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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 25 Apr 2014 (Friday) 13:34
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Canon 100-400L vs. Tamron 200-500

 
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Limbwalker
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Apr 28, 2014 21:36 |  #76

I think this is the part where I'm supposed to say... "I'm not impressed," right? LOL.

TeamSpeed, you're clearly more experienced at digital SLR photography than I am (I'm sure most of the forum regulars here are), and your explanations make perfect sense. However, I probably represent 90% of the users of these two lenses in the market, so what I did to compare the two lenses is most likely what most consumers would have done as well. Which is why I say the comparison does have some merit.

Nobody has commented yet on why the L lens would have created slower shutter speeds and wider apertures? And no, there was no filter on it. That was the first thing I checked when he handed it to me.

As for motion blur, how do you explain the sharpness of the hand-held tamron images without IS compared to the L lens with it?


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1Tanker
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Apr 28, 2014 21:47 as a reply to  @ Limbwalker's post |  #77

How can you not have all the answers already? I mean, you were shooting longgg before most of us were even born.

You must be amazing. :rolleyes:

Go back and actually "READ" Teamspeeds answers, and you shouldn't have anymore questions.


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Apr 28, 2014 22:17 |  #78

Limbwalker wrote in post #16868531 (external link)
I probably represent 90% of the users of these two lenses in the market, so what I did to compare the two lenses is most likely what most consumers would have done as well. Which is why I say the comparison does have some merit.

Is there some super-telephoto zoom demographic report somewhere that I'm not aware of? Could it really be true that 90% of people who spend $1000-$1500 on a sports/wildlife lens are using P or the green box?

You might be correct, but I have a feeling this is a guess. I have a different guess.

Limbwalker wrote in post #16868531 (external link)
Nobody has commented yet on why the L lens would have created slower shutter speeds and wider apertures? And no, there was no filter on it. That was the first thing I checked when he handed it to me.

Well, the lens has no part in the decision. It reports its current focal length and focus position. The body uses this information in conjunction with metering and focus point information to send an aperture and focus changes to the lens. It's possible that Tamron hasn't perfectly reverse-engineered the interface, or that Canon just doesn't want the Tamron at full aperture for some reason.

Really I see two possibilities: either the lighting changed, or the body is choosing differently because they are different lenses.

The point of this being that you can control aperture and shutter speed, and for any technical testing, it's a good idea to control what you can for repeatable and reliable results.


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Limbwalker
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Apr 28, 2014 22:17 |  #79

1Tanker wrote in post #16868562 (external link)
How can you not have all the answers already? I mean, you were shooting longgg before most of us were even born.

You must be amazing. :rolleyes:

Go back and actually "READ" Teamspeeds answers, and you shouldn't have anymore questions.

I don't understand how this ^^ isn't trolling...
The level of sarcasm and "one-upmanship" on this forum is unparalleled. It's as if guys stand in line here to look smarter than the next. What's up with that?

Teamspeed did contribute some good information. But a few of my questions have gone unanswered. However, due to the tone of the majority of the members, it appears I have entered some sort of elite club without permission. I'll just crawl back in the hole I came out of, and go happily shoot my photos for myself and my friends to enjoy. Since, unlike most here, I don't make my living with a camera. Or even try to convince others that I do.


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Limbwalker
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Apr 28, 2014 22:21 |  #80

Is there some super-telephoto zoom demographic report somewhere that I'm not aware of? Could it really be true that 90% of people who spend $1000-$1500 on a sports/wildlife lens are using P or the green box?

You might be correct, but I have a feeling this is a guess. I have a different guess.

In my work, I regularly come across birders who tote 100-400L's as well as 400 5.6 and 300 4's. I can assure you they don't know diddly crap about photography, but they do know that the white lenses are supposed to be "special" so they buy them. And yea, they put their cameras on the green box and go. My sample size is in the hundreds, just in the past couple of years. I stopped asking photography questions of these people many years ago. They are not photographers. They are birders who use their expensive gear to capture shots for the purpose of identification.

You might just be surprised how most of these lenses are actually used.


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Apr 28, 2014 22:23 |  #81

Limbwalker wrote in post #16868628 (external link)
The level of sarcasm and "one-upmanship" on this forum is unparalleled. It's as if guys stand in line here to look smarter than the next. What's up with that?

Teamspeed did contribute some good information. But a few of my questions have gone unanswered. However, due to the tone of the majority of the members, it appears I have entered some sort of elite club without permission. I'll just crawl back in the hole I came out of, and go happily shoot my photos for myself and my friends to enjoy. Since, unlike most here, I don't make my living with a camera. Or even try to convince others that I do.

You've said that many times, in your threads.. but your desire to troll gets the better of you. Stick to your word, for once!


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Limbwalker
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Apr 28, 2014 22:24 |  #82

How does one close a thread on this forum?


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TeamSpeed
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Apr 28, 2014 22:28 |  #83

Again to answer you:

1) You just made up some stats, you don't represent 90% of the users. If you had used green box mode, you might be closer to the truth. P mode? Nope...

2) In P mode, YOU chose the wrong combination, not the camera. In P mode, it creates a list of shutter/aperture settings, and you get to choose amongst them by spinning the dial by the shutter button. Some are good options, some are bad. You chose poorly. You need to learn how P mode works. Green box chooses just 1 combination for you, you don't get to cycle through different options.

www.techhive.com/artic​le/235024/digital_focu​s.html (external link) wrote:
=http://www.techhive.co​m …35024/digital_f​ocus.html] (external link)
But if you're in Program mode, by turning the dial or pressing an arrow button on your camera, you can choose from among other valid shutter speed/aperture combinations. If you want to slow the shutter speed to introduce motion blur, there's no need to switch to Shutter Priority; just spin the dial (or press the arrows or rocker switch) in Program mode. Likewise, if you want to increase the depth of field, move the controls in the opposite direction. If you're not sure how to tweak the Program mode on your camera, check your user guide for details. As you might surmise, you don't necessarily need to use Aperture or Shutter Priority modes as long as you remember that Program mode works this way.

3. 2 stop IS is quite old and won't really save you if you are careless on how you hold your combination. Since you had hardly any time to play with the lens, and have no experience as such, most likely you were careless in how you held the combination, and 2 stop IS (which in my experience is really just 1 stop) wasn't enough.

You had no experience with the lens, you don't seem to know how P mode works, you assume you know how everything works, and how everyone else works, and you assumed wrong. Nothing wrong with that, just admit it and move on. Again, you were the deciding factor in the results, and not the lenses.


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Apr 28, 2014 22:33 |  #84

Limbwalker wrote in post #16868639 (external link)
In my work, I regularly come across birders who tote 100-400L's as well as 400 5.6 and 300 4's. I can assure you they don't know diddly crap about photography, but they do know that the white lenses are supposed to be "special" so they buy them. And yea, they put their cameras on the green box and go. My sample size is in the hundreds, just in the past couple of years. I stopped asking photography questions of these people many years ago. They are not photographers. They are birders who use their expensive gear to capture shots for the purpose of identification.

You might just be surprised how most of these lenses are actually used.

Interesting indeed. The "dad with a camera" of the wildlife world, I suppose.


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Apr 28, 2014 22:38 as a reply to  @ TeamSpeed's post |  #85

OT but... I've never used Auto, P, Av or Tv. I simply don't see the benefit over Manual. I have the top dial for shutter, back dial for aperture, and hold SET + top dial for ISO. Aperture is usually set before I begin metering. Meter, check histogram, tweak. Rinse, lather, repeat. Just don't understand the other settings. If I used strobes I'd probably be less stringent about aperture?

Anyway, entertaining thread, please continue :)




  
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Apr 28, 2014 22:56 |  #86

Hike, if you shot wildlife, manual is near useless. When I shot medium format film, I only shot manual. When I shot B&W film, again, only manual. But shooting moving wildlife and birds with a long tele in constantly changing conditions with constantly changing backgrounds? Not something one can do in manual. So, I purposely shot these two lenses EXACTLY how I would have used them in the real world. And you see what I got.

I really don't know what else to say. Some here seem hell-bent on telling me how wrong I am, how dumb I am, what a pathetic photographer I am, etc. To those, I say get a life. If you feel compelled to do this then it may be you that have the problems. Just move along and don't waste either of our time.

I figured the comparison would be interesting to some folks. Who knew the amateur photography was a full-contact endeavor? ha, ha. Birders are positively tame by comparison.


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Apr 28, 2014 23:01 as a reply to  @ Limbwalker's post |  #87

Really? Really?

I see you like golfing. Do you go onto a golfing forum, and tell everyone how your 70 year old Persimmon's are as good or better than their new Big Bertha's.. simply because you use them how you do? "I can get 150 yards.. straight as a rope.. with my "woods". Your big huge $500 driver can't get any straighter, therefore it isn't any better?" How do you think that would turn out?


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Apr 28, 2014 23:03 |  #88

Limbwalker wrote in post #16868709 (external link)
Hike, if you shot wildlife, manual is near useless. When I shot medium format film, I only shot manual. When I shot B&W film, again, only manual. But shooting moving wildlife and birds with a long tele in constantly changing conditions with constantly changing backgrounds? Not something one can do in manual. So, I purposely shot these two lenses EXACTLY how I would have used them in the real world. And you see what I got.

I really don't know what else to say. Some here seem hell-bent on telling me how wrong I am, how dumb I am, what a pathetic photographer I am, etc. To those, I say get a life. If you feel compelled to do this then it may be you that have the problems. Just move along and don't waste either of our time.

I figured the comparison would be interesting to some folks. Who knew the amateur photography was a full-contact endeavor? ha, ha.

I was staying out of this food fight, the test has flaws but if it means something to you somehow thats fine. But the bold above is absurd.




  
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Apr 28, 2014 23:09 as a reply to  @ Limbwalker's post |  #89

I think what you've ran up against is the fact that this is a Canon lens forum and as such the expectations for a sharpness test would be to conduct a more scientific one. I won't discount your tests, you've found them helpful so I guess that's really all that matters.

I will add that for a real world test, I would want more than 10-15 minutes. I'd want at least a day out and about shooting the normal stuff I like to shoot. If this gentlemen lived far away and 10-15 minutes was really all you had to seal the deal, or not, then I suppose you did all that you could. Still, I'd consider any conclusion drawn in such a short time to be more of a snap judgement. I could see if the IQ differences were huge, but they aren't, and in all fairness the settings are different. Why did the camera meter differently for the different lenses? Who knows. Tough to tell in 10-15 minutes.

If possible, you guys should swap lenses for a longer period of time, just to help you get a better feel for the lens. I'm not going to claim the Canon must be better because it's Canon, but give it a fair shot if possible. I'd hate for you to pass up an opportunity on a good deal. Also, consider that MFA might be needed, bodies and lenses can vary.




  
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Apr 28, 2014 23:11 |  #90

To the OP.
1. I'm glad you like your Tamron 200-500 lens. I'm sure there are other owners of that lens that feel the same way.
2. I appreciate that you made an attempt at comparing it to the 100-400 lens, which would be helpful to those that may be interested in this info.
3. Unfortunately, your test methods left a lot to be desired and were found faulty (P mode won't fly). But still a nice try on your part none the less.
4. Constructive criticism was attempted and you did not respond well, assuming that your test methods were spot on.
5. It's ok to be wrong, I'm wrong quite often :lol:
6. I'm not a Canon fanboy, I own two Tamron lenses as well as the 100-400. Great lens all if I do my part.


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Canon 100-400L vs. Tamron 200-500
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