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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 30 Jul 2014 (Wednesday) 14:29
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Differences among the 2x extenders (i, ii, iii) on a 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II

 
msowsun
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Jul 31, 2014 10:11 |  #16

With the 70-200 2 there is no improvement in AF performance with the 2x III over the 2x II because there is no electronic communication.

The optics are improved though so the slight improvement in Image Quality could be reason enough to get the III.


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TeamSpeed
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Jul 31, 2014 11:19 |  #17

jimewall wrote in post #17068075 (external link)
I don't know if it is the same, but it supposedly also has some new circuitry - see here (external link).

I do want to get one of the new Kenko X models. Someone somewhere said it keeps AF with the 100L, no other TC does (it continually hunts with other TCs regardless if 1.4X or 2X - including Canon's with an ET). This would add more use for non macro shooting with the 100L (for me) if true.

Mine is the old Pro300 version, no issues really with any of my lenses, and if I ever have an issue, I just tape the last 3 pins. The Kenko 1.4 and 2x have been quite versatile, even together once in a while. I wouldn't mind trying out a MKIII 2x though.


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Jul 31, 2014 14:02 |  #18

I have compared the Kenko Pro to Canon extenders and the quality is comparable. The Kenko does offere the advantage of autofocusing with non L and third party lenses.


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jimewall
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Jul 31, 2014 14:15 |  #19

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17068220 (external link)
Mine is the old Pro300 version, no issues really with any of my lenses, and if I ever have an issue, I just tape the last 3 pins. The Kenko 1.4 and 2x have been quite versatile, even together once in a while. I wouldn't mind trying out a MKIII 2x though.

I too have the same Kenko 1.4X (DG but not X version) and 2X (of white - the even slightly older version) and have no issues with any lens except the 100L. The 100L just doesn't lock focus (hunts back and forth) and sometimes locks aperture. It is not Isolated, it happened with a previous 100L that I thought was faulty. Theoretically the new Kenko TCs with X may not do this.


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Jul 31, 2014 16:54 |  #20

Forgot to mention that I recently tried my Canon 2 x Mk3 extender on a Canon 300 F2.8 Mk2 (my camera is a 1DX). Unfortunately I didn't have my Canon 300 F2.8 Mk1 handy, but the AF did seem a little quicker than I get om my Mk1 - not night and day but better, I will have to compare them side by side.
A point to note is that the extra communication abilities of the Canon Mk3 extenders only works on the 5D3 and 1DX as far as I know.


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jimewall
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Jul 31, 2014 17:50 |  #21

johnf3f wrote in post #17068936 (external link)
Forgot to mention that I recently tried my Canon 2 x Mk3 extender on a Canon 300 F2.8 Mk2 (my camera is a 1DX). Unfortunately I didn't have my Canon 300 F2.8 Mk1 handy, but the AF did seem a little quicker than I get om my Mk1 - not night and day but better, I will have to compare them side by side.
A point to note is that the extra communication abilities of the Canon Mk3 extenders only works on the 5D3 and 1DX as far as I know.

This site (external link) says all EOS Digital cameras and one EOS film camera are comparable with the new circuitry.

It also would seem kind of silly for Canon to take two years after the release of the TCs to produce compatible cameras (and to release only two models). Though the lenses came out a year after, so it is a possibility.


Thanks for Reading & Good Luck - Jim
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Jul 31, 2014 21:48 |  #22

jimewall wrote in post #17068590 (external link)
I too have the same Kenko 1.4X (DG but not X version) and 2X (of white - the even slightly older version) and have no issues with any lens except the 100L. The 100L just doesn't lock focus (hunts back and forth) and sometimes locks aperture. It is not Isolated, it happened with a previous 100L that I thought was faulty. Theoretically the new Kenko TCs with X may not do this.

Yes, mine doesn't work either. Even the 1.4x... With the 1.4x, I can see the lens go back and forth, each time getting a bit closer, and finally it will lock. Just ratchets back and forth, less each time until it finds focus. Most likely it is the focusing changes on the 100L to allow microfocus to help with macro focusing?


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jimewall
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Jul 31, 2014 22:18 |  #23

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17069345 (external link)
Yes, mine doesn't work either. Even the 1.4x... With the 1.4x, I can see the lens go back and forth, each time getting a bit closer, and finally it will lock. Just ratchets back and forth, less each time until it finds focus. Most likely it is the focusing changes on the 100L to allow microfocus to help with macro focusing?

Except it works fine on my EF 100mm f/2.8 macro pre/non-USM version. It too should have the same type of focus changes for microfocus. (As should the 50CM, which also works fine.) It also would not explain why (supposedly) the new Kenko X models would work correctly (Again hearsay as I have not yet verified this).


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Aug 01, 2014 07:05 |  #24

jimewall wrote in post #17069014 (external link)
This site (external link) says all EOS Digital cameras and one EOS film camera are comparable with the new circuitry.

It also would seem kind of silly for Canon to take two years after the release of the TCs to produce compatible cameras (and to release only two models). Though the lenses came out a year after, so it is a possibility.

Perhaps I didn't phrase it very well. I have had absolutely no compatibility issues with my 2 x Mk3 extender on any of my bodies and have seen significant IQ improvements on all my lenses that will accept it. What I haven't seen is any AF improvement simply because I don't have any Mk2 SuperTeles. My Mk3 extender simply functions exactly the same as my Mk2 did - it just gives better images.
With the Mk2 SuperTeles Canon claim that there are significant AF improvements and my recent play with a Canon 300 F2.8 Mk2 seemed to confirm this, The owner of the 300mm Mk2 lens noticed no AF difference between Mk2 and 3 extenders with his 1D3.
Another acquaintance of mine tells me that, with his Canon 500 IS Mk2 the Mk3 extender gave faster AF with his 1DX and 5D3 than he got with his Mk2 extender. With his 1D4 (now sold) he noticed no AF difference between the Mk2 and Mk3 2 x extenders. So it appears that to get the very best out of the latest extenders you need a Mk2 lens + the latest bodies. For those of us with older lenses the 2 x Mk3 extender simply offers a nice (and very worthwhile) image quality improvement - well worth the extra cost in my view.


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jimewall
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Aug 01, 2014 09:10 as a reply to  @ johnf3f's post |  #25

Fair enough!

Anybody with a 5DII or 1DX plus a different body than these two, a MKII SuperTele and a MKII & MKIII TC that they can compare AF speeds between the cameras AND the TCs? That is not too much to ask (wow that actually is a lot to ask).


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Elton ­ Balch
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Aug 01, 2014 09:28 |  #26

johnf3f wrote in post #17069857 (external link)
Perhaps I didn't phrase it very well. I have had absolutely no compatibility issues with my 2 x Mk3 extender on any of my bodies and have seen significant IQ improvements on all my lenses that will accept it. What I haven't seen is any AF improvement simply because I don't have any Mk2 SuperTeles. My Mk3 extender simply functions exactly the same as my Mk2 did - it just gives better images.
With the Mk2 SuperTeles Canon claim that there are significant AF improvements and my recent play with a Canon 300 F2.8 Mk2 seemed to confirm this, The owner of the 300mm Mk2 lens noticed no AF difference between Mk2 and 3 extenders with his 1D3.
Another acquaintance of mine tells me that, with his Canon 500 IS Mk2 the Mk3 extender gave faster AF with his 1DX and 5D3 than he got with his Mk2 extender. With his 1D4 (now sold) he noticed no AF difference between the Mk2 and Mk3 2 x extenders. So it appears that to get the very best out of the latest extenders you need a Mk2 lens + the latest bodies. For those of us with older lenses the 2 x Mk3 extender simply offers a nice (and very worthwhile) image quality improvement - well worth the extra cost in my view.

This review from the digital picture seems to confirm your observations.

http://www.the-digital-picture.com …der-EF-2x-III-Review.aspx (external link)


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Aug 01, 2014 11:49 |  #27

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17067642 (external link)
Why would the mkiii work better with AF over the mkii? Isn't the TC just a pass-through from body to lens?

As with many things, I'm not quite up to speed with latest versions, but I know with the MkII 2X T-Con when it was "reported" to the camera the body would in fact automatically slow down the AF function. Canon described this as being a method to maintain AF accuracy by sacrificing some speed.
Add to that the fact that the loss of two stops of light, and in many cases, reduction of AF sensors down to the single center AF point only, and one should be able to understand why AF performance drops sharply with the addition of a 2X T-Con.

From the T-Con FAQ;

4. Additionally, EF Extenders reduce lens drive speed. The EF 1.4x or 1.4x II reduces lens drive speed by approximately 50~67% depending on the lens in use.
The EF 2x or 2x II reduces lens drive speed by up to approximately 75%.
This speed reduction gives the AF system more time to detect focus. This can be helpful since the depth of focus is reduced with the longer effective focal length and the chance of defocus increases. However, the reduced tracking speed and smaller maximum apertures caused by the use of Extenders can be a disadvantage with fast moving subjects, particularly in low light.


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Aug 01, 2014 11:59 as a reply to  @ CyberDyneSystems's post |  #28

I am very familiar on why 2x TCs cause general issues, the only question I had was what did Canon alter between the MKII 2x vs the MKIII 2x to make the AF better, and IQ better.

It sounds like they might have removed the "governor" so to speak, while not sacrificing accuracy.


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Aug 01, 2014 17:35 |  #29

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17070372 (external link)
I am very familiar on why 2x TCs cause general issues, the only question I had was what did Canon alter between the MKII 2x vs the MKIII 2x to make the AF better, and IQ better.

It sounds like they might have removed the "governor" so to speak, while not sacrificing accuracy.

As far as I know (could be wrong!) there is a microprocessor within the Mk3 extenders which improves AF speed when used with the latest bodies and Mk2 Superteles. In the case of the 2 x Mk3 (my 1.4 is a Mk2) extender the IQ advantage is apparent on any lens that will accept it, well at least on all the ones I have tried so far!


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Ken ­ Nielsen
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Aug 02, 2014 02:19 |  #30

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #17066656 (external link)
On the version II lens, the version III T-Cons are best performing.

I've tried various TC's with this lens and I agree with the above statement. The III does not do a bad job. That being said, I am actually getting a better result with the 70-300 f/4-5.6L IS USM and a Kenko 1.4 TC. See my thread here I just posted with example I think is an even better combination of glass when using a TC. My opinion, but the results are an improvement over the 70-200 IS II in my opinion.




  
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Differences among the 2x extenders (i, ii, iii) on a 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II
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