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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 21 Jun 2014 (Saturday) 05:17
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"My xxxd has the same sensor as your xxd"

 
thatquietboy
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Jun 21, 2014 05:17 |  #1

A lot of people here are saying that their Rebel has the same sensor as someone's xxd which is the same sensor as the 7d, to support whatever argument they're making. I suspect that its just based on megapixels. Just because a sensor is APS-C, and the same number of megapixels, does not necessarily mean its the same sensor.

Part numbers are useless, as the same sensor might be soldered to a different circuit board or changed in some other trivial way.

DXOmark? The 20d and 30d are known to have the same sensor, but have different scores, and some of their methodology is questionable as well.

Does anyone know for sure? Is there a reasonably authoritative source to settle this, one way or the other?




  
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Jun 21, 2014 05:21 |  #2

Does it matter? The IQ (from RAW comparisons) are very, very similar anyway. The major difference comes in the form of the JPG processing, which is software.


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Kwirk
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Jun 21, 2014 05:22 |  #3

I think they're similar but I wouldn't say the same. I noted that when I had both a 60D and 7D, there was more noise on high ISO shots on the 60D.




  
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Jun 21, 2014 07:49 |  #4

Canon actually states this in some marketing material or white papers in the past, there were some differences in readout channels or something along that line. You can have the same sensor and get different results because there is alot of software that can vary from model to model.


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Jun 21, 2014 08:34 |  #5

The Canon APS-C sensors are not materially different from one another in real world use, IMO. Same story with Canon's FF sensors.


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Jun 21, 2014 08:34 |  #6

Car manufacturers across many brands share the same parts, and it's done to cut costs and maximize profit.

Canon is no exception to the rule of sharing different parts across a different line of cameras, and sensors are no exception.


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Jun 21, 2014 09:01 |  #7

Sensors are the same, differences are almost invisible.
The real difference comes with build quality, size, ergonomics. For one just the image is important and he/she don't mind if the camera is a bit small, the other one have to have great grip and upper LCD.
These are the only differences in xxxD & xxD.


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Jun 21, 2014 09:06 |  #8

Digital Story wrote in post #16985197 (external link)
Sensors are the same, differences are almost invisible.
The real difference comes with build quality, size, ergonomics. For one just the image is important and he/she don't mind if the camera is a bit small, the other one have to have great grip and upper LCD.
These are the only differences in xxxD & xxD.

Well that and AF performance, max shutter speed, etc. There are a lot of valuable reasons to go for an xxD over an xxxD even if the sensor is essentially the same. Image quality may be the same...difference lies in the ability to capture an image.


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Jun 21, 2014 09:07 |  #9

If the 18MP sensors in the 7D, 60D and XXXD are not the same parts, they are at least close enough that the output is the same. I'm not sure what hypothetical arguments the OP is worrying about, but from the outlook of RAW file output there is no practical difference between these bodies.


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Jun 21, 2014 09:16 |  #10

davidc502 wrote in post #16985154 (external link)
Car manufacturers across many brands share the same parts, and it's done to cut costs and maximize profit.

Canon is no exception to the rule of sharing different parts across a different line of cameras, and sensors are no exception.

^^^^THIS.

It's MUCH cheaper to manufacture sensors in large quantities. The more cameras that share a sensor the better, from a manufacturing point of view.


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Jun 21, 2014 09:17 |  #11

The sensors can and are indeed different from each other. The 50D sensor design is different than the 5D2 sensor which is different than the 7D sensor. In each of these cases, they mixed and matched micro lens designs (gapless), well sizes, etc.

In the case of the 7D sensor, Canon shared that sensor design across the 60D, T2i and other rebels, etc. up through the SL1. Whether they are exactly identical, we are not sure, but they are very, very close, and share almost the same noise characteristics. The 70D has the next sensor design change in the APS-C space, and rumors have it that the 7D2 will have yet another new sensor design. Hypercams, here on the forum, would know quite a bit of this, as he takes cameras apart down to the sensor to put new filters on it, replace parts, etc.

One thing is for sure, Canon likes to tout any new sensor design going into a new camera model, as it seems to be good marketing fodder. They haven't announced a new sensor in the APS-C space during a model release since the 70D, and the 7D before that. ;)


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Jun 21, 2014 09:47 |  #12

In the case of the 7D sensor, Canon shared that sensor design across the 60D, T2i and other rebels, etc. up through the SL1.

I think this is what the OP was referring to, the ubiquitous aps-c 18 mp Canon sensor in 3 or four "T" series, 7D etc..

IMHO these are the same sensors. As you say, Canon would let us know if they were different. This is exactly the same point I was thinking while reading the first posts.

Another point is that they can change other hardware, processing software etc, to get better performance in one area or another, but the sensor is pretty much the same.

The question is, who really cares?

If I want to shoot birds with this 18MP sensor, it's going to be the 7D.
Macro? Maybe a t4i for it's pivoting screen and other handy LCD features.
Go compact? SL1.
These bodies are different enough that they can share the same sensor while being in their own market position. (with the possible exception of the T4i and T5i which seem to be the same camera too! :lol: )


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Jun 21, 2014 09:58 |  #13

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #16985268 (external link)
The question is, who really cares?


BINGO IMHO what really matters is what shows up on the computer monitor or printer once it's all said and done.

If I want to shoot birds with this 18MP sensor, it's going to be the 7D.
Macro? Maybe a t4i for it's pivoting screen and other handy LCD features.
Go compact? SL1.

Totally agree. Various camera families with the same or similar sensor have different features that may or may not be important to the end user. Other than that I think (for some people, not all) there's a bit of snob appeal going on.




  
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Jun 21, 2014 09:59 |  #14

I don't know, looks pretty darn close to me. . . . . .


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Jun 21, 2014 10:03 |  #15

thatquietboy wrote in post #16984980 (external link)
...
Does anyone know for sure? ...

Opinions abound.
I guess the answer is "not anyone not bound to a Canon non-disclosure".

To me; AF features / performance outranks sensor features / performance of the same density. Like everyone's said, they're not materially different.

For example; T4/T5 video AF is breakthrough.


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