ones where I think I might want to play around. Most of the time the 70D gets it right, happily so. You're absolutely right that RAW is better to fix mistakes though. With time I'll get better at developing in LR. I still don't see myself developing everything though; too time consuming. If I ever am fortunate enough to get paid for something (nowhere near good enough yet!), it will be RAW+JPEG all the way.


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joeblack2022
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Feb 13, 2014 10:03 |  #29

hokiealumnus wrote in post #16652536 (external link)
thumbnail
Hosted photo: posted by hokiealumnus in
./showthread.php?p=166​52536&i=i20429506
forum: Canon EOS Digital Cameras

Curious about the screenshot you posted, is that a software download or run off the website?


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hokiealumnus
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Feb 13, 2014 10:40 |  #30

Download, which appears to have been removed. You can, however, download it here (external link).


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