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FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre General Photography Talk 
Thread started 13 May 2014 (Tuesday) 16:30
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Well it happened again!

 
flashpoint99
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May 13, 2014 16:30 |  #1

Its getting pretty old being questioned/accused ect about my actions while holding a pro style DSLR with a big lens.
Last weekend I am at a Dance Comp shooting for our team as I have done for the last 3 years. I have permission from the Dance Comp Organizer,and the team owner that non flash photography is allowed. Not only for Pros but the public in general such as Moms and Dads ect.. I am about three dances in when a rent a cop type security officer working for the venue (not the organizer) sits down next to me (and my wife by the way) and states " excuse me ! You are not supposed to be taking photographs. Are you with this group?" me: " Yes I do have permission to shoot today and what group are you refering too" sec:"This group"
as he points to the Judges in front of me. me: I am not a part of the company putting on the this dance comp however I do have an email conversation with the director of this comp that states photography is allowed at this venue, Would you like to see it?" sec: no.... Ok ! He leaves. During a break I ask a employye of the dance comp if they had an issue with people taking photos of the dance comp. They assured me it was allowed and they never directed any one from the security team otherwise. Later I find out from another Dad of a dancer that the same sec officer was going up to anyone who had a full size DLSR with a big lens and telling them they could not shoot photographs. meanwhile never questioning the other people where video taping and taking picks with their phones, Ipads and compact cameras. Seriously WTF! I guess its now a crime to hold a DSLR with a 200mm lens and take a picture.




  
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benji25
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May 13, 2014 16:44 |  #2

Because pedophiles don't carry point and shoots....


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Wilt
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May 13, 2014 16:55 |  #3

To paraphrase an oldie by Buffalo Springfield....

"Paranoia strikes deep, into your life it will creep"
"Pedophelia strikes deep, into your life it will creep"


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Fligi7
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May 13, 2014 17:24 |  #4

It's not a crime, it's an attempt at regulating and controlling competition photos. Seems like a classic case of the organizers and security staff attempting to do their best to ensure no one is photographing without explicit consent. I'd be very happy if that was the largest issue I dealt with in photographing sports competitions. You will consistently get that at large multi-team competitions, especially at venues not directly owned by one of the performing teams.




  
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flashpoint99
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May 13, 2014 17:29 |  #5

Fligi7 wrote in post #16902421 (external link)
It's not a crime, it's an attempt at regulating and controlling competition photos. Seems like a classic case of the organizers and security staff attempting to do their best to ensure no one is photographing without explicit consent. I'd be very happy if that was the largest issue I dealt with in photographing sports competitions. You will consistently get that at large multi-team competitions, especially at venues not directly owned by one of the performing teams.

I get the Comp organizers want to make $ off of their own photographer. However this was a Comp with no hired pro and it was stated to me persoanally from the director herself that I could shoot. Apparently the rent a cop took it upon himself to decide pro cameras where not allowed. Ive shot Dance comps for three years and not until this year had I even been approached. Now its twice ,both times I 've had proof of consent and that has pretty much saved my shoot!




  
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Fligi7
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May 13, 2014 18:01 |  #6

Well, I'm not sure what kind of events you typically work, but that is in no way surprising to me that rented security was not well-read into who the specific allowed photographers were and weren't.

I guess I just don't understand why it's so apparently offensive to you. The guard simply was not aware that you were authorized. You informed him of the former and that was that. He left you alone once he was made aware. Maybe I'm missing some undertones or implications.

Like I said, I get approached all the time by various parents, coaches, staff, you name it at large competitions with multiple teams like this as everyone is trying to regulate things as best as possible. You just simply inform them that you're authorized and be prepared to provide proof or a PoC they can speak with to corroborate your story. And, that's that. I see this as a success story, that you had to do nothing further once you informed the guard of your authorization and your shooting was in no way further hindered. The guard could have easily continued to badger you or force you to take further time away from shooting.

Just MHO, though, based on my experiences.




  
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AZGeorge
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May 13, 2014 18:43 |  #7

I've had similar encounters over the years with individuals, private security and law enforcement at local and federal levels. All were resolved without serious problem and most as smoothly as for the OP. Staying calm and being reasonable seems to be the charm.


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flashpoint99
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May 13, 2014 20:24 |  #8

Fligi7 wrote in post #16902507 (external link)
Well, I'm not sure what kind of events you typically work, but that is in no way surprising to me that rented security was not well-read into who the specific allowed photographers were and weren't.

I guess I just don't understand why it's so apparently offensive to you. The guard simply was not aware that you were authorized. You informed him of the former and that was that. He left you alone once he was made aware. Maybe I'm missing some undertones or implications.

Like I said, I get approached all the time by various parents, coaches, staff, you name it at large competitions with multiple teams like this as everyone is trying to regulate things as best as possible. You just simply inform them that you're authorized and be prepared to provide proof or a PoC they can speak with to corroborate your story. And, that's that. I see this as a success story, that you had to do nothing further once you informed the guard of your authorization and your shooting was in no way further hindered. The guard could have easily continued to badger you or force you to take further time away from shooting.

Just MHO, though, based on my experiences.

Offensive isn't exactly the term I would use however he was rude and acusatory right from the start of the conversation. Sorry his tone doesn't come across in print. He left me alone because I didn't back down and called his bluff. I had written proof and therefore he had no choice but to take his attitude elsewhere. I informed him,he left yes but that wasn't that....After he left me he continued to harass and tell other people they were not allowed to shoot. BUT only people with a dslr and a big lens attached. It was an open Comp meaning all non flash photography was allowed. One dad put his camera away thinking he wasn't allowed to shoot. It was only later after he missed his daughters dance did he find out that was not the case. I am the studio photographer so I always make sure to cross the T s and dot the I s for this very reason. He knew damn well after talking to me that shooting was allowed by the dance comp organizers. Why he decided big lenses were suddenly banned is beyond me.




  
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panicatnabisco
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May 13, 2014 20:49 |  #9

I'd probably ask for a media badge or make one next time


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spyderpig
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May 13, 2014 21:10 |  #10

panicatnabisco wrote in post #16902838 (external link)
I'd probably ask for a media badge or make one next time

What about all the other parents who have a DSLR?


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flashpoint99
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May 14, 2014 13:12 |  #11

spyderpig wrote in post #16902880 (external link)
What about all the other parents who have a DSLR?

They are going to have to register their DLSR and go through a 3 day waiting period before they can use it pending a background check. Remember Cameras dont take pictures, people do!;)




  
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Nieman
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May 14, 2014 14:31 |  #12

Must be nice no camera are allowed at any of my kids Dance Comp. Only practice.


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Eiro
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May 14, 2014 14:46 |  #13

I guess to CYA you just need to have the point of contact who is in charge of all of this and get a letter which you can have as easy as 1,2,3 of showing it to them on your phone from the email you've received confirming its all good from the HBIC. And then smile and say moving right along where I can do what I came here to do.

flashpoint99 wrote in post #16902325 (external link)
Its getting pretty old being questioned/accused ect about my actions while holding a pro style DSLR with a big lens.
Last weekend I am at a Dance Comp shooting for our team as I have done for the last 3 years. I have permission from the Dance Comp Organizer,and the team owner that non flash photography is allowed. Not only for Pros but the public in general such as Moms and Dads ect.. I am about three dances in when a rent a cop type security officer working for the venue (not the organizer) sits down next to me (and my wife by the way) and states " excuse me ! You are not supposed to be taking photographs. Are you with this group?" me: " Yes I do have permission to shoot today and what group are you refering too" sec:"This group"
as he points to the Judges in front of me. me: I am not a part of the company putting on the this dance comp however I do have an email conversation with the director of this comp that states photography is allowed at this venue, Would you like to see it?" sec: no.... Ok ! He leaves. During a break I ask a employye of the dance comp if they had an issue with people taking photos of the dance comp. They assured me it was allowed and they never directed any one from the security team otherwise. Later I find out from another Dad of a dancer that the same sec officer was going up to anyone who had a full size DLSR with a big lens and telling them they could not shoot photographs. meanwhile never questioning the other people where video taping and taking picks with their phones, Ipads and compact cameras. Seriously WTF! I guess its now a crime to hold a DSLR with a 200mm lens and take a picture.


Get out and shoot

  
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banquetbear
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May 14, 2014 14:57 |  #14

flashpoint99 wrote in post #16902325 (external link)
Its getting pretty old being questioned/accused ect about my actions while holding a pro style DSLR with a big lens.
Last weekend I am at a Dance Comp shooting for our team as I have done for the last 3 years. I have permission from the Dance Comp Organizer,and the team owner that non flash photography is allowed. Not only for Pros but the public in general such as Moms and Dads ect.. I am about three dances in when a rent a cop type security officer working for the venue (not the organizer) sits down next to me (and my wife by the way) and states " excuse me ! You are not supposed to be taking photographs. Are you with this group?" me: " Yes I do have permission to shoot today and what group are you refering too" sec:"This group"
as he points to the Judges in front of me. me: I am not a part of the company putting on the this dance comp however I do have an email conversation with the director of this comp that states photography is allowed at this venue, Would you like to see it?" sec: no.... Ok ! He leaves. During a break I ask a employye of the dance comp if they had an issue with people taking photos of the dance comp. They assured me it was allowed and they never directed any one from the security team otherwise. Later I find out from another Dad of a dancer that the same sec officer was going up to anyone who had a full size DLSR with a big lens and telling them they could not shoot photographs. meanwhile never questioning the other people where video taping and taking picks with their phones, Ipads and compact cameras. Seriously WTF! I guess its now a crime to hold a DSLR with a 200mm lens and take a picture.

...look: venues have rules. The event organisers may well have been happy for you to take photos but many venues have "no photography allowed" as a default rule. Ask the organisers to let the venue know photography is allowed. Venue tells security, problem solved. The guy was just doing his job.

Why he decided big lenses were suddenly banned is beyond me.

Because he was probably working to instructions. Stop getting angry over this and do something to make sure it doesn't happen next time.


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flashpoint99
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May 14, 2014 16:42 |  #15

banquetbear wrote in post #16904350 (external link)
...look: venues have rules. The event organisers may well have been happy for you to take photos but many venues have "no photography allowed" as a default rule. Ask the organisers to let the venue know photography is allowed. Venue tells security, problem solved. The guy was just doing his job.

Because he was probably . Stop getting angry over this and do something to make sure it doesn't happen next time.

I have to ask. Did you even read the entire thread and all that was done to insure I was covered before your response? my guess would be no but thats only a guess. If you did then please tell me what more I could have done to prevent this guy from doing what he did? Maybe I should have gotten up on stage and held a quick 2 minute class for him? ;)In case you missed it he continued to harrass others AFTER he spoke to me and knew photgraphy was allowed. He didnt stop me from shooting, He went on his way to play COP and stop others (with a DSLR and a big len ONLY) who didnt know any better. If he was indeed " working to instructions" as you claim then he would have stopped me! Basically he was an @ss with a rent a cop attitude plain and simple. It was pretty obvious that photography was allowed due to the 50 Moms and Dads taking photos with all sorts of different cameras and equipment.




  
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