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Thread started 22 Sep 2014 (Monday) 15:09
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Will Mirrorless "kill" DSLR?

 
Charlie
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Sep 23, 2014 00:54 |  #46

mirrorless doesnt have the lens support, and that's what takes so long to build up. I also dont think mirrorless kills DSLR's either. With low light, EVF's slow down a bit, and just not as accurate as ovf.

Try timing action with mirrorless, it just seems to miss (shot karate, and while I can nail focus, very hard to time shots with the EVF). A serious amateur may take a DSLR because it's established and proven.

Heck, I'm toning down my DSLR kit big time, but at the same time, I want to have a few zooms, where the DSLR will remain king for many years IMO.


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tat3406
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Sep 23, 2014 03:39 |  #47

Pro photographer need a complete ecosystem to support their business, untill today no company can compete with two giant Canon & Nikon. Sony have a lot of body and sensor, but lens line up was no good. Fujifilm X-series is very good recently, but need more specific equipment for all pro requirement, and service like CPS or NPS provide.

Mirrorless is not any revolution technology today, p&s is mirrorless camera. To "kill" DSLR, first must kill two big player in DSLR, with provide the ecosystem that they provide right now.


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gjl711
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Sep 23, 2014 06:22 |  #48

tat3406 wrote in post #17172490 (external link)
...

Mirrorless is not any revolution technology today, p&s is mirrorless camera. To "kill" DSLR, first must kill two big player in DSLR, with provide the ecosystem that they provide right now.

That's not really a necessity. All it would take is one of the big two to put forth a mirroless pro body which outperforms today's mirrored bodies. That's really not that hard as the two technologies are so similar that the only thing standing in the way of doing that today is a plan. There is nothing in mirrorless technology that makes it unsuitable for a pro body.


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Reservoir ­ Dog
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Sep 23, 2014 06:44 |  #49

I didn't read all the comment, sorry about that, this evening i'm quite tired...
Mirrorless versus DSLR, mirror less winner for many reason IMO

IMO > birds, specially the little ones, when they heard the noise of the mirror they go away ! ( i'm really seek with that )
IMO > mirror less are not "mechanic" so no real mechanic limitation in time (like 150 000 shutter life for example > e-Shutter is the future)
IMO > movie > Evf vs Ovf, with the mirror lock up on DSLR you cannot see what you are doing unless you use live view, evf you can do movie, it seems "nothing" but a lot of people i know just speak about it and have hard time with that.
IMO > Evf will improve and improve again, and the most important is > What You See Is What You Got/Get (WYSIWYG > like in computer development ;) )
IMO > fps, no comment due to the limitation of mechanical in SLR, but mirror less winner and by far !
IMO at the end > plenty of "old professional" swear only with SLR > when those people/generation will get retired > at this time mirror less will kill SLR for real.
And so on ...
So on ...
So on ...
So on ...


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wisdom2thewise
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Sep 23, 2014 06:45 |  #50

I'm debating on either purchasing the LX100 or 7d2 + 35f2 lens.
Let you know the outcome in two months time.


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xpfloyd
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Sep 23, 2014 07:02 |  #51

Reservoir Dog wrote in post #17172646 (external link)
IMO > birds, specially the little ones, when they heard the noise of the mirror they go away ! ( i'm really seek with that )
IMO > mirror less are not "mechanic" so no real mechanic limitation in time (like 150 000 shutter life for example > e-Shutter is the future)

Whilst im a big mirrorless fan after leaving dslr I would just comment a couple of things on the 2 points ive quoted above.

firstly not all mirrorless are silent/quiet. You should hear the noise on the A7R shutter!

Secondly, I may be wrong, but I believe the shutter can still wear out after a set amount of actuations as its still mechanical in some bodies (as I say I may be wrong on this!)


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Sep 23, 2014 07:19 |  #52

xpfloyd wrote in post #17172673 (external link)
Whilst im a big mirrorless fan after leaving dslr I would just comment a couple of things on the 2 points ive quoted above.

firstly not all mirrorless are silent/quiet. You should hear the noise on the A7R shutter!

Secondly, I may be wrong, but I believe the shutter can still wear out after a set amount of actuations as its still mechanical in some bodies (as I say I may be wrong on this!)

Yes i agree, but i'm speaking about the "future" with electronic shutter showing his "nose" (no mechanical parts) like the first curtain on some brand/P&S/etc (just about the "future" ) ;)


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xpfloyd
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Sep 23, 2014 07:25 |  #53

ahh no worries. I believe Sony have implemented a fully electronic shutter in the A7s already which is completely silent. I just know my A7R is far from silent


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ozzmodan
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Sep 23, 2014 09:01 |  #54

Hogloff wrote in post #17171968 (external link)
...The DSLR will be regulated to serve the niche markets which are small while mirrorless and phones will serve the masses.

I agree that phones will serve the masses. I think both DSLR and mirrorless systems will both be niche markets.

BrickR wrote in post #17172351 (external link)
...
I can pack my NX300 and 4 lenses in the same space as a T3i+17-50. When I travel that is NOT an insignificant thing, that is a massive advantage for mirrorless. The lenses are smaller, the body is smaller, the footprint is smaller. The Rebel and the NX both pack APS-C sensors so I'm not sacrificing IQ. Oh, and can we say no worry about front/back focusing??

This all sounds exactly like people claiming film won't ever be replaced by digital. Technology marches ahead. If you can get a D610 sensor in a camera that is half the size and weight with lenses slightly smaller for the same ranges/values, and AF tracking that almost matches (say 90% as good) it would KILL the D610 DSLR. And the truth is, in 10 yrs you'll have that :wink:

I agree that having a smaller camera system is great for traveling. When it comes to actually taking pictures though, I'm going to guess that you probably prefer using your Rebel. I know that is how I feel about my EOS-M vs. my 5D3.

This all sounds exactly like people claiming that that laptops will replace desktops by 1992 & both of those will be replaced by smartphones by 2011. You can make things smaller, but fingers are still the same size. It seems like smartphone manufacturers have realized this & have been increasing the size of their phones. :wink:


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AlanU
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Sep 23, 2014 09:21 |  #55

wisdom2thewise wrote in post #17172648 (external link)
I'm debating on either purchasing the LX100 or 7d2 + 35f2 lens.
Let you know the outcome in two months time.

Those are two entirely different systems.

If size isn't a concern I'd go dslr. At least you have versatility in changing lenses. 7dmk2 hopefully has very good high iso performance.

The LX100 seems like a very odd camera with serious limitations for the price tag due to a fixed lens. When fuji introduced the x100 fixed lens it had serious cool factor with larger cmos sensor. Looks like they've now introduced an x100T. These camera's seem like a product to just add to their line of camera's. Niche product to own but serious limitations.

If your into an lx100 you might as well buy a Olympus EM-5 or EM-1. At least you can throw on a huge line of M43 lenses from a 12mm zuiko f/2, panny/leica 25mm f/1.4, 15mm f/1.7 or a tiny extremely capable 14mm f/2.5.

If your really looking for a stills camera slap on a 40mm pancake on a 6d!! For a stills camera that will be a 7dmk2 killer even with a slower fixed 40mm lens.

I would not spend substantial money on a micro 4/3 fixed camera body like the Lx100. Very likely the iso performance will be limited like all M43 platforms. ISO performance is good but still not nearly as good as 5dmk2, 6d, 5d3 etc. Recently I tried even using my OMD em-5 with panny/leica 25 f/1.4 in low light and was not pleased in the files. I know the limitations and there are times it really bothers me. However in good light the image quality is very good.


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Sep 23, 2014 09:36 |  #56

Fernando wrote in post #17171525 (external link)
I'll never say that my Fuji X-T1 will 100% replace the 7D I sold, but I am not regretting selling off my gear and dropping a very quick $4k on my new kit.

Same here. I picked up Fuji XT-1 and 35mm f1.4 and I am really loving it. AF seems quite nice for most regular stuff. In 5 yrs I am assuming it will be good or better than current dSLRs for things like sports.


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bobbyz
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Sep 23, 2014 09:50 |  #57

Chief_10Beers wrote in post #17171665 (external link)
Me thinks it will be a long time that EVF's will match a OVF...............

Try one on XT-1. I like oVF on my 5dmk3 but this EVF on XT-1 is bigger than that and very very good. In few yes it will be the norm.


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Sep 23, 2014 09:50 |  #58

bobbyz wrote in post #17172981 (external link)
Same here. I picked up Fuji XT-1 and 35mm f1.4 and I am really loving it. AF seems quite nice for most regular stuff. In 5 yrs I am assuming it will be good or better than current dSLRs for things like sports.

I have the opposite experience. Sold my canon gear and bought a Fuji XT1 and lenses. Whilst I liked the lenses and the AF speed I didnt like the IQ (self confessed pixel peeper). Sold the Fuji gear and bought the sony (which I love) and I am now re-buying canon lenses


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Charlie
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Sep 23, 2014 09:55 |  #59

bobbyz wrote in post #17173017 (external link)
Try one on XT-1. I like oVF on my 5dmk3 but this EVF on XT-1 is bigger than that and very very good. In few yes it will be the norm.

I think that while the EVF is definitely bigger and easier to see, you may be seeing it's flaws with some action shots. Thinks like timing a jump/kick/landing, seems kinda hard to do with mirrorless. For now, since the framerate is good with the A7r (5fps), I will burst a little early to catch action and hope I land something.

It's definitely not optimal in those situations, but for everything else, it's fantastic. Love it more than the OVF.


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Gobeatty
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Sep 23, 2014 10:34 |  #60

I've always felt SLRs, with their mirrors, were "Flintstones" technology in a way. It's a lot of mechanical contraption that probably never would have existed if electronic displays had been available back in the day. The longer flange length makes everything larger, heavier and more expensive (to a point - Leica's are darned expensive mirrorless cameras).

And it's easy these days to confuse mirrorless and small sensor. Yes - many compacts are small sensor and SLRs are APSC, FF or larger. But this isn't necessarily the case and there are FF mirrorless cameras. The smaller sensor in some mirrorless cameras does contribute to the size/weight savings that can be gained by getting rid of the mirror in the first place. I believe AF is a red herring. The Sony A6000 for instance tracks all over the frame very well and is a consumer priced camera. I just picked up an EM10 and carry it everywhere. Not sure if I will sell my 6D but for many of my uses the Oly will get used and the 6D left at home.

In fairness, I'm not shooting paid work anymore and would be much more comfortable photographing a wedding with the 6D.


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Will Mirrorless "kill" DSLR?
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