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Thread started 02 Mar 2015 (Monday) 05:16
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Smartphone cameras already better than low end DSLR's

 
es1
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Mar 02, 2015 05:16 |  #1

http://www.phonearena.​com …the-iPhone-6-Plus_id66093 (external link)

Check that out. Galaxy Note 4 and iPhone 6 Plus beat Canon 650D easily. Do you think DSLR's will become obsolete in the next few years? The evolution of smartphone cameras is just so fast which can also be seen on the DSLR sells which have gone down in big numbers.

I'm now seriously thinking about buying new smartphone with great camera and bring it with me to the vacations and trips instead of my 5D MKII. Smarthpone is just so much smaller, lighter and cheaper. They already have all manual settings and I heard RAW images are coming to android too. So whats left for DSLR's? Removable lenses?




  
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tzalman
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Mar 02, 2015 05:48 |  #2

Sure, use a phone if all you will do with images is to post them on Facebook or Instagram. But I regularly make 20x30 inch prints. For my 5D2's sensor (24x36 mm.) that is a 21X enlargement of the optical image delivered by a high resolution lens. For the iPhone 6 (4.8x6.1 mm.) it would be a 125X enlargement from a lesser quality lens' image as captured by tiny 1.5 micron sensels (as opposed to the 5D2's 6.4 micron sensels). Even if the lenses were equally great, resolving 100 lp/mm, the 5D2 will put 4.76 lp/mm on the paper (just below the 5 lp/mm resolution at which detail looks sharp at 18 inches) and the phone produces 0.8 lp/mm mush. No thanks.


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sapearl
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Mar 02, 2015 06:10 |  #3

tzalman wrote in post #17456446 (external link)
Sure, use a phone if all you will do with images is to post them on Facebook or Instagram. But I regularly make 20x30 inch prints. For my 5D2's sensor (24x36 mm.) that is a 21X enlargement of the optical image delivered by a high resolution lens. For the iPhone 6 (4.8x6.1 mm.) it would be a 125X enlargement from a lesser quality lens' image as captured by tiny 1.5 micron sensels (as opposed to the 5D2's 6.4 micron sensels). No thanks.

Elie makes a strong case here. I agree that smartphone camera capabilities have gotten quite good, and they're great if your primary goal is social media or a "record shot" of something. It's still hard to correct though for the deficiencies of those lenses. Unless Adobe or other vendors start making plug-ins or features for ACR that correct for the distortion features of the "xxmm Lens," I don't believe this is something that would cause serious photographers (fine art, exhibition, print making competitions, etc.) to ditch their dSLRs.


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sandpiper
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Mar 02, 2015 06:21 |  #4

No, they aren't better. As that article clearly described the DSLR being set to full auto and with the raw images being converted to jpeg with zero processing, all the parameters set to zero, so no sharpening, contrast or saturation. The phones were left with all their processing turned on (because it can't be turned off) so (surprise, surprise) their images were sharper and had more punch.

Looking at where they picked for the 100% crops, they are not where the DSLR would focus on full auto (all-points AF) and with the shallower DOF, and zero sharpening, of course the crops looked soft. Why not use a crop from where the camera actually focused. Of course, this is from a phone oriented website, so they are probably looking to make the DSLR look like a poor comparison, so chose to use it in such a way.

Here's a thought, try that test again but unhobble the DSLR by allowing it to at least use a decent picture style which will add the same sharpness etc., that the phones were allowed to use. Better yet, let's process the images in a decent raw editor and make them into big prints and stick those on the wall for the comparison.

Of course phones can beat a DSLR when you hobble it like that, and yes they can take quite good images, but I am not about to use one for serious photography any time soon.

So, no, I don't see the smartphone making DSLRs obsolete any time soon. Apart from any IQ matters, the smartphone can only take good pictures within its very narrow limits. They are crap at high ISO, they can't shoot for shallow DOF, I can't even imagine trying to do birds in flight with one, or trying for slow shutter speed panning shots at a race meeting.

Sure, I use my smartphone for family snapshots to pass around and stick on facebook, that is what they are good at. Anything else though and the DSLRs have them beaten by a very large margin.




  
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es1
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Post edited over 4 years ago by es1.
     
Mar 02, 2015 06:37 |  #5

Sure it will be a long time before real professionals sell their DSLR gear, if that ever even happens, but for casual DSLR users who will not end up making large prints of their work on daily basis, smartphones are starting to be the better option.

I just checked some guys pics on flickr taken with Galaxy Note 4 and they are at least on bar with the average pictures you see on this site. Few examples:

https://www.flickr.com …/in/set-72157650491055652 (external link)
https://www.flickr.com …/in/set-72157650491055652 (external link)
https://www.flickr.com …/in/set-72157650491055652 (external link)
https://www.flickr.com …/in/set-72157650491055652 (external link)
https://www.flickr.com …/in/set-72157650491055652 (external link)
https://www.flickr.com …/in/set-72157650491055652 (external link)
https://www.flickr.com …/in/set-72157650491055652 (external link)




  
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iowajim
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Mar 02, 2015 06:41 |  #6

sandpiper wrote in post #17456472 (external link)
No, they aren't better. As that article clearly described the DSLR being set to full auto and with the raw images being converted to jpeg with zero processing, all the parameters set to zero, so no sharpening, contrast or saturation. The phones were left with all their processing turned on (because it can't be turned off) so (surprise, surprise) their images were sharper and had more punch.

Looking at where they picked for the 100% crops, they are not where the DSLR would focus on full auto (all-points AF) and with the shallower DOF, and zero sharpening, of course the crops looked soft. Why not use a crop from where the camera actually focused. Of course, this is from a phone oriented website, so they are probably looking to make the DSLR look like a poor comparison, so chose to use it in such a way.

Here's a thought, try that test again but unhobble the DSLR by allowing it to at least use a decent picture style which will add the same sharpness etc., that the phones were allowed to use. Better yet, let's process the images in a decent raw editor and make them into big prints and stick those on the wall for the comparison.

Of course phones can beat a DSLR when you hobble it like that, and yes they can take quite good images, but I am not about to use one for serious photography any time soon.

So, no, I don't see the smartphone making DSLRs obsolete any time soon. Apart from any IQ matters, the smartphone can only take good pictures within its very narrow limits. They are crap at high ISO, they can't shoot for shallow DOF, I can't even imagine trying to do birds in flight with one, or trying for slow shutter speed panning shots at a race meeting.

Sure, I use my smartphone for family snapshots to pass around and stick on facebook, that is what they are good at. Anything else though and the DSLRs have them beaten by a very large margin.

+1

I don't use my cell phone camera unless it's all I have at the moment, but there's a stark difference between a dslr and a cell phone. I wonder why they compared a cell phone image, which is highly edited/compacted by internal algorithms, to a dslr image with those abilities negated. Probably because they wouldn't have an article at that point. Still, it speaks well to the ability of the humble cell phone camera - but it's evolution is limited to what they can do with the micro sensor and what a casual user is willing to pay.


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Tom ­ Reichner
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Mar 02, 2015 07:27 |  #7

I shoot the vast majority of my images between 400mm and 800mm.......and for many of my shots I want shallow depth of field, with the background blurred out almost entirely. . And I also want to be able to achieve focus on a quickly moving target and track with the subject, keeping it locked in focus all the while.

These shooting techniques are not exclusive to professionals - a whole bunch of casual & hobbyist bird and wildlife photographers, as well as all of those soccer parents who shoot their kids in action at full speed, use and want the same things. . How the heck are you supposed to shoot like that with a cell phone?


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RDKirk
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Mar 02, 2015 07:32 |  #8

es1 wrote in post #17456422 (external link)
http://www.phonearena.​com …the-iPhone-6-Plus_id66093 (external link)

Check that out. Galaxy Note 4 and iPhone 6 Plus beat Canon 650D easily. Do you think DSLR's will become obsolete in the next few years? The evolution of smartphone cameras is just so fast which can also be seen on the DSLR sells which have gone down in big numbers.

I'm now seriously thinking about buying new smartphone with great camera and bring it with me to the vacations and trips instead of my 5D MKII. Smarthpone is just so much smaller, lighter and cheaper. They already have all manual settings and I heard RAW images are coming to android too. So whats left for DSLR's? Removable lenses?

It doesn't sound like you're using your 5D3 to its best advantage.

Kind of like when people were predicting the end of PCs and then laptops to tablets...then Lo! Behold! laptops and PCs began a resurgeants when people discovered what they couldn't do on tablets.




  
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Mar 02, 2015 07:35 |  #9

Still waiting for them to post their comparison when tracking a moving subject, and shooting multi frames a second.


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RDKirk
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Mar 02, 2015 07:35 |  #10

es1 wrote in post #17456485 (external link)
Sure it will be a long time before real professionals sell their DSLR gear, if that ever even happens, but for casual DSLR users who will not end up making large prints of their work on daily basis, smartphones are starting to be the better option.

They simply shouldn't have been using a DSLR in the first place--snapshot cameras were always their better option. "Causal" and "DSLR" never truly went together, any more than "casual" and "SLR" or "TLR" or "view" ever went together. Most people should have always been using Instamatics.




  
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Mar 02, 2015 07:57 |  #11

The better cell phone cameras have certainly cut into the point-and-shoot market. They'll probably hurt SLR sales too, for those who buy an SLR to get the "best" photos but don't have the skill or interest in using them to their full advantage, and who will be perfectly happy with their new smartphone results (except in marginal situations). It won't stop those who buy SLRs because it makes them look like a pro. Or gear heads. Or those who actually know how to use them.


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RMH
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Mar 02, 2015 08:13 |  #12

DSLRs have been massively over-sold to the masses. It's not surprising that there's now a rebound going on, now phones takes photos that are 'good enough'. I think the iPhone 4 was probably the first serious contender, so this is now a galaxy 4 note issue; it's been going on a few years now.

The vast majority of people don't need a DSLR and don't know how to get the most out of one (and why should they -- what 'normal' person wants to have to learn to process RAWs??) , but Canon and Nikon have done a good job of putting a DSLR in the hands of just about every tourist and parent in the developed world. Well done to them, but it was only a matter of time before people started to wonder why they were bothering carrying such a huge, uncomfortable lump to get photos not much better than their phone at 10x the hassle.

My mother ditched her DLSR a few years back in favour of a P&S.

I bought an SL1 as a family camera - for me to use at the weekends when I'm too lazy to carry the 5D3 and for my wife to use during the week. She just can't get her head around how to use it and uses her iPhone instead.



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es1
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Mar 02, 2015 08:23 |  #13

IMAGE: http://i.imgur.com/qDyB2tF.png



  
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DGStinner
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Mar 02, 2015 08:38 |  #14

I don't think DSLRs will become obsolete for a long time, and certainly not at the hands of smartphones (unless someone were to design a mirrorless shell that you slide your phone into and use as the brains of the camera). Interchangeable lenses, full manual settings and raw file formats are where DSLRs/Mirrorless cameras beat out smartphones.


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es1
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Post edited over 4 years ago by es1.
     
Mar 02, 2015 08:42 |  #15

DGStinner wrote in post #17456622 (external link)
I don't think DSLRs will become obsolete for a long time, and certainly not at the hands of smartphones (unless someone were to design a mirrorless shell that you slide your phone into and use as the brains of the camera). Interchangeable lenses, full manual settings and raw file formats are where DSLRs/Mirrorless cameras beat out smartphones.

Lollipop update gave RAW images to Android phones. Also full manual control is now on most good smartphones. So interchangeable lenses are basicly the only missing thing.




  
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Smartphone cameras already better than low end DSLR's
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