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FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting 
Thread started 16 Dec 2013 (Monday) 13:40
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YN-E3-RT | my first impressions

 
tongki
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May 29, 2014 09:47 |  #271

dmward wrote in post #16897281 (external link)
Rand,
You may have hit the nail on the head. I've got 4 600EX-RTs at the moment. So, I too have no immediate need for the YN version. Would like to see how well it works as an add-on.

Hi David,
I had no interest on 600EX or YN version also,
Lithium battery on Ving 860 a lot more better than stupid AA

unless,
YN make a smart move by using Lithium batteries on their new YN
and compatible to RT also, that will be a speedlite BIG WAR , hahaha :D


EOS 70D x 2 units + EOS 7D mark II x3 units
Newton FR3, Newton modified bracket, EF 17-40mm x4,EF 24-70mm f/2.8 x2, EF 70-200mm f/2.8 x2
Quantum Trio x2, T5D-R x1 + FW7Q x1, CoPilot x2, Godox AD-180 x5
Propac PB960 head x12, PB960 battery x10
sorry, no stupid speedlite from Canon !

  
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Badgerballs
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May 29, 2014 14:36 |  #272

dmward wrote in post #16531981 (external link)
HERE (external link) is my blog post with more information.

Bottom Line
A) it delivers autofocus assist light capabilities
B) it work in Gr mode with pre-2012 cameras
C) it is easy to update firmware via the USB connection

I think Canon may have just sold their last ST-E3-RT.

I should probably have put mine on the sale forum before I made this post. :-)

I have just read your brilliant review, I have just bought an YN-E3-RT and installed the latest 1.10 bios. I have also bought one 600ex-rt and take delivery of the 2nd one tomorrow. I have a question...I have been using ETTL mode with YN as Master and EX as Slave...it works fine BUT when you alter the FEC on the YN i.e. -1 is it supposed to alter the scale on the EX as well or does it just send the info to it and do the job. I only ask as my EX FEC scale doesn't alter, but the ETTL seems bang on when I take the shot.


"Try shooting badgers, creep up in the dark, they hear the shutter, the flash goes off, they run, and what's the shot... "Badgerballs" !!!!
The difference between good and bad photographers is: Good photographers don't show their bad photos.

  
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dmward
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May 30, 2014 10:57 |  #273

When I did the testing I didn't pay close attention to the FEC scale on the speedlites.
I did discover that the FEC is additive. So, if you use the FEC to create a lighting ratio between groups in Gr mode, then use the FEC scale on the camera to move the overall exposure up or down. Comes in handy with portraits or during wedding receptions and other events.


David | Sharing my Insights, Knowledge & Experience (external link) | dmwfotos website (external link)

  
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Badgerballs
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May 30, 2014 18:47 |  #274

dmward wrote in post #16940342 (external link)
When I did the testing I didn't pay close attention to the FEC scale on the speedlites.
I did discover that the FEC is additive. So, if you use the FEC to create a lighting ratio between groups in Gr mode, then use the FEC scale on the camera to move the overall exposure up or down. Comes in handy with portraits or during wedding receptions and other events.

Yep got my second 600ex-rt today. I notice that in GR mode when you set GR A to Manual and alter the FOL (Flash Output Level) say 1/128 then hit the test button on the YN it changes the level on the EX scale. I can't seem to get the same effect on FEC or FEB. What's the situation with Zoom. Is it disabled when the flashes are off the camera?


"Try shooting badgers, creep up in the dark, they hear the shutter, the flash goes off, they run, and what's the shot... "Badgerballs" !!!!
The difference between good and bad photographers is: Good photographers don't show their bad photos.

  
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agv8or
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May 30, 2014 19:47 |  #275

Badgerballs wrote in post #16938629 (external link)
I have just read your brilliant review, I have just bought an YN-E3-RT and installed the latest 1.10 bios. I have also bought one 600ex-rt and take delivery of the 2nd one tomorrow. I have a question...I have been using ETTL mode with YN as Master and EX as Slave...it works fine BUT when you alter the FEC on the YN i.e. -1 is it supposed to alter the scale on the EX as well or does it just send the info to it and do the job. I only ask as my EX FEC scale doesn't alter, but the ETTL seems bang on when I take the shot.

Badgerballs wrote in post #16941175 (external link)
Yep got my second 600ex-rt today. I notice that in GR mode when you set GR A to Manual and alter the FOL (Flash Output Level) say 1/128 then hit the test button on the YN it changes the level on the EX scale. I can't seem to get the same effect on FEC or FEB. What's the situation with Zoom. Is it disabled when the flashes are off the camera?

The FEC scale on a Slave flash is only for the FEC entered directly into that individual Slave using the controls on the Slave. The flash power or FEC sent from the Master is not shown on a Slaves display in ETTL Wireless shooting. The individual Slave FEC feature is only available when using ETTL in the Wireless ETTL or <Gr> modes or when using Ext A in <Gr> mode (it is not available when using a Slave in any Manual Wireless mode). The individual Slave FEC is not part of any ETTL calculations by the camera but rather the last calculation and it is either additive or subtractive depending on +/- FEC setting. In other words an individual Slave can alter any FEC information sent to it from the Master by entering an FEC directly into that Slave. Although this FEC effects only this individual flash, it can alter the overall flash exposure. Note: an individual Slave FEC should not be confused with the "Individual Slave" function which is not available in Wireless RT but only available in Wireless Optical where as the individual Slave FEC is available for use in both Wireless configurations.

FEC dialed into either the Camera or the Master (excluding FEC entered into the individual Slave groups in the <Gr> mode) is a Global FEC and raises or lowers the overall flash exposure after the initial ETTL calculations depending on the Wireless mode set in the Master. Two things to remember is that the Master FEC overrides any FEC dialed into the camera and the FEC dialed into the individual Slave groups, in the <Gr> mode, is additive (this has been previously discussed on pgs 2 and 3 in this thread https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1358869 ).

The zoom settings are entered directly into each individual Slave flash when using Wireless configurations so you will need to press the zoom button and select a manual zoom setting for each Slave flash.


Rand

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swldstn
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May 30, 2014 19:56 |  #276

dmward wrote in post #16864525 (external link)
Yes it will.
There is a Legacy mode in the custom functions menu. I think it was added in firmware 1.09
It eliminates the problem with changing power settings on the YN-E3 with it in the hot shoe of a non-Canon camera.

I use this capability with my X system cameras. Works like a charm.
The documented approach is to set the YN-E3 to Gr mode and then set each group to manual and set power. Then press the test button to send the power settings to the speedlites.

Another option that works, but is not supported is to have an ST-E3 or YN-E3 on a Canon camera in ETTL mode, when the camera fires it sets the power in the speedlites via ETTL.
Then, fire the speedlites with the X system with the same aperture and ISO settings and get the same exposure.

I've played around with this at wedding receptions and it works.

Obviously the documented approach works well and makes the 600EX speedlites into remotely controlled manual lights which is a good thing for those of us with a second camera kit.

This is exactly why I bought the YN-E3-RT. With dmward's help I now have my 3 Canon 600EX-RT working with the YN-E3-RT controlling them on my Fuji X-T1. The YN-E3-RT now provides me with remote power control for manual shooting. It saved me from buying new flashes to use with my Fuji rig. So for the cost of one V850+FT16 trigger I have three flashes working with Fuji.


Steve Waldstein
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WillMass
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May 30, 2014 22:29 |  #277

agv8or wrote in post #16941272 (external link)
The FEC scale on a Slave flash is only for the FEC entered directly into that individual Slave using the controls on the Slave. The flash power or FEC sent from the Master is not shown on a Slaves display in ETTL Wireless shooting. The individual Slave FEC feature is only available when using ETTL in the Wireless ETTL or <Gr> modes or when using Ext A in <Gr> mode (it is not available when using a Slave in any Manual Wireless mode). The individual Slave FEC is not part of any ETTL calculations by the camera but rather the last calculation and it is either additive or subtractive depending on +/- FEC setting. In other words an individual Slave can alter any FEC information sent to it from the Master by entering an FEC directly into that Slave. Although this FEC effects only this individual flash, it can alter the overall flash exposure. Note: an individual Slave FEC should not be confused with the "Individual Slave" function which is not available in Wireless RT but only available in Wireless Optical where as the individual Slave FEC is available for use in both Wireless configurations.

FEC dialed into either the Camera or the Master (excluding FEC entered into the individual Slave groups in the <Gr> mode) is a Global FEC and raises or lowers the overall flash exposure after the initial ETTL calculations depending on the Wireless mode set in the Master. Two things to remember is that the Master FEC overrides any FEC dialed into the camera and the FEC dialed into the individual Slave groups, in the <Gr> mode, is additive (this has been previously discussed on pgs 2 and 3 in this thread https://photography-on-the.net …/showthread.php​?t=1358869 ).

The zoom settings are entered directly into each individual Slave flash when using Wireless configurations so you will need to press the zoom button and select a manual zoom setting for each Slave flash.

Gah, I'm just gonna go back to manual. lol


You can only fish for so long before you gotta throw a stick of dynamite in the water. :cool:

  
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dmward
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May 30, 2014 23:20 |  #278

Rand,
Nice description of FEC with the 600EX system. I can't remember the last time I used my 600EX-RTs off camera in anything but Gr mode. Thanks for clarifying that some FEC features only work the way I described in Gr. I have a tendency to forget that there is any other setting. :-)


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agv8or
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May 31, 2014 15:36 |  #279

dmward wrote in post #16941606 (external link)
Rand,
Nice description of FEC with the 600EX system. I can't remember the last time I used my 600EX-RTs off camera in anything but Gr mode. Thanks for clarifying that some FEC features only work the way I described in Gr. I have a tendency to forget that there is any other setting. :-)

Well David there is one other FEC I did not mention and that is the FEC adjustment of Group C when using ratios in the Wireless ETTL mode. The <Gr> mode is probably where most Wireless RT users will reside as well once they are able to use it but there are times when the old "workarounds" can come in handy but Canon either does not mention them in manuals or has omitted them in the Wireless RT system.


Rand

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Badgerballs
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Jun 01, 2014 08:36 as a reply to  @ agv8or's post |  #280

I've don't know if I am being dopey here but I am slightly confused by another issue. I have a mannie for testing my creative lighting and Have one 600EX on the right with a green gel and one on the left with red gel. I am in GR mode with left A and right B. Both set in ETTL. When I shoot the green seems to throw more light than the red, in fact the red is s tiny flash with very little light. Even when I put FEC to +3 it is hardly anything. So I then set it to manual A and give it about1/32. Is there something about red light that fools ETTL?

One other issue, I am using my YN-E3-RT with my G12 jsut for experimenting, and the YN AF assist beam doesn't seem to work. It is fine on my 7D. Would I expect it to?


"Try shooting badgers, creep up in the dark, they hear the shutter, the flash goes off, they run, and what's the shot... "Badgerballs" !!!!
The difference between good and bad photographers is: Good photographers don't show their bad photos.

  
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dmward
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Jun 01, 2014 08:46 |  #281

Badgerballs wrote in post #16943857 (external link)
I've don't know if I am being dopey here but I am slightly confused by another issue. I have a mannie for testing my creative lighting and Have one 600EX on the right with a green gel and one on the left with red gel. I am in GR mode with left A and right B. Both set in ETTL. When I shoot the green seems to throw more light than the red, in fact the red is s tiny flash with very little light. Even when I put FEC to +3 it is hardly anything. So I then set it to manual A and give it about1/32. Is there something about red light that fools ETTL?

One other issue, I am using my YN-E3-RT with my G12 jsut for experimenting, and the YN AF assist beam doesn't seem to work. It is fine on my 7D. Would I expect it to?

Could be. But first I'd make absolutely certain the speedlite with the red gel wasn't positioned in such a way that it was firing directly into the lens. also look for ways it could have been reflected into the lens.

As you can see, this was shot with red gel on right, yellow on left. ETTL with a third from camera left for fill. Ambient exposure was probably about -1, -1 1/3 EV.


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Badgerballs
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Jun 01, 2014 10:30 |  #282

dmward wrote in post #16943874 (external link)
Could be. But first I'd make absolutely certain the speedlite with the red gel wasn't positioned in such a way that it was firing directly into the lens. also look for ways it could have been reflected into the lens.

As you can see, this was shot with red gel on right, yellow on left. ETTL with a third from camera left for fill. Ambient exposure was probably about -1, -1 1/3 EV.

I have changed to my 7D and there are definately issues with the G12 on ETTL.
I have now discovered something weird going on with the speedlites. Im using the 600EX gel holder and when I put a Full CT Orange in B and a Full CT Blue in A. Everything is OK in the B but A reports and exclamation mark warning next to the top left speedlite icon. I have noticed that underneath the speedlite head are two sensors that look through the gels when they are clipped on with the gel holder. Why am I getting a warning with the Blue and not the Orange I wonder. I have changed A to a CT Full Orange and it is ok.
Now delved a bit further. This is a bit of tech I don't get. In the gel holder black clip that goes under the speedlite head are two what appears to be mirrors in tiny windows that reflect back to 2 sensors that must signal through the gel. If I fit anything other than CTO Orange or 1/4 CTO Green it shows the exposure warning ! next to the speedlite icon. All other gels i.e. Colour gels throw up the same warning. I would like to know what the implications of the warnings are and what use are they. It is not a YN thing as it is off. It shows the same warning whatever Mode the speedlite is in.


"Try shooting badgers, creep up in the dark, they hear the shutter, the flash goes off, they run, and what's the shot... "Badgerballs" !!!!
The difference between good and bad photographers is: Good photographers don't show their bad photos.

  
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dmward
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Jun 01, 2014 12:02 |  #283

^^^ That is a Canon thing.
Its in the manual somewhere. It just means that there is an unrecognized gel in the holder and the gel information is not sent to the camera. If I remember right its something to do with white balance adjustments. First time I saw the ! I too wondered what was going on. Once I determined the cause I realized it was nothing I cared about. Nor anything that affected the exposure.


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Jun 01, 2014 12:15 |  #284

dmward wrote in post #16944286 (external link)
^^^ That is a Canon thing.
Its in the manual somewhere. It just means that there is an unrecognized gel in the holder and the gel information is not sent to the camera. If I remember right its something to do with white balance adjustments. First time I saw the ! I too wondered what was going on. Once I determined the cause I realized it was nothing I cared about. Nor anything that affected the exposure.

Well done on that one, I looked it up as well and got the gist that it is WB thing only appropriate to post 2012 cameras. That's a relief...wondered wat was going on for a moment...


"Try shooting badgers, creep up in the dark, they hear the shutter, the flash goes off, they run, and what's the shot... "Badgerballs" !!!!
The difference between good and bad photographers is: Good photographers don't show their bad photos.

  
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dmward
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Jun 07, 2014 14:07 |  #285

Here are two images shot during the first dance last night. One is with 5DIII using ST-E3-RT to trigger two 600EX-RTs on stands. One in Gr B, the other in Gr C. They are in ETTL and one is set to -1/3 EV. Incidentally, this is one time where I use a stofen type diffuser to create a bare bulb spread of the light from the speedlites. Since they are the predominate source I want the background lit somewhat. Doesn't soften the shadows, but it does help keep the background areas from getting too dark.

The other shot is with Fuji XE2 with YN-E3-RT in Legacy Mode. I did not reset the power on the 600EX-RTs so they were firing at the power set during the ETTL exposure.

When I set the power via the YN-E3 one 600 was at 1/16 power and the other was at 1/16 minus 1/3. For both shots ISO 3200, 1/50, F2.8. (The Fuji was 1/60 shutter speed.)

5DIII image is the first one.


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YN-E3-RT | my first impressions
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