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FORUMS Post Processing, Marketing & Presenting Photos RAW, Post Processing & Printing 
Thread started 16 Jun 2014 (Monday) 16:34
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Jun 26, 2014 05:32 |  #91

apersson850 wrote in post #16995143 (external link)
You don't have to select one program out of two, since the older DPP supports cameras like the 1DX too, just with somewhat different functionality.

You will as new cameras come out, they will only be supported in the new version, if their raw format changes.


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Jun 26, 2014 05:38 |  #92

For me, as long time user of the classic dpp most changes are improvements and overall the performance esp. with the dlp modules. Two changes are not positive from my point of view:
- I really liked the old quick separate crop and rotation tool. It was much faster when working with many pics one after the other.
- Maybe connected to the loss of a separate crop and rotation tool crop and rotation is now also part of a recipe when copied from one pic to another. Meaning that if your pic contains cropping info this is copied to another pic when coping the correction recipe! Before this was separated - which was much more flexible. Normally cropping is something very individual for a pic and not something like a whitebalance or noise reduction setting which typically applies to a sequence of pics...

PS: ... I had one crash so far with about 1000 pics developed from my 5D3.


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Jun 26, 2014 05:54 |  #93

TeamSpeed wrote in post #16995213 (external link)
You will as new cameras come out, they will only be supported in the new version, if their raw format changes.

That may be true, but most of the complaints right now are about the new program not supporting the older cameras. But since the old program supports all current cameras, the issue you describe doesn't exist, not yet.

It may very well come.


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Jun 26, 2014 06:10 |  #94

nubu wrote in post #16995219 (external link)
For me, as long time user of the classic dpp most changes are improvements and overall the performance esp. with the dlp modules. Two changes are not positive from my point of view:
- I really liked the old quick separate crop and rotation tool. It was much faster when working with many pics one after the other.
- Maybe connected to the loss of a separate crop and rotation tool crop and rotation is now also part of a recipe when copied from one pic to another. Meaning that if your pic contains cropping info this is copied to another pic when coping the correction recipe! Before this was separated - which was much more flexible. Normally cropping is something very individual for a pic and not something like a whitebalance or noise reduction setting which typically applies to a sequence of pics...

PS: ... I had one crash so far with about 1000 pics developed from my 5D3.

Also a long time DPP user, and I agree that recipes were best NOT to include rotation/crop changes.
I have both versions installed, but for me, I am using the "old" one until I am forced off it.

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Jun 26, 2014 06:32 |  #95

Nigi wrote in post #16990945 (external link)
It is so simple - Adobe makes money by selling new software, Canon makes money by selling new cameras.
Everyone looks after own business milking cows in the process.

It seems to me that there are two reasons this is happening the way it is. Firstly, there's a Canon V Nikon V (an ever improving) Sony battle going on. They want their best cameras to be the best sellers, and most importantly, they don't want customers to switch loyalty. We all know that right across the board, from the D3300 Up (the entry level Nikon) that on Specs alone (24MP, 11 AF points, Built in Wifi etc) Nikon trumps Canon hands down. Even Sony's new line up has 24 MP sensors. On the other hand, Nikon Has always suffered from reliability and service issues. I'm only a canon user because I dropped upon a mint EOS 600D body for £180.00 18 mths ago. If I'd've had the cash to buy new then, on specs alone it would've been the D3200 or 5200 (what I wanted because of 39 AF points but wouldn't have been able to afford), no contest. Two friends have Nikon set ups and are happy. I don't know what the DSLR % split is Canon V Nikon is, but I'd like to know. I think Nikon are ahead, but don't quote me. Secondly, in DSLR photography, there has always been those for who the 'Money is no object' motto is true. They have the best FF bodies, the best glass, the top of the rage accessories and the best SUV's to carry all that weight around in. A rebel or entry level DSLR is not an option for them, even as a back up. Canon has it's L glass (does Nikon have an equivalent? I know Sony has the Zeiss lenses) and many of the owners have glass with a value of over £/$30k. Look at how many folks post in the 5D3 and 1DX threads. I'm not having a go at you, I'm just stating that you exist, and that because you can afford it you go out and buy it, after all, you've worked darned hard to be able to afford to do it. This is the type of customer Canon seems to want. By aimig this new version of DPP at the full frame owners, Canon seems to be doing something for them. They don't seem interested in bringing out new FF bodies, yet they need to be doing something to let the owners of the existing FF bodies know they've not been forgotten. Hence the crumbs off the table to keep them intersted enough to stop them migrating to Nikon who have just released the D4S.
An aquaintance told me an intersting story about an Aussie Church praying for a flood of revival (new believers), and when it happened it split the church. They didn't get the Middle Aged Business men the members wanted, but got loads of young teenage hippies coming to God. Half the church left for another church. What has this got do do with this thread? Well, the young hippies are like the Rebel Buyers. Canon doesn't really want them,even though they sell more Rebels than XXD/XD cameras. They want people to buy full frame bodies with tons of L glass to go with it. And Canon speedlites instead of cheap Yongnuo units etc, etc, etc. Now what happened to those young hippies who found God? 20-30 years later they had become....... you've guessed it, middle aged businessmen. To transpose this to Canon talk (and we know it's true), all those Rebel buyers will at some point upgrade to an XXD body, and if they can afford it at some point,then buy a FF body with L glass down the line. We all wish we had better gear, but being in a position to afford it is another matter. In designing this upgrade for the newest FF bodies only, Canon is speaking volumes to XXD and Rebel owners about how valued their custom really is. They need show some regard for all those Canon users who can't afford the latest FF bodies. If you've just bought a Rebel and kit lens, ad own no other lenses or accessories, then with prices of bodies as low as they are, it's tempting for some to switch loyalty. Alas for me, I have too much kit to be able to do this. I'm sure Canon realise this, but how much longer will they survive trading on goodwill? If I saw a D3200 or 3300 going really cheap I'll probably be tempted to buy it and dip my toes in the other camp. Who kows what might happen?


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Jun 26, 2014 06:39 |  #96

apersson850 wrote in post #16995239 (external link)
That may be true, but most of the complaints right now are about the new program not supporting the older cameras. But since the old program supports all current cameras, the issue you describe doesn't exist, not yet.

It may very well come.

I would count on it, especially with the next release. Canon's raw format has changed several times over the year, whether they just added some new raw tags, or whatever. If the rumors have any kind of truth to them at all, undoubtedly the raw will contain new information for DPP to chew on. If they do, they probably should change the file extension to .CR3, so that you can at least tell your OS to bring up the new DPP for those raws vs old CR2 raws. This would help at least Windows users to be very indifferent to the changes, they double-click a CR2 and get DPP 3.14, they double-click .CR3 and get DPP 4.


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Jun 26, 2014 08:28 |  #97

GeoKras1989 wrote in post #16994788 (external link)
Is that a Freudian slip... of the finger?

just a typo :o;)


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Jun 26, 2014 08:33 |  #98

TeamSpeed wrote in post #16994838 (external link)
Really, Adobe? The company that forces you to constantly pay to upgrade to newer versions to support your newer camera?

The thing is that newer cameras are not supported in the lastest DPP version:

1200D, 100D, 700D, 70D...


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Jun 26, 2014 09:16 |  #99

Azathoth wrote in post #16995439 (external link)
The thing is that newer cameras are not supported in the lastest DPP version:

1200D, 100D, 700D, 70D...

And newer cameras in the future won't be supported by whatever version LR you have now either. The difference being that Adobe will force an additional $50-100 from you to upgrade to their version that does support that camera.

Those cameras are supported in the 3.14 version, so you do indeed have support. As it stands right now, there is no compelling reason to even use DPP 4. Nothing requires you to use it, today. You don't need to go to the latest and greatest as soon as it comes out. I know that is hard to understand though. :)

As new models come out and you buy them, then you will be forced to use DPP4.

The big issue this really brings for me is that I now need to archive off the DPP 3.14 full installation along with my photos, because the only way I can edit the raw files in the future, say 5 years, is to use DPP 3.14. The bigger issue past that even is whether future OSes in 10 years will even run DPP 3.14, and whether Canon will keep patching it to keep up with OS changes. If not, people with old model raw files won't have a way to edit them at all in the future. That is the biggest risk I see with this move.


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Jun 26, 2014 15:02 as a reply to  @ TeamSpeed's post |  #100

I can flip the issue over and say that I don't own any computer that can run DPP 4.0... :(


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Jun 26, 2014 15:17 |  #101

Colin Glover wrote in post #16995274 (external link)
It seems to me that there are two reasons this is happening the way it is. Firstly, there's a Canon V Nikon V (an ever improving) Sony battle going on. They want their best cameras to be the best sellers, and most importantly, they don't want customers to switch loyalty. We all know that right across the board, from the D3300 Up (the entry level Nikon) that on Specs alone (24MP, 11 AF points, Built in Wifi etc) Nikon trumps Canon hands down. Even Sony's new line up has 24 MP sensors. On the other hand, Nikon Has always suffered from reliability and service issues. I'm only a canon user because I dropped upon a mint EOS 600D body for £180.00 18 mths ago. If I'd've had the cash to buy new then, on specs alone it would've been the D3200 or 5200 (what I wanted because of 39 AF points but wouldn't have been able to afford), no contest. Two friends have Nikon set ups and are happy. I don't know what the DSLR % split is Canon V Nikon is, but I'd like to know. I think Nikon are ahead, but don't quote me. Secondly, in DSLR photography, there has always been those for who the 'Money is no object' motto is true. They have the best FF bodies, the best glass, the top of the rage accessories and the best SUV's to carry all that weight around in. A rebel or entry level DSLR is not an option for them, even as a back up. Canon has it's L glass (does Nikon have an equivalent? I know Sony has the Zeiss lenses) and many of the owners have glass with a value of over £/$30k. Look at how many folks post in the 5D3 and 1DX threads. I'm not having a go at you, I'm just stating that you exist, and that because you can afford it you go out and buy it, after all, you've worked darned hard to be able to afford to do it. This is the type of customer Canon seems to want. By aimig this new version of DPP at the full frame owners, Canon seems to be doing something for them. They don't seem interested in bringing out new FF bodies, yet they need to be doing something to let the owners of the existing FF bodies know they've not been forgotten. Hence the crumbs off the table to keep them intersted enough to stop them migrating to Nikon who have just released the D4S.
An aquaintance told me an intersting story about an Aussie Church praying for a flood of revival (new believers), and when it happened it split the church. They didn't get the Middle Aged Business men the members wanted, but got loads of young teenage hippies coming to God. Half the church left for another church. What has this got do do with this thread? Well, the young hippies are like the Rebel Buyers. Canon doesn't really want them,even though they sell more Rebels than XXD/XD cameras. They want people to buy full frame bodies with tons of L glass to go with it. And Canon speedlites instead of cheap Yongnuo units etc, etc, etc. Now what happened to those young hippies who found God? 20-30 years later they had become....... you've guessed it, middle aged businessmen. To transpose this to Canon talk (and we know it's true), all those Rebel buyers will at some point upgrade to an XXD body, and if they can afford it at some point,then buy a FF body with L glass down the line. We all wish we had better gear, but being in a position to afford it is another matter. In designing this upgrade for the newest FF bodies only, Canon is speaking volumes to XXD and Rebel owners about how valued their custom really is. They need show some regard for all those Canon users who can't afford the latest FF bodies. If you've just bought a Rebel and kit lens, ad own no other lenses or accessories, then with prices of bodies as low as they are, it's tempting for some to switch loyalty. Alas for me, I have too much kit to be able to do this. I'm sure Canon realise this, but how much longer will they survive trading on goodwill? If I saw a D3200 or 3300 going really cheap I'll probably be tempted to buy it and dip my toes in the other camp. Who kows what might happen?

That's a lot of words for just two paragraphs, dang....




  
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Jun 26, 2014 15:21 |  #102

shutterbug guy wrote in post #16996150 (external link)
That's a lot of words for just two paragraphs, dang....

I completely agree with you. I'm a very wordy guy! :lol:


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Jun 26, 2014 15:53 |  #103
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apersson850 wrote in post #16996118 (external link)
I can flip the issue over and say that I don't own any computer that can run DPP 4.0... :(

Then you wouldn't be able to run Windows 8.1, either. How dare you? Where do you get off not giving Canon AND Microsoft AND Intel their due? :)

On the lighter side, yesterday, I was really surprised to see Creative Labs still updating firmware for a product I bought when Windows 98 was still kicking. Luckily, I still have a Windows 7 64-bit machine hanging around to run it on.


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Jun 26, 2014 16:36 |  #104

apersson850 wrote in post #16996118 (external link)
I can flip the issue over and say that I don't own any computer that can run DPP 4.0... :(

That is easier to remedy that to have 25 years of canon raw files, and wanting to convert then to jpgs, because you had a death in the family and want to have a slide show at the viewing, but you have no computer that can run dpp 3.14. :(


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Jun 26, 2014 16:48 as a reply to  @ TeamSpeed's post |  #105

I don't think incompatibility with older files will be as important in the future as it has been in the past. I don't have a single program that is stored on a medium I can access (comp still has a disk drive) that I can't make run on windows 7. Also, I think that companies are being more conscious of not leaving us out to dry with old files (MS Office is a good example with doc and docx).

That being said, this line of thought does make me wonder about converting all my CR2s to DNG or something. It also is the impetus I have for making sure all of my really good shots get into JPG somewhere.


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