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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 20 Sep 2014 (Saturday) 21:31
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I want to buy my first FF camera

 
reyces
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Sep 26, 2014 12:24 |  #61

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17178915 (external link)
Yes, sensors can be replaced.

Thank you!!


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Sep 26, 2014 12:26 |  #62

For your pictures above, please describe your workflow. That looks to be more indicative of your raw/jpg processing, and/or pulling the exposure up later, and not the camera. Also did you pull the exposure up after you took the shot? If you have the raw files, we can pull it up and tell you exactly what is going on with those. :)


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Sep 26, 2014 12:30 |  #63

davesrose wrote in post #17178883 (external link)
The 6D can produce great images just as the 7D can produce great images. I'm wondering if the noise you're seeing at ISO 400 is only after you bump up shadow levels in LR. I looked at some photos at your website, and I'd say many of them don't have a full contrast range. If your expsosure is underexposed, then you won't have as much contrast in your RAW to work with. If you bump up your shadows, you'll also see more noise. All Canons exhibit some noise post processing the deep shadows, so it's best to expose to the right.

Thank you, interesting point. I appreciate it.

No, I see the noise before post processing.


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Sep 26, 2014 12:31 |  #64

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17178979 (external link)
For your pictures above, please describe your workflow. That looks to be more indicative of your raw/jpg processing, and/or pulling the exposure up later, and not the camera. Also did you pull the exposure up after you took the shot? If you have the raw files, we can pull it up and tell you exactly what is going on with those. :)

Those pics are unedited.


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Sep 26, 2014 12:35 |  #65

reyces wrote in post #17178987 (external link)
Those pics are unedited.

Raw? What raw processor? There is always an edit going on one way or another, whether DPP, LR, etc if you shot in raw and used one of the raw converters. There is no chroma noise, so these have some sort of noise reduction happening, for example, and there is sharpening being performed.


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Sep 26, 2014 12:46 |  #66

I have to say, that is a lot of noise in your sample shots at what I would consider reasonable ISO's, especially the 800 ISO one.
Would you be willing to post/host the raw files somewhere? Even on my T3i, I don't see that much noise at 800 ISO. This is kind of interesting and I definitely understand why you would want something with better performance if you are seeing this kind of result on your current images. I can without question guarantee the 6D will be better than these. I do apply NR on my higher ISO images, but as you can see, they turn out reasonably well.


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Sep 26, 2014 12:55 |  #67

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17178991 (external link)
Raw? What raw processor? There is always an edit going on one way or another, whether DPP, LR, etc if you shot in raw and used one of the raw converters. There is no chroma noise, so these have some sort of noise reduction happening, for example, and there is sharpening being performed.

In this case I just took the RAW and opened with PS C6 just to crop and save as JPG to post here.

Most of the time I upload the pictures to the computer using the finder (moving files from CF to folder on my mac)

Here I post an example of unedited and edited with LR

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Sep 26, 2014 13:00 |  #68

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17178991 (external link)
Raw? What raw processor? There is always an edit going on one way or another, whether DPP, LR, etc if you shot in raw and used one of the raw converters. There is no chroma noise, so these have some sort of noise reduction happening, for example, and there is sharpening being performed.


When I opened with Camera Raw in PS there is set "sharpen for: Screen / Amount: Standard"


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Sep 26, 2014 13:03 |  #69

sirquack wrote in post #17179010 (external link)
I have to say, that is a lot of noise in your sample shots at what I would consider reasonable ISO's, especially the 800 ISO one.
Would you be willing to post/host the raw files somewhere? Even on my T3i, I don't see that much noise at 800 ISO. This is kind of interesting and I definitely understand why you would want something with better performance if you are seeing this kind of result on your current images. I can without question guarantee the 6D will be better than these. I do apply NR on my higher ISO images, but as you can see, they turn out reasonably well.

I just uploaded the RAW file to my website.
http://cesarphotograph​y.net/demos/IMG_3094.C​R2 (external link)

Let me know if you can see the same amount of noise or maybe I'm doing something wrong at the moment to open with PS or LR

Thank you,


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Sep 26, 2014 13:07 |  #70

When I get home this evening Reyces I will grab the file and run it through LR like I normally would. I am just shocked that you are getting that much noise on your images. I would have even expected better focus on the 7D than what the capture shows. Something odd is happening and now I am curious if there is something else going on.
How long have you had your 7D?


Name is Ron.
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Sep 26, 2014 13:18 |  #71

sirquack wrote in post #17179055 (external link)
When I get home this evening Reyces I will grab the file and run it through LR like I normally would. I am just shocked that you are getting that much noise on your images. I would have even expected better focus on the 7D than what the capture shows. Something odd is happening and now I am curious if there is something else going on.
How long have you had your 7D?

I know and I expected something better too but no :(

I bought it from BH about 2 years ago, I used mostly for glamour or studio shoots so I didn't have problem with a LOT of light and using ISO 100-200.

Thank you,


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Sep 26, 2014 13:47 |  #72

reyces wrote in post #17179036 (external link)
I just uploaded the RAW file to my website.
http://cesarphotograph​y.net/demos/IMG_3094.C​R2 (external link)

Let me know if you can see the same amount of noise or maybe I'm doing something wrong at the moment to open with PS or LR

Thank you,

Great, thank you very much for sharing. Are you sure your ACR stuff has all the up to date stuff? It took a while to get the 7D updated in ACR. Also, I would try taking this into DPP just for fun.


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Sep 26, 2014 14:09 |  #73

TeamSpeed wrote in post #17179127 (external link)
Great, thank you very much for sharing. Are you sure your ACR stuff has all the up to date stuff? It took a while to get the 7D updated in ACR. Also, I would try taking this into DPP just for fun.

You're welcome and thank you for helping me with all the info.

Yes, it's updated, it is Camera Raw 8.2


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Sep 26, 2014 14:25 |  #74

Okay, what you are seeing is all ACR/PS related.

My notes are as such, based on looking at your shooting parameters in DPP, and everything I am calling out is through DPP.
- You have ALO turned on, you want that off, it just adds noise.
- You have no sharpening turned on.
- Your focus is off, the items in the background are much more in focus than the foreground, so you need to sharpen much more than you should, which sharpens your noise.
- You shot this with the 10-18 at 14mm, does that lens really resolve detail that you would need for a shot like this? I don't know much about that lens. The 7D will eat up lenses and spit them out. I found that out the hard way. Put a great quality lens on the 7D, and it will resolve detail wonderfully, like the 17-55 IS. Also, at 14mm with such a lens, you probably have noticed that the 2 ladies at each end of the frame are distorted wide, and there are ways to pull them back in, but that will take some work as well.

In DPP, all I changed was:
- Turned off ALO
- Took your 2 NR sliders, added 1 to the Lum slider, and subtracted 1 from the chroma slider
- Put your sharpening to 2
- Tweak the WB

I will now work on the JPG later this evening, but this is the best you are going to get, simply because your lens focused beyond your subjects, they seem to just fall barely within your DOF for where your AF point is, thus why they have no real detail. Your cleaned up version is actually pretty good, and might be hard to beat. However the noise you see in the file before you edit is from the raw conversion itself, not from the sensor.


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Sep 26, 2014 14:39 |  #75

Here is what your file looks like with the NR turned completely off, which to me looks even better than your non-edited file, just to prove its the raw conversion, ACR is grossly sharpening up the image, including all the noise, enhancing it.

EDIT: Never mind, I am going to have to host the images myself, POTN is massively compressing the files when I attach them this way. :(

Note how much more detail you have in the distance, which means it is hard to edit this file to get any detail out of the people without impacting the rest of the scene. This will require masking out the people and working only on them.

IMAGE: http://teamspeed.smugmug.com/Electronics/Miscellaneous-Items/i-9hWPCQg/0/O/Capture3.jpg

The best I can do at work, my 3rd party plugins are at home, I just have basic CS5 here at work, along with the free version of Noiseware (Community version). NR at home is much better than what Adobe provides... What you managed to get out of your file is pretty good though, I would just strongly suggest not using the 10-18 for a portrait lens. There are much better options, like the 17-55, and you then won't have all the distortion, and much more detail will be captured.

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