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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 21 Apr 2014 (Monday) 17:00
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Upgrading my 500D (Rebel T1i)

 
MalVeauX
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May 27, 2014 11:13 |  #16

Heya,

The bottom line is this... you have a 300mm lens for wildlife, on APS-C. If you go full frame, you'll immediately notice the field of view is similar to missing 180mm of extra reach. So you're going to have less on the frame at the same distance at the zoo, or where ever you go to shoot wildlife. If you want to do macro, again, an APS-C will give you more on the frame for the distance. A lot of macro shooters use crops (and even stack TC's in there too) for this reason.

You do not have more len's choice on the 70D, just because EF-S line is included. What EF-S lenses are you wanting that don't exist already in EF form on full frame? This is not something I would worry about. You're not buying all the lenses out there. And you clearly are in the telephoto range, so again, the question of EF-S and EF just doesn't matter as zoom range for EF-S ends early, and the EF range continues further.

If your goal is the sharpest you can get, and the best ISO you can get, then get the 6D. If your goal is to get more animals and bugs filling the frame, without having to buy a longer lens, then stick with the 70D.

I shoot wildlife in the wild, so I go stomping around in Swamps and Prairies here in Florida. I appreciate APS-C with my 600mm lens, because I still feel like it's not enough reach! I still end up cropping down a few photos. A zoo is another story. I could survive with 200mm in a zoo. No problem. But in the wild, I always feel like I need 2000mm. It's just never enough. I do this with macro too. I shoot 180mm prime for macro due to minimum focus distance and 1:1 ratio happening at 18 inches for me. Well, I get even more when using APS-C, as I can focus at the same distance, yet get more perceived magnification. So pretty great macro, at a further distance, means more of the stuff I want without spooking my targets as much (or getting my face in cob webs trying to get within 1 inch of something; I keep a nice 18 inch distance between me and them). For everything else I do, a full frame is better. But for wildlife and macro, APS-C is great. I can't wait for whatever replaces the 7D (I'm passing the 70D this round as my current APS-C works fine for what I do; but I may cave on whatever takes over the 7D in the future, assuming it will have a clean working ISO 1600, as that's all I want, with the focus of the 7D for my wildlife use).

Very best,


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Orias
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May 27, 2014 14:30 as a reply to  @ MalVeauX's post |  #17

Thanks MalVaeuX, a lot of very good points :)

I think, on paper, the 70D seems to tick a few more boxes than the 6D. The crop-factor will help with the macro and wildlife shots although, as I said, it's not such a big deal when a lot of that wildlife is in a zoo.

I guess the biggest thing I am hung-up on is the image quality. I always want the sharpest/cleanest shots possible, particularly when I am doing the macro stuff. I know that the 6D and 70D should both be significantly better than the 500D in that respect. I am just not too sure how big the difference is between the 6D and 70D. is the 6D massively better, or is it really only noticeable if you're actually concentrating on looking for the differences.

I think the lens comment was really only because I was looking at the Canon EF-S 55-250mm IS lens which I don't think comes in the EF format? Just seems like a lot of lens for the price. The Sigma 70-300 I have is good, but I do find that it tends to drop off a little bit once you're at that maximum 300mm range. The IS on the Canon would also really help at those ranges.

Thanks very much once again, appreciate the advice!
Cheers!


Canon EOS 70D + Canon EF 70-300 F4-5.6L IS USM + Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro USM + Canon 10-18mm IS USM, Canon 18-135mm, Canon 50mm 1.8, Canon 55-250mm IS + Canon Speedlight 430 EXII
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lilkngster
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May 27, 2014 21:30 |  #18

6d is going to be a much more expensive route for you. Will you need a standard zoom replacement? The full frame sensor is really going to accentuate the corner softness/distortion on your Sigma, which will lead you to your next IQ hang up so will you want to upgrade that? As mentioned, zooming out the 300 is not going to feel that long anymore, losing the crop factor, so will you need to add more length? I would guess you would more likely answer "no" going with the 70d.

Based on your original post, I am guessing that the 100mm is not only your most expensive but also your most favorite lens. There is a reason. Assuming that your camera and lens are in spec, I would bet you would notice much more IQ improvement going from 500d + Sigma 70-300 to 500d + Canon 70-300L rather than 6d + Sigma 70-300, for about the same amount of money.

Sharpest, cleanest, macro stuff... take your saved money, sell your 100 macro, save a little more, install magic lantern and then learn how to manual focus and get:

http://www.adorama.com​/ZI1002MPZE.html (external link)


6dII/80d/1dIII|8mm to 400mm|Pro-10/100

  
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MalVeauX
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May 27, 2014 22:23 |  #19

Orias wrote in post #16933982 (external link)
Thanks MalVaeuX, a lot of very good points :)

I think, on paper, the 70D seems to tick a few more boxes than the 6D. The crop-factor will help with the macro and wildlife shots although, as I said, it's not such a big deal when a lot of that wildlife is in a zoo.

I guess the biggest thing I am hung-up on is the image quality. I always want the sharpest/cleanest shots possible, particularly when I am doing the macro stuff. I know that the 6D and 70D should both be significantly better than the 500D in that respect. I am just not too sure how big the difference is between the 6D and 70D. is the 6D massively better, or is it really only noticeable if you're actually concentrating on looking for the differences.

I think the lens comment was really only because I was looking at the Canon EF-S 55-250mm IS lens which I don't think comes in the EF format? Just seems like a lot of lens for the price. The Sigma 70-300 I have is good, but I do find that it tends to drop off a little bit once you're at that maximum 300mm range. The IS on the Canon would also really help at those ranges.

Thanks very much once again, appreciate the advice!
Cheers!

Heya,

I think you're worrying over image quality differences that you frankly probably won't even notice if you're objective. Is it going to be better? It should be. But will it be noticeable? Maybe.

Here's some shots from a lowly Rebel:

IMAGE: https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2908/14046180588_4f9ce10106_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/npdm​8o  (external link) IMG_3484 (external link) by Mwise1023 (external link), on Flickr

IMAGE: https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2928/14224661784_41933b1cca_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/nEZ7​no  (external link) IMG_3140 (external link) by Mwise1023 (external link), on Flickr

IMAGE: https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2918/13981686370_8ebd562627_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/nivN​f7  (external link) IMG_2334 (external link) by Mwise1023 (external link), on Flickr

IMAGE: https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2898/14049847836_d6509780e2_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/npx9​gN  (external link) IMG_0848_A (external link) by Mwise1023 (external link), on Flickr

IMAGE: https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7070/14112359905_142c05ac4a_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/nv4w​W6  (external link) IMG_1333 (external link) by Mwise1023 (external link), on Flickr

For wildlife & macro, I have not felt the need to go full frame. I don't feel like there's image quality lacking. To get better images, I'd have to simply shoot in better conditions, get better lighting, and use better glass. I'd rather spend the money on glass than a minor sensor upgrade.

Just a thought.

That said, I like full frame for portraits and walk around, but I'm a depth of field junkie and I use a lot of F1.4 lenses (several fully manual, 20+ year old ones).

Very best,

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Orias
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May 28, 2014 04:50 as a reply to  @ MalVeauX's post |  #20

Thanks guys!

lilkngster - I actually didn't know about Magic Lantern, seems like an interesting tool...I'll give it a shot. I do try to manually focus most of the time already using the Live View + Zoom method to get it as sharp as I can. I occasionally nail it, or think I've done everything I possibly could have done, and still notice little imperfections that vex me! I think that Zeiss might be a little bit overkill for me though ... maybe in 10 years once I've (maybe) got to the kind of level that warrants that sort of kit.

MalVeauX - Thanks again for the feedback .... not so much for the far too detailed spider pics /shudder (I see now why you choose 180mm for macro :)). Great shots though, love the details. Were any of those macro shots stacked, or were they all just one exposure? Were you also using a specific lighting setup, or just a normal flash?

I think I am leaning more towards the 70D at the moment. It would allow me to upgrade my camera body and get a lens or two for the cost of the 6D alone. I guess there is nothing really wrong with my old Rebel T1 .. just feels like time to move up as it's 5 years old now, and I need something to spend my bonus on :p! I'll probably keep the Rebel anyway as a backup.

Thanks again!


Canon EOS 70D + Canon EF 70-300 F4-5.6L IS USM + Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro USM + Canon 10-18mm IS USM, Canon 18-135mm, Canon 50mm 1.8, Canon 55-250mm IS + Canon Speedlight 430 EXII
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MalVeauX
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May 28, 2014 04:53 |  #21

Orias wrote in post #16935260 (external link)
MalVeauX - Thanks again for the feedback .... not so much for the far too detailed spider pics /shudder (I see now why you choose 180mm for macro :)). Great shots though, love the details. Were any of those macro shots stacked, or were they all just one exposure? Were you also using a specific lighting setup, or just a normal flash?

I think I am leaning more towards the 70D at the moment. It would allow me to upgrade my camera body and get a lens or two for the cost of the 6D alone. I guess there is nothing really wrong with my old Rebel T1 .. just feels like time to move up as it's 5 years old now, and I need something to spend my bonus on :p! I'll probably keep the Rebel anyway as a backup.

Thanks again!

Heya,

No stacks. One exposure. Normal flash with a diffuser.

Very best,


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WolfsPride
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May 28, 2014 05:36 |  #22

I just upgraded my T3i to the 70D and LOVE IT!!! There is no comparison what so ever. The image quality, ease of use, everything is much better


Shooting photos never killed anyone,
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_______________Canon 70D, Canon 70-200 f4-L USM, Canon 55-250mm EF IS,Canon 50mm 1.8, Canon 40mm pancake, Canon 100mm f2.8L Macro,Canon 10-40mm,Tamron SP AF 10-24mm F3.5-4.5 Di2, Yongnuo YN-560 III, RF-603 and other stuff

  
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Orias
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May 28, 2014 06:18 |  #23

MalVeauX wrote in post #16935262 (external link)
No stacks. One exposure. Normal flash with a diffuser.

Awesome ... even more impressive!

WolfsPride wrote:
I just upgraded my T3i to the 70D and LOVE IT!!! There is no comparison what so ever. The image quality, ease of use, everything is much better

Great, always good to get feedback from someone who has done a similar upgrade! Thanks! How do you find it with your 100mm macro lens?

Thanks again,
Cheers!


Canon EOS 70D + Canon EF 70-300 F4-5.6L IS USM + Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro USM + Canon 10-18mm IS USM, Canon 18-135mm, Canon 50mm 1.8, Canon 55-250mm IS + Canon Speedlight 430 EXII
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WolfsPride
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May 28, 2014 06:25 |  #24

Orias wrote in post #16935360 (external link)
Awesome ... even more impressive!

Great, always good to get feedback from someone who has done a similar upgrade! Thanks! How do you find it with your 100mm macro lens?

Thanks again,
Cheers!

Haha, good question. I just traded my Macro off for something else. I need to update my sig. It worked very nicely with my T3i so I imagine it would be stellar with the 70D


Shooting photos never killed anyone,
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Orias
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May 28, 2014 06:44 |  #25

Hehehe, no problem! I can't imagine that it's going to be bad in any way :D


Canon EOS 70D + Canon EF 70-300 F4-5.6L IS USM + Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro USM + Canon 10-18mm IS USM, Canon 18-135mm, Canon 50mm 1.8, Canon 55-250mm IS + Canon Speedlight 430 EXII
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Orias
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Jul 07, 2014 11:19 as a reply to  @ Orias's post |  #26

Well, after all the research and investigation, I have finally placed my order for:

Canon EOS 70D + EF-S 18-135mm IS STM
Canon EF-S 55-250mm IS STM
Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 MK II


Went with DigitalRev in the end as they seemed to offer the best deal with very good reviews!

Can't wait :D


Canon EOS 70D + Canon EF 70-300 F4-5.6L IS USM + Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro USM + Canon 10-18mm IS USM, Canon 18-135mm, Canon 50mm 1.8, Canon 55-250mm IS + Canon Speedlight 430 EXII
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Jul 07, 2014 11:37 as a reply to  @ Orias's post |  #27

Congrats, you will love it!:)


Lynn
Canon 70D | 10-22 USM | 17-55 f2.8 IS USM | 55-250 IS | 100 f2.8L macro | 430ex III-RT flash | and all my husbands gear!

  
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Jul 07, 2014 14:46 |  #28
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Frodge wrote in post #16854778 (external link)
Also, 6d bodies, from everything I've read, have poor outer autofocus points.

You heard wrong. Talk with some people who actually own one. My 6D's outer points are better than the center on a 5Dc, and by implication (same AF system), the 5D2.


WARNING: I often dispense advice in fields I know little about!

  
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Mick_R
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Jul 07, 2014 16:30 |  #29

Orias wrote in post #17016641 (external link)
Well, after all the research and investigation, I have finally placed my order for:

Canon EOS 70D + EF-S 18-135mm IS STM
Canon EF-S 55-250mm IS STM
Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 MK II


Went with DigitalRev in the end as they seemed to offer the best deal with very good reviews!

Can't wait :D

I also went with DigitalRev and I have to say they were fantastic and the price was too good to turn down. Mind, I kept waking up every couple of hours to track the delivery on my mobile phone. I was like a child at Christmas and shattered for a couple of days at work.




  
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Orias
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Jul 10, 2014 04:34 |  #30

wow ... everything arrived this morning!

I literally placed the order at about midnight on Monday. And it's arrived here (Madrid) at 10am on Thursday morning from Hong Kong. And considering how monumentally terrible Spanish post is (I've waited 5 weeks for parcels from my parents in the UK), it's even more impressive!!! No problems with customs at all, and I now have enough bubble-wrap to last me a year from the packaging!

Very impressed! Looking forward to "playing" now :D


Canon EOS 70D + Canon EF 70-300 F4-5.6L IS USM + Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro USM + Canon 10-18mm IS USM, Canon 18-135mm, Canon 50mm 1.8, Canon 55-250mm IS + Canon Speedlight 430 EXII
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Upgrading my 500D (Rebel T1i)
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