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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 05 Jun 2015 (Friday) 12:21
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Thinking of upgrading to the Canon 5dsR, however...

 
Patbil10
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Jun 05, 2015 12:21 |  #1

Hi guys, I'm very interested in getting this 5dsR, however I'm a little scared. Here are some quick questions for those who are experienced with high MP bodies such as the D800/810. (if there are any since this is mostly Canon users here...:-) )

Is mirror movement going to be an issue ? (I know about the electronic motor on this one) Will I have to significantly up the shutter speeds above what I normally do to avoid pixel level blur when shooting a moving subject such as a kid ? Can I pick it up and start using the same way I use my 5D3 ?

Here's what I shoot the most: my kids, a few weddings, street photography and travel

To sum it up, I'm afraid that with that kind of pixel density will somehow make the camera difficult to use without a tripod...

Thanks


Canon 5D Mark IV, Canon EOS M5, Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II,Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II,Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 macro, Sigma 35mm Art, Tamron SP 85mm f/1.8, EF-M 22mm f/2, Canon ef-m 15-45, Rokinon 14mm f2.8 and other stuff...

  
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MalVeauX
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Jun 05, 2015 12:28 |  #2

Heya,

I think you're stressing a pixel peepers perspective on something you probably won't notice. I seriously doubt you'll have to shoot at 1/2000s all day to avoid "pixel level blur."

Do you need the higher resolution compared to your 5D3/6D? You know it's not even as good ISO wise (high & low), and doesn't have improved dynamic range? It seems to honestly behave mostly like a 5D2 with twice the resolution. Just a thought.

Very best,


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gjl711
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Jun 05, 2015 12:28 |  #3

Patbil10 wrote in post #17585371 (external link)
...
To sum it up, I'm afraid that with that kind of pixel density will somehow make the camera difficult to use without a tripod...

Thanks

Keep in mind that the new 5Ds has lower pixel density and all of the new crop cameras out there. If this is not a problem for the crop cameras, it should not be a problem with the 5D as well.


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Patbil10
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Jun 05, 2015 12:33 |  #4

gjl711 wrote in post #17585387 (external link)
Keep in mind that the new 5Ds has lower pixel density and all of the new crop cameras out there. If this is not a problem for the crop cameras, it should not be a problem with the 5D as well.

Hummm not according to this:

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Ca​non-EOS-5Ds.aspx (external link)


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Patbil10
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Jun 05, 2015 12:36 |  #5

MalVeauX wrote in post #17585386 (external link)
Heya,

I think you're stressing a pixel peepers perspective on something you probably won't notice. I seriously doubt you'll have to shoot at 1/2000s all day to avoid "pixel level blur."

Do you need the higher resolution compared to your 5D3/6D? You know it's not even as good ISO wise (high & low), and doesn't have improved dynamic range? It seems to honestly behave mostly like a 5D2 with twice the resolution. Just a thought.

Very best,

I like the idea of cropping without losing quality. The plan is to sell the 5D3 and keep the 6D for low light stuff...


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MalVeauX
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Jun 05, 2015 12:45 |  #6

Patbil10 wrote in post #17585394 (external link)
I like the idea of cropping without losing quality. The plan is to sell the 5D3 and keep the 6D for low light stuff...

Heya,

Gotcha.

Though there is a limit to how much you can crop before you are losing quality. But I get your point.

I don't think you should worry about the pixel blur. It's not going to be there. Look at sample images in the real world out there. That's what you'll be doing. Not lab situations and measurements. If you want a high resolution camera for better cropping options, with a pixel density similar to that of today's APS-C to stress the lens resolution, then the 5DsR is probably good for you for now. Personally I would wait for the revision, with better ISO/dynamic range.

Very best,


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Jun 05, 2015 12:46 |  #7

Pixel count does not equal pixel density.

http://www.robsphotogr​aphy.co.nz …-7DII-vs-Canon-5DIII.html (external link)

Pixel density (in megapixels per square centimetre)

Pixel density in megapixels per square centimetre = number of megapixels on the sensor divided by sensor area in square centimetres

7DII = 6.0119 (20.2 / 3.36)
5DIII = 2.5810 (22.3 / 8.64)
5ds = 5.821 (50.3/8.64)


5ds image size in in 1.6x crop mode- 5424 x 3616
7dii image size: 5472 x 3648




  
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Patbil10
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Jun 05, 2015 12:53 as a reply to  @ Qlayer2's post |  #8

Ok, perhaps I'm not fully understanding...here's a quote from the review done by "The-digital-picture":

"Nothing comes close to the 5Ds' resolution. Also notable is that, for the first time (ever?), a full frame Canon EOS DSLR has a pixel density nearly as high as or higher than the highest resolution APS-C sensors. With a pixel pitch that essentially matches the EOS sensor densities found in the 70D and 7D Mark II, the 5Ds effectively erases the "reach" advantage formerly always held by APS-C DSLRs."


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Qlayer2
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Jun 05, 2015 12:59 |  #9

Patbil10 wrote in post #17585416 (external link)
Ok, perhaps I'm not fully understanding...here's a quote from the review done by "The-digital-picture":

"Nothing comes close to the 5Ds' resolution. Also notable is that, for the first time (ever?), a full frame Canon EOS DSLR has a pixel density nearly as high as or higher than the highest resolution APS-C sensors. With a pixel pitch that essentially matches the EOS sensor densities found in the 70D and 7D Mark II, the 5Ds effectively erases the "reach" advantage formerly always held by APS-C DSLRs."

They are saying you can take a 50mp image with the 5ds and a 200mm lens from the same spot as using a crop camera with the same lens, and crop away all the wasted pixels (the wider field of view)- and still have the same number of "pixels on target" as the 7dii or 70d with the same lens.

Imagine shooting a small flying bird on a featureless blue sky- the more pixels on target you have, the more detail you can resolve.




  
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MalVeauX
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Post edited over 4 years ago by MalVeauX.
     
Jun 05, 2015 13:36 |  #10

Heya,

Size of pixel also matters.

There's a reason the highest ISO & dynamic range cameras from Sony/Nikon/Canon are lower resolution.

And of course, obvious examples of why medium format does so well with dynamic range even with high resolution (not so much ISO but it's less needed with the size of those pixels).

Very best,


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Scatterbrained
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Jun 05, 2015 14:03 |  #11

Qlayer2 wrote in post #17585402 (external link)
Pixel count does not equal pixel density.

http://www.robsphotogr​aphy.co.nz …-7DII-vs-Canon-5DIII.html (external link)

Pixel density (in megapixels per square centimetre)

Pixel density in megapixels per square centimetre = number of megapixels on the sensor divided by sensor area in square centimetres

7DII = 6.0119 (20.2 / 3.36)
5DIII = 2.5810 (22.3 / 8.64)
5ds = 5.821 (50.3/8.64)


5ds image size in in 1.6x crop mode- 5424 x 3616
7dii image size: 5472 x 3648

I don't think anyone was saying that. Take a look at the chart published by TDP, it shows the size of the pixels on each sensor. Assuming that Canon is using the similar technology on all of the current sensors, you can infer that sensors with smaller pixels are more dense. The 5Ds/r and the 70D and the 7DII are all three very close (4.14 vs 4.1). That is still larger than the 24mp APSC sensors like the Nikon D7200 which has a 3.92 mictrometers. All of which is to say that if you're fine with a 20 to 24mp APS-C sensor you should be fine with the 5Ds/r. ;)


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Jun 05, 2015 14:03 |  #12

i think this should help you https://www.youtube.co​m/watch?v=kETfrXIxlqk (external link) and remember this is coming from a nikon guy.


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Jun 05, 2015 18:01 |  #13
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Patbil10 wrote in post #17585416 (external link)
Ok, perhaps I'm not fully understanding...here's a quote from the review done by "The-digital-picture":

"Nothing comes close to the 5Ds' resolution. Also notable is that, for the first time (ever?), a full frame Canon EOS DSLR has a pixel density nearly as high as or higher than the highest resolution APS-C sensors. With a pixel pitch that essentially matches the EOS sensor densities found in the 70D and 7D Mark II, the 5Ds effectively erases the "reach" advantage formerly always held by APS-C DSLRs."

It also erases the full-frame high-ISO advantage. Like everything else in photography, there is a compromise somewhere. We each pick our own poison.


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Jun 06, 2015 08:23 |  #14

GeoKras1989 wrote in post #17585766 (external link)
It also erases the full-frame high-ISO advantage. Like everything else in photography, there is a compromise somewhere. We each pick our own poison.


Total image noise is NOT determined by senel size, but by total sensor area. For images reproduced to the same size, from the same amount of sensor area, the noise will be pretty much constant regardless of senel size, assuming that the same sensor technology is in use. Conversely the "same" image from a larger area of sensor will still have less noise, even if the sensel size remains constant between the different sized sensors. The only time larger sensels (everything else being equal) are better is when you look at single sensels, as at that point they win the "size" battle. I have to say that I never look at single pixels (or the data from a single sensel) but at groups of pixels forming an image, so larger sensor size will always produce less noise for the thing that we are ultimately interested in; The Image! (all other things being equal)

Alan


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