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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 24 Mar 2014 (Monday) 02:59
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New slr image count - something's not right!

 
Hogloff
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Mar 26, 2014 20:15 |  #166
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BluePhoton wrote in post #16789079 (external link)
That's fine.

That's it. That's your logic. Taking your ball and going home.




  
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BluePhoton
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Mar 26, 2014 20:16 |  #167
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So who really is the troll here...




  
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Hogloff
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Mar 26, 2014 20:26 |  #168
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BluePhoton wrote in post #16789097 (external link)
So who really is the troll here...

Thoughts so. No real logic.

I suggest you grow up and see how the real world functions.

Bye.




  
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rrblint
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Mar 26, 2014 23:11 |  #169

Hogloff wrote in post #16789008 (external link)
I think Bluephoton is young and very naive just looking for attention. Best not feed this troll.

That's what I said several pages back.:rolleyes:


Mark

  
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flashpoint99
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Mar 26, 2014 23:46 |  #170

57 shutters clicks, at first maybe you had cause to ask. After using it you
now have a proven good camera with 1000 clicks .....Use the damn thing and move on with your life. To take it back now and ask for another camera would be ridiculous
and petty in my opinion.




  
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IainB
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Mar 27, 2014 05:14 |  #171

Frodge wrote in post #16787209 (external link)
I'll take the unopened box every time, and personally don't buy used equipment. (Yes, I have had problems with used lenses in the past). As for test driving, this is why most retailers have a demo out. They aren't supposed to demo every box on the shelf. As I said, new is new, not slightly used. If that's the way you guys feel, I have some new cameras and lenses is like to sell to you that are listed in my signature. All that bein said, I feel this case is a little different at this point. The op has put another 800+ shots through the camera with no problems. How can you go back at this point and:
1) prove you didn't take all of the pictures
2) really care at this point? 58 is a nominal number
3) what is the camera shop supposed to so with the camera now? You have almost 1000 shots on it.....
If you noticed and went back right away, I agree with you all the way. But now, at this point, I say keep it. You're in too deep.

Whatever the 'nominal number' it was arbitrarily decided for me. That is the issue.
I explained at the time I was travelling imminently. The dealer chose not to reveal that the camera was not a mint unit and had been demo'd. Hard to take back from the other side of the world, given that any reasonable person would not have expected jiggery pokery by the dealer. Fair Trading rules in this country take a dim view of misleading a customer, and I could hardly be expected to not take photos on my trip. If the dealer tries to claim that all the actuations are mine they'll be unwisely opening a can of worms.


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IainB
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Mar 27, 2014 05:33 |  #172

TeamSpeed wrote in post #16787324 (external link)
That is not what I got from this that there would be a demand or a mandatory return. I don't see an issue asking for a discount. The retailer may or may not comply, but it can't hurt to ask. They may not give a discount, but might throw in a free battery and memory card, for example. Perhaps I am reading the below statement incorrectly though?

Compensation is the approach I intend to take. I can only repeat. I paid for a mint camera, despite the risks others here have since warned about. I was misled, and sold a camera that was not mint. The dealer let me leave with that unit, knowing that I was travelling overseas.
I've given this dealer a lot of my business so we'll see....


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IainB
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IainB
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Mar 27, 2014 05:42 |  #173

BluePhoton wrote in post #16788804 (external link)
Heck no it's not too late, he still has a return period right?

'Return period' is not something that applies here. We have a Consumer Guarantees Act as well as a very inexpensive Disputes Tribunal. There are strict penalties for misrepresenting items for sale.The CGA is powerful and overrides even guarantees offered by dealers. I'm not about to go thumping the counter and am confident a common sense outcome will be reached, where they avoid unnecessary bad press and lose this customer completely.


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Frodge
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Mar 27, 2014 05:55 |  #174

IainB wrote in post #16789773 (external link)
'Return period' is not something that applies here. We have a Consumer Guarantees Act as well as a very inexpensive Disputes Tribunal. There are strict penalties for misrepresenting items for sale.The CGA is powerful and overrides even guarantees offered by dealers. I'm not about to go thumping the counter and am confident a common sense outcome will be reached, where they avoid unnecessary bad press and lose this customer completely.

Honestly, if I noticed it right off I would have returned it. But after I used it on vacation and put 20x the use on it that it already had, I would feel like a skell bringing it back. But that's just me. Maybe you'll take it back and get a new one with 0 shutter count. Maybe that new one will fail right after 1000 clicks. You lost footing in your argument after you used it. Too bad for you. I'm sure they'll laugh at you when the see the shutter count now. You do realize that 58 is less than two rolls of film.....


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BluePhoton
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Mar 27, 2014 05:55 |  #175
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IainB wrote in post #16789768 (external link)
Compensation is the approach I intend to take. I can only repeat. I paid for a mint camera, despite the risks others here have since warned about. I was misled, and sold a camera that was not mint. The dealer let me leave with that unit, knowing that I was travelling overseas.
I've given this dealer a lot of my business so we'll see....

Definitely you are right on this one!
Who cares how many pictures you took after, the fact remains he misled you and you don't know its history.




  
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Frodge
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Mar 27, 2014 06:01 |  #176

BluePhoton wrote in post #16789784 (external link)
Definitely you are right on this one!
Who cares how many pictures you took after, the fact remains he misled you and you don't know its history.

This kind of behavior is why small "mom and pop" shops no longer exist.


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BluePhoton
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Mar 27, 2014 06:09 |  #177
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Frodge wrote in post #16789788 (external link)
This kind of behavior is why small "mom and pop" shops no longer exist.

Exactly!




  
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Hogloff
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Mar 27, 2014 06:49 |  #178
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IainB wrote in post #16789751 (external link)
Whatever the 'nominal number' it was arbitrarily decided for me. That is the issue.
I explained at the time I was travelling imminently. The dealer chose not to reveal that the camera was not a mint unit and had been demo'd. Hard to take back from the other side of the world, given that any reasonable person would not have expected jiggery pokery by the dealer. Fair Trading rules in this country take a dim view of misleading a customer, and I could hardly be expected to not take photos on my trip. If the dealer tries to claim that all the actuations are mine they'll be unwisely opening a can of worms.

You buying a camera so close to your trip date is your own doing and you taking photos on this trip is your choice. Once you decided to take photos with this camera, especially rattling off 1000 shots...man you own the camera. Do you really feel ethically in your right to go ask for compensation?

That's like ordering a steak at a restaurant, eating it all and then demanding your money back because it was too well done.

Pick up your ego off the floor and enjoy your camera. What exactly would you accomplish by going back to the store and demanding either some compensation or a refund. What damages did you experience for which you are seeking compensation?

Move on in life...you'll cross much bigger issues that need attention. This is a drop of water in the big sea.




  
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TeamSpeed
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Mar 27, 2014 06:57 |  #179

Whatever happens here, I would think no matter the rules in your country, if you showed your proof (as circumstantial as it was, by using file names, using the camera, then later doing a shutter count by a 3rd party tool), once they looked at 57 shots on the camera, vs the 1000+ that most likely is on it now, they would probably ask at least a couple of questions:

- Did you do a shutter count immediately after taking a shot and noticing the filename?
- Why did you continue to use the camera with so much use after the fact?

Wouldn't a logical ethical review board or person ask these questions in their basis for ruling?

Hogloff has a good analogy. You order a steak medium rare, you get your steak, you take a couple of bites, notice it is well done, eat a majority of the steak, then take a picture or two of the remainder for proof, then continue on with your entire meal. Later you go back and show pictures and ask for a refund or a discount... Obviously the question would be "why didn't you let us know sooner so we could remedy it with a replacement". The answer of "well everyone else was eating and I really needed to eat too, and don't have the time to allow you to remedy it" isn't really a good answer.

The fact someone was on a trip needing a camera has zero bearing on this situation. The conditions that led to a purchase to begin with, or the reasons it was used afterwards play no part in the law, I am quite sure. That became a personal choice that was made to continue using the camera.

EDIT: Devil's advocate argument follows... :)

However, they could very well rule on the original event itself as well (the sale), and throw out all other factors, since whatever happened after the initial sale is irrelevant. If that is the case, then I would assume they would say "you own the camera based on usage", but then order a discounted refund from the seller. In the steak analogy, the restaurant certainly owes you what you ordered, regardless of what happened to the food after it was dropped off. So they would owe you a partial refund for the steak portion, since you didn't give them their "merchandise" back and actually "consumed" it while knowing its state. I can actually see it both ways.

I am curious on what happens now. This would be a good business ethics topic for a class. I certainly hope the shop provides something to you at least, in the interests of customer service, if nothing else.

Another question though... If shops obtain new stock from suppliers, how are they to know what counts are on each camera? Perhaps they truly though that the camera was never taken out of the box? You cannot take all your cameras from various suppliers, and open them up to test them.


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Duckhunter250
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Mar 27, 2014 08:51 as a reply to  @ IainB's post |  #180

What "compensation" would you think is reasonable for 58 shutter releases that you didn't get to make?



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New slr image count - something's not right!
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