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Thread started 04 Jul 2015 (Saturday) 07:51
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bumpintheroad
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Jul 07, 2015 00:02 |  #16

-dave-m- wrote in post #17622984 (external link)
M.2 SATA drives were mainly meant for laptops and ultrabook type applications due to the size. Also make for a tidy build in PC cases, eliminate cables and drive cages can be removed. I have a HyperX Predator PCIe drive in my new laptop. I also tried one of my 840 Evo's just to compare, boot time is marginally faster on the Predator, other than that I really don't notice any performance gain.

In my opinion for most normal PC use any decent SSD will do just fine.

The ask was for a video editing workstation not a normal PC. Then things sort of devolved from there. But you observed faster boot time using M.2. Considering the boot process typically lasts a few minutes at most while a HD video render can take up to 30 minutes, that "marginal" performance improvement can result in real dollars worth of time.


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tim
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Jul 07, 2015 03:31 |  #17

bumpintheroad wrote in post #17623233 (external link)
There's no real performance benefit to partitioning IMHO. Defrag and consolidate free space, but don't do so unnecessarily on SSD because it will affect the theoretical life expectancy.

My point wasn't for performance, it will probably reduce performance if anything. The point was for creating operating system images without a lot of crap in them.


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Luckless
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Jul 07, 2015 07:40 as a reply to  @ post 17623251 |  #18

Bumpintheroad, you should also keep in mind that the original post also said "started doing video editing", and quoted a $600-1000 budget.

On a daily basis, well, nightly basis as it isn't actually my day job, I get to deal with actual super computers. Current system we have on the project is a 5k node cluster worth just under a million USD, however my home system that I'm still using is worth maybe $600 or so, and handles light video editing without too much pain. I do however go make myself a sandwich and use my laptop to watch Netflix if I'm exporting something that isn't completely trivial. It also doesn't even have an SSD in it at all currently because I stole them from that for another project planning to buy myself larger capacity drives, and then settled for what I had there for more than a year.

Building a computer system is all about compromising and selecting parts that will be "good enough", where "good enough" is a sliding scale based on actual processing demands and the reality of a person's budget. This can mean going with the $90 mother board on a system and accepting that it isn't going to see over clocking or more than one graphics card rather than the $300 motherboard with all the extra cool bells and whistles.

I would generally argue for putting together a decent but modest system, especially for business needs, but one which is flexible enough in design that you can upgrade it later with things like additional SSDs or a far beefier graphics card at a later point if you find the current options are giving too much of a bottle neck to meet your computational needs.


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-dave-m-
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Jul 07, 2015 08:46 |  #19

bumpintheroad wrote in post #17623262 (external link)
The ask was for a video editing workstation not a normal PC. Then things sort of devolved from there. But you observed faster boot time using M.2. Considering the boot process typically lasts a few minutes at most while a HD video render can take up to 30 minutes, that "marginal" performance improvement can result in real dollars worth of time.

My boot time is in the area of 10 seconds from power off and near instant for wake from sleep, not minutes. And I am talking marginal, average was just less than 1 second faster from off and not a meaningful difference on wake from sleep. Considering the 240GB Predator was $315 vs $250(Canadian) for a 500GB 850 Evo it is not a cost effective purchase in most builds. If we are talking a professional video editing rig I would be looking at Enterprise Class Drives on a dedicated RAID controller for performance and reliability(including SSD), not new to the market high performance drives.


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tim
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Jul 07, 2015 14:25 |  #20

Luckless wrote in post #17623502 (external link)
Building a computer system is all about compromising and selecting parts that will be "good enough", where "good enough" is a sliding scale based on actual processing demands and the reality of a person's budget. This can mean going with the $90 mother board on a system and accepting that it isn't going to see over clocking or more than one graphics card rather than the $300 motherboard with all the extra cool bells and whistles.

I had to get a replacement motherboard for my 2700K, I ended up with a $75 Gigabyte board (external link) - it works great!

Working with big clusters would be pretty interesting, I'd love to do that.


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Luckless
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Jul 07, 2015 15:16 |  #21

Last board I bought for myself was a $150ish unit from about 4 years ago. I went with that over one about half the price because it provided more reliable support for overclocking than the cheaper models that were in stock at the time. The plan at the time was to order a new cooling solution later that fall rather than spending even more at the time, but I paid extra for the better motherboard and a K i5 that what I could have gone with, and I've still yet to bother getting around to upgrading from the stock cooler and overclocking it. And now it has gotten to the point where I'm left debating if I should spend a bit on the better cooler and upgrade, or wait till the spring and build a whole new rig.


And honestly, working with the huge clusters was interesting for the first while, and then they rather quickly felt like just another computer and I don't really think about it too much. Sure, it does things in a minute or two that would bring your average desktop to its knees for months, if not decades, but for the most part the giddy feeling of how much computing power it was kind of faded... And was replaced with a desire for access to far more cores so we could do even more work faster. GAS isn't just a photographer's thing, it also very much affect scientists as well.


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tim
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Jul 07, 2015 15:25 |  #22

Luckless wrote in post #17623889 (external link)
Last board I bought for myself was a $150ish unit from about 4 years ago. I went with that over one about half the price because it provided more reliable support for overclocking than the cheaper models that were in stock at the time. The plan at the time was to order a new cooling solution later that fall rather than spending even more at the time, but I paid extra for the better motherboard and a K i5 that what I could have gone with, and I've still yet to bother getting around to upgrading from the stock cooler and overclocking it. And now it has gotten to the point where I'm left debating if I should spend a bit on the better cooler and upgrade, or wait till the spring and build a whole new rig.


And honestly, working with the huge clusters was interesting for the first while, and then they rather quickly felt like just another computer and I don't really think about it too much. Sure, it does things in a minute or two that would bring your average desktop to its knees for months, if not decades, but for the most part the giddy feeling of how much computing power it was kind of faded... And was replaced with a desire for access to far more cores so we could do even more work faster. GAS isn't just a photographer's thing, it also very much affect scientists as well.

These days anyone can have a 150,000 core teraflop (external link) computer!


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unlimited6986
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Jul 10, 2015 09:32 |  #23

I'm mostly using it for photo work. The video end is just something every once in awhile. There only highlight videos too. Longest video probably 10-30 mins. But again it's only once in awhile. Not really trying to drop a couple thousand right now on the computer. Trying to stay around that 600-1k price range.




  
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Luckless
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Jul 10, 2015 09:39 |  #24

If the video processing is just a minor sideline task that is rarely done and you're not doing anything all that complex for post processing, then just focus on putting together a rig that is decent for your photo editing, and go with it. One of my friends has a youtube channel, and he is using a raspberry pi for his video editing for a youtube channel. Sure, he is up to three or four of the things now as it can take a day or two to actually run all the processing on some of his larger stuff, but not like adding more Pi units is hard on the pocket book. (It is however a rather ridiculous platform for the task, he does it more because he can, not because it is a good idea.)

Just get a case that has room to add different drives and expansion cards as you go. If you find you need more SSDs for your work, then you can add them in later down the road as the price drops.


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bumpintheroad
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Jul 10, 2015 10:34 |  #25

unlimited6986 wrote in post #17626871 (external link)
I'm mostly using it for photo work. The video end is just something every once in awhile. There only highlight videos too. Longest video probably 10-30 mins. But again it's only once in awhile. Not really trying to drop a couple thousand right now on the computer. Trying to stay around that 600-1k price range.

Then look around for an i7 or even i5 tower from Costco or Best Buy with an i7 or even i5; there's plenty in the $650-$800 zone. Add an SSD for under $100 and bump it up to at least 16GB RAM if it doesn't come that way. If you have any money left over put in a GTX-750 to get some fast graphics cores.


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unlimited6986
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Jul 12, 2015 13:29 |  #26

this is a computer at best buy.

http://www.bestbuy.com …19350937522&sku​Id=8584021 (external link)


I also went on pc part and put together something. How does this look? Should I change anything or lessen anything to make it cheaper? Thanks

https://pcpartpicker.c​om …ed6986/saved/#v​iew=qZb6Mp (external link)




  
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tim
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Jul 12, 2015 15:43 |  #27

unlimited6986 wrote in post #17628994 (external link)
this is a computer at best buy.

http://www.bestbuy.com …19350937522&sku​Id=8584021 (external link)


I also went on pc part and put together something. How does this look? Should I change anything or lessen anything to make it cheaper? Thanks

https://pcpartpicker.c​om …ed6986/saved/#v​iew=qZb6Mp (external link)

I'm impressed with the 12 ethernet ports on the HP, though I suspect it's an error. I wonder how many SATA ports it uses - I use all six on my motherboard.

Your PC has better specs, though I would go for a cheaper nVidia video card unless you're doing video (720 is fine, integrated is probably fine), and Samsung 850 evo/pro (external link) is probably a better SSD.


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unlimited6986
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Jul 12, 2015 18:22 |  #28

Is 120gb ssd big enough for what I need? OS LIGHTROOM PS etc




  
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-dave-m-
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Jul 12, 2015 19:22 |  #29

unlimited6986 wrote in post #17629287 (external link)
Is 120gb ssd big enough for what I need? OS LIGHTROOM PS etc

Most likely yes, as long as you do not have many other appliations, etc. Personally I would go with and recommend the 240-250 class drives, they are cheaper per gigabyte and are faster than the 100-120 class drives. For instance an Evo 250 is only 24 dollars more than the SSD you have in your build.


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bumpintheroad
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Jul 12, 2015 19:28 as a reply to  @ unlimited6986's post |  #30

The HP system has the benefit of coming pre-assembled and with some level of manufacturer support (as minimal as that might be with HP). 12GB is an odd amount of RAM, particularly in a motherboard that has only two DIMM slots. Usually you want matching DIMM's in each slot for higher performance, and this would be something to consider upgrading at a later date. The system has a 460W PSU and so should be able to support an add-on graphics card such as the GTX-750Ti. Overall it's not a bad system for the price and it has upgrade potential down the road. Here's the full specs from HP: http://support.hp.com/​us-en/document/c04453446 (external link)


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