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FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting 
Thread started 03 Jan 2015 (Saturday) 18:44
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shadows?

 
jeljohns
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Post edited over 4 years ago by jeljohns. (3 edits in all)
     
Jan 03, 2015 18:44 |  #1

I'm trying *really* hard to learn about flash. I've read all the Strobist stuff and just finished Zak's One Light DVD.

Just fooling around with a 24" QBox on camera left....why is there a big shadow on the wall? Is it because the subject is so close to the wall? Also the shine spots on the forehead bug me. Clearly this is underexposed, but I'm trying to understand how like works and all its quirks.

It's like learning Portuguese for me!

IMAGE: https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7462/16003531669_3eea2c9056_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://www.flickr.com​/photos/jeljohns/16003​531669/  (external link)
P78A2341.jpg (external link) by jeljohns25 (external link) on Flickr



  
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Left ­ Handed ­ Brisket
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Jan 03, 2015 18:58 |  #2

the shine (specular highlight) might be cause by oily skin, only way to cure that is with some powder make up or a shower. :P

or it might be caused by having the light too far back. The Qbox 24 is not really a huge box so having it in as close as possible increases it's apparent size.

or it might be a combination of the two.

as for the shadow, yes, the subject is too close to the wall to expect there to be no shadow.


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jeljohns
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Jan 03, 2015 22:32 |  #3

Thanks! Makes sense.




  
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mmmfotografie
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Jan 04, 2015 06:44 as a reply to  @ jeljohns's post |  #4

Its a big shadow because it is also a big guy. ;-)a

If you want less blocking of light you have up the light or if it is a small room point the bare flash to the upper left corner behind you and increase the power output.




  
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digadv
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Jan 04, 2015 06:45 as a reply to  @ jeljohns's post |  #5

Not to make things more complicated, but read up on the Inverse-Square Law as it explains the relationship of light intensity vs. distance.




  
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DisrupTer911
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Jan 04, 2015 10:45 |  #6

digadv wrote in post #17365250 (external link)
Not to make things more complicated, but read up on the Inverse-Square Law as it explains the relationship of light intensity vs. distance.

This right here will help explain to you why the inverse-square law makes sense.

Karl Taylor provides a good explanation.

In short, closer light = bigger apparent source and softer falloff of light.

Far light=smaller apparent source and more harsh/drastic/distinct​/hard falloff of light.

Far light in a small 24" box is like a focused beam vs a close 24" box that's like a flood light.

https://www.youtube.co​m/watch?v=373eg4BW-NM (external link)


www.vividemotionphotograph​y.comexternal link

  
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oldvultureface
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Post edited over 4 years ago by oldvultureface.
     
Jan 04, 2015 11:47 as a reply to  @ DisrupTer911's post |  #7

All else being equal, one has less fall-off at greater distances. Consider a light source at one meter. At two meters, two stops are lost.
With a light at eight meters, two stops are lost at sixteen meters. Fall-off is greater the nearer the light is to the subject.




  
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jeljohns
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Jan 04, 2015 12:03 |  #8

I have read about inverse square over and over.....and my brain just doesn't seem to get it. -?




  
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TerryMiller
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Jan 04, 2015 12:16 |  #9

jeljohns wrote in post #17365620 (external link)
I have read about inverse square over and over.....and my brain just doesn't seem to get it. -?

Zack did a pretty good job of explaining it. Start by putting your softbox 2 feet away from the subject, then 3, then 4, then 6 and watch the explanation again with your photos to look at.


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tsilva
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Jan 04, 2015 23:52 |  #10

jeljohns wrote in post #17365620 (external link)
I have read about inverse square over and over.....and my brain just doesn't seem to get it. -?

Start here -
http://blog.snapfactor​y.com/?p=1758 (external link)

Then take a look at the rest of the Mark Wallace videos -
http://blog.snapfactor​y.com/?page_id=2228 (external link)

And
http://blog.snapfactor​y.com/?page_id=2237 (external link)

Have fun




  
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Whortleberry
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Jan 05, 2015 06:10 |  #11

TerryMiller wrote in post #17365636 (external link)
Zack did a pretty good job of explaining it. Start by putting your softbox 2 feet away from the subject, then 3, then 4, then 6 and watch the explanation again with your photos to look at.

Better still, do the same thing but have your light at 2ft, 2.8ft (2'9½"), 4ft, 5.6ft (5'7¼"), 8ft, 11ft and even 16ft if you can manage.
Familiar numbers?
Yup.
Existe uma relação direta entre a distância, luz cair e abertura. ;-)a

A shadow is always positioned exactly on the extended line from light source through subject, on the side away from the light source.
The SIZE of the shadow is very little to do with the physical size of the light source but everything to do with the APPARENT size of the light. Stand facing a mirror with your hand out-stretched so it nearly touches the mirror. The hand appears MUCH bigger than your head. Now, without moving your feet, put your hand next to your head and it appears smaller than your head. All that has changed is the APPARENT size of the hand, controlled by relative distances.

Hence a large softbox will give you a smaller shadow than a small softbox would at the same distance. Conversely, if you had a very small light source really close to the subject, you could get a massive shadow.


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jeljohns
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Jan 06, 2015 14:00 as a reply to  @ TerryMiller's post |  #12

Great idea! Thanks!




  
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jeljohns
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Jan 06, 2015 14:25 as a reply to  @ tsilva's post |  #13

Awesome video for visual learners. Thanks!




  
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Wilt
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Jan 07, 2015 13:10 |  #14

Whortleberry wrote in post #17366945 (external link)
The SIZE of the shadow is very little to do with the physical size of the light source but everything to do with the APPARENT size of the light. Stand facing a mirror with your hand out-stretched so it nearly touches the mirror. The hand appears MUCH bigger than your head. Now, without moving your feet, put your hand next to your head and it appears smaller than your head. All that has changed is the APPARENT size of the hand, controlled by relative distances.

Hence a large softbox will give you a smaller shadow than a small softbox would at the same distance. Conversely, if you had a very small light source really close to the subject, you could get a massive shadow.

Much more important than the 'size' of shadow, are the characteristics of the shadow penumbra (or 'edge') ...a 'larger' (apparent size) of light source results in softer (or almost non-existent) edge to the shadow.

IMAGE: http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i63/wiltonw/Papercover.jpg
IMAGE: http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i63/wiltonw/10footsoftboxb.jpg

In addition, distance to source is a very important determinant to contrast of lighting, as demonstrated by these two photos

IMAGE: http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i63/wiltonw/Lightdistance-2.jpg
IMAGE: http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i63/wiltonw/Lightdistance-1.jpg

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travisvwright
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Post edited over 4 years ago by travisvwright.
     
Jan 07, 2015 13:18 |  #15

Intensities aside in this shot you can just raise the light (what I think mmmfotographie was saying). So the shadow doesn't hit the wall. It won't change the characteristic of light on the subject much (maybe more of a shadow under the jaw line but that shouldn't be a bad thing).


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shadows?
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